http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ en Wed, 19 Jun 2013 06:47:42 +0000 http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168970 Tue, 23 Nov 2010 01:37:07 +0000 Mother in Israel 168970@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Oomis, I'm with you on that one. After what I experienced, I don't plan on flying again for a long, long time. I travel a lot for work, but I'm going to start using other methods of transportation, even if that means spending many hours on the road. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168822 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 18:22:41 +0000 charlie brown 168822@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>yes we live in desperate times, i agree 100%. I just don't believe that TSA's scanners and new pat downs are the answer to the desperate times. As far as I've heard, the pat downs are only for opt-outs of the scanners but in airports which don't have the scanners yet there are no patdowns either. If they are so necessary for security, then why aren't they done in those airports too? It would seem the only purpose of the new pat down is to get people to go thru the scanners.</p> <p>The real solution is to profile and then thoroughly frisk those who are deemed high risk, not to just randomly frisk 20% of the people and then there is an 80% chance that the terrorist won't be the one who is randomly selected. But of course profiling will never fly here. oh well. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168792 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 17:37:57 +0000 oomis 168792@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>And we DO live in desperate times. The physical frisking seems to be more necessary and accurate than the scanners, based on what you wrote about the Israeli guy who said he could pack plastic explosives and they would never know. If that is so, physical close frisking would seem to be necessary.</p> <p>I for one, am not travelling anywhere any time soon. If enough people were to stop flying, btw, a) the pricing would come down and b) they would have to find another way to accomplish this end. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168697 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 14:11:38 +0000 bh18 168697@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>they'll have fun with me! i have to take my three year old-still in diapers-to a specialist in Cincinnati. when i go through metal detectors i beep due to wires in my jaw bones that were put in during jaw reconstructive surgery years ago. so, they'll have to check for bombs in my mouth and what will they look for in my over three year old's diaper? if he's still wearing diapers it must be to hide something! also, i carry water to change his diapers, not wipes. ooh...the water must be to make a bomb while in the plane!!! </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168667 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 12:35:49 +0000 Mother in Israel 168667@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>SMS, it wasn't my stomach they were after. I don't know how to write this in a way the mods will let it go, so let's just say they were looking elsewhere. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168665 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 12:34:04 +0000 charlie brown 168665@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>oomis,<br /> people were only doing their job. Molesting children is wrong and doing your job is not much of an excuse. Did you see that video on the YWN homepage of the TSA agent molesting a young boy? I would never take my kids on a plane until the situation changes.</p> <p>also, its not desperate times that call for these desperate measures. its corrupt politics that called for these desperate measures. The head of El Al security said he could go thru these scanners with enough explosives to bring down a 747. Israel doesn't use them because they can't find many of the plastic explosives that terrorists are likely to try to use. But Chertoff, the former head of homeleand security, is making millions on them as the lobbyist for the company that the TSA is buying them from. I wonder if any kickbacks have made their way to the current heads of homeleand security.</p> <p><strong>EDITED</strong> </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168654 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 12:09:08 +0000 oomis 168654@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Don't shoot the messengers. The TSA agents are doing their job, a job that has annoyingly, and frustratingly become necessary because of all the lunatics out there. Have you forgotten the pregnant Irish woman whose muslim boyfriend put a bomb in her luggage? He had absolutely NO concern for the life of the woman he professed to love, much less his OWN unborn child. Desperate times call for desperate measures. I am sickened by this whole thing, but it is what it is. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168647 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 11:59:32 +0000 sms007 168647@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Anyone wonder if the TSA agents themselves get the pat down? Who said THEY'RE not the ones with the bombs?! </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168645 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 11:57:38 +0000 sms007 168645@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>mother in israel- they really did that to you??????? what do they think your baby is a bomb?! This is crazy! I wish i had the guts to tell one of those tsa agents off.... Let see them take off thier shirt for some stranger. Mother in Israel, you shoulda said well, I'm warning you... I'm very prone to throwing up and I'm feeling super nauseous right now lol </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168616 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 10:58:44 +0000 charlie brown 168616@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p><em>Let me know how many donuts I need to bake... er, fry. Only one of you needs baked donuts, right?<br /> -squeak<br /> </em><br /> ROTFLMKO! </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168611 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 10:53:09 +0000 Mother in Israel 168611@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>I flew recently and did not go through the scanner because I'm expecting and was afraid of harm to the fetus. I did consent to a pat down and it was a lot worse than I had expected. To be fair, they did warn me before they touched me in places that might make me uncomfortable, but I still found it degrading, especially because they took me into a private room in the middle and made me take off my shirt. You would have thought I was a Muslim with wires coming out of me, not a frum woman pushing a toddler in a baby stroller. My face was burning by the time I ran out of that room. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168605 Mon, 22 Nov 2010 10:30:20 +0000 noitallmr 168605@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Personally I think everyone needs to take a chill about these "invasive and intrusive body-scans". People- face the facts were all human beings and we all are basically identical so besides for the problems of tznius I don't see why people are kicking up such a big fuss at having their photo taken- especially men who go to public Mikvaos. Pat downs I can imagine are pretty uncomfortable so just go for the scanner its over in a sec and just take a chill!!!!</p> <p>Now regarding Tznius, I honestly don't think there's any problem at all with someone looking at these chalk like images with the main features blurred...and even if they can see something, the whole thing is for safety and might even go into Sakonos Nafoshos, and if a doctor can check you- these people certainly can!!!</p> <p>This is just my 2 cents and I really think it makes sense (ouch- very corny pun!!! Not intended ;) </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168485 Sun, 21 Nov 2010 21:06:23 +0000 sms007 168485@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>tunebeigel, it can easily be switched to a color picture with photo shop. and they see the whole body. you can even see a picture of it on tsa's website </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168467 Sun, 21 Nov 2010 20:05:29 +0000 Dave Hirsch 168467@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p><strong>DELETED BY MODERATOR</strong> </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168388 Sun, 21 Nov 2010 16:21:26 +0000 Homeowner 168388@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Council Member Greenfield, who represents Borough Park, has written an article in today's New York Post that may be of interest to YWN readers:</p> <p><strong>Grope-a-dopes: Support a New York law to ban invasive searches</strong><br /> By DAVID G. GREENFIELD</p> <p><a href="http://www.nypost.com/f/print/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/grope_dopes_support_new_york_law_CWpapXu9DIcPe21rRoknWK" rel="nofollow">http://www.nypost.com/f/print/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/grope_dopes_support_new_york_law_CWpapXu9DIcPe21rRoknWK</a> </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168344 Sun, 21 Nov 2010 13:16:31 +0000 tunabeigel123 168344@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>The systems blur faces, or they produce body images that look like chalk outlines. Amsterdam's airport is moving ahead with full-body scanners after trying new software that projects a stylized image rather than an actual picture onto a computer screen. It highlights the area of the body where objects are concealed in pockets or under the clothing.<br /> I really don't know why all you guys have such a problem with this, it doesn't take an actual picture of you. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168337 Sun, 21 Nov 2010 13:03:47 +0000 candy613 168337@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>I have flown twice in the past two weeks because of this new system, the second time i flew i was pulled out randomly to have a body screening. I happen to knw these screenings can cause issues because of the x-rays that they involve and i knw that for tznius reasons it is not appropriate to go through with a body scan especially as a female. I knew that they were accommodating for those who ask for a pat down so i asked for one and they were fine with that. a few weeks ago they changed the system of the pat downs. before they just patted your arms and lower legs and it is much more thorough now. they did tell me this before and told me exactly what the system was and exactly which parts of me they would touch. When i heard this i then asked to get it done privately and they agreed without hesitation. They even sent 2 ladies into the room with me instead of men without me even asking! Although the pat down is VERY thorough and stress the VERY it still was not that bad as ppl say it is and it definatly was better then the screening and i felt much better not doing it! And again the airports are extremely accommodating and there is no need to worry about asking for a pat down instead or for it done privately. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168293 Sun, 21 Nov 2010 04:42:39 +0000 whatrutalkingabt 168293@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Oomis- Yes but when you go to a DR its because you are trying to get the best care. Over here- you have another choice- you can do a female only pat down. My question is- on the chance that it is a man seeing your naked body, is it permissible to go thru the scanner or are you halachically required to opt for the pat down? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168218 Sat, 20 Nov 2010 21:49:39 +0000 oomis 168218@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Is it better for a girl to be seen "virtually naked" by a man or should she rather opt for the pat down as gross as it is?<br /> Is it allowed for frum women to go through the scanner?<br /> "</p> <p>Who says it will necessarily be a man doing the scanning? Maybe they have one for men and one for women. But in any case, women go to male doctors all the time (not my preference, but sometimes ya gotta do what ya gotta do), so if they can get into a mindset as this being for their health, just like a visit to the doctor, perhaps that will make the scanning requirement easier to accept. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168142 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 14:18:28 +0000 squeak 168142@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Well, when they arrive, we will have a Chanuka party. Let me know how many donuts I need to bake... er, fry. Only one of you needs baked donuts, right? You bring my chocolate bar. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168141 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 14:17:04 +0000 YW Moderator-80 168141@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p><em>How many demerits do I have to collect before I get the chocolate bar? </em></p> <p>i wouldnt be too flippant<br /> the MESS knows where you live</p> <p>(Moderation Enforcement and Sanction Squad) </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168138 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 14:15:38 +0000 YW Moderator-80 168138@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p><em>imitation is a form of flattery.</em></p> <p>well thats true but not the issue here<br /> this is a highly serious and critical occupation<br /> you understand the danger of impersonating a police officer or fbi agent?<br /> well thats nothing compared to impersonating a moderator<br /> someday people will start taking moderation seriously<br /> until then we must be ever vigilant </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168136 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 14:14:07 +0000 popa_bar_abba 168136@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>No, he was impersonating a different moderator. 80 would have posted the video. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168130 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 14:06:34 +0000 squeak 168130@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>How many demerits do I have to collect before I get the chocolate bar? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168127 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 14:05:50 +0000 charlie brown 168127@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>squeak,<br /> most of the little voices in my head are telling me that it isn't me.</p> <p>80,<br /> imitation is a form of flattery. It should be a merit not a demerit! </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168125 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:57:09 +0000 YW Moderator-80 168125@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>impersonating a moderator?</p> <p>2 demerits </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168119 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:45:26 +0000 squeak 168119@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>seems that everything that happens is a sign to you to go back to lurking. Maybe it's you? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168117 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:42:55 +0000 charlie brown 168117@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>uh oh. I'm causing u to get in trouble with the mods. I better go back to lurking status. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports/page/2#post-168105 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:35:55 +0000 squeak 168105@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Here's the video of last time</p> <p><strong>LINK REMOVED BY MODERATOR</strong></p> <p>Seriously folks, nothing is happening until Sunday </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168082 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:18:58 +0000 charlie brown 168082@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>squeak,<br /> post you video here so YWN can get a drudge link again on Sunday. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168074 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:03:13 +0000 myfriend 168074@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>I think the reason squeal hasn't gotten back to us yet, is because security is still going through their <em>very</em> intrusive procedure, and squeak isn't taking it to well.</p> <p>No kilts next time. Too bad the girls don't have that option. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168073 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 13:03:06 +0000 squeak 168073@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>I guess the only way you will find out is to be at the airport at 6 am on Sunday, and wait for the ruckus. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168064 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 12:37:53 +0000 charlie brown 168064@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p><em>popa- you're right. You wouldn't want to be around when I go through security.<br /> -squeak</em></p> <p>Why? Do you wear a skirt? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168062 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 12:33:04 +0000 myfriend 168062@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>squeak: </p> <p>Go through security in a kilt, refuse the scanner, and let us know the results. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168050 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 12:17:28 +0000 squeak 168050@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>popa- you're right. You wouldn't want to be around when I go through security. </p> <p><em>the TSA in their wisdom seems to have decided that any female in a skirt is probably a terrorist</em></p> <p>So men in skirts are OK? I have Scottish friends who would like to know. They're afraid TSA can't tell a kilt from a skirt. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168037 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 11:57:59 +0000 blinky 168037@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>yes it is a catheter- and it has wires </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168036 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 11:57:06 +0000 YW Moderator-80 168036@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>are you sure its a catheter<br /> catheters dont have "a lot of wires" </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168032 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 11:53:48 +0000 blinky 168032@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Wolf- most people who have catheters dont really fly...But ill check into getting documents- thanks </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168024 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 11:45:52 +0000 WolfishMusings 168024@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p><em>Just curious, i know someone with a catheter that is flying soon, and he wants to know if the security will give him problems, because its a lot of wires</em></p> <p>I would be highly surprised if your friend is the first person the TSA has come across with a catheter. </p> <p>Nonetheless, I would imaging it couldn't hurt if he brought alone some documentation from his physician.</p> <p>The Wolf </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-168003 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 11:19:21 +0000 blinky 168003@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Just curious, i know someone with a catheter that is flying soon, and he wants to know if the security will give him problems, because its a lot of wires </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167999 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 11:16:53 +0000 myfriend 167999@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>The crazy thing is even if you go through the scanner they can insist you go through the intrusive hand pat-down afterwards, if they think they noticed something in the scanner.</p> <p>And you can't refuse the pat-down apparently, even if you decide you will cancel your flight they will insist you go through it just to LEAVE the airport. (That's what they advised the guy who took the recording a few days ago.) </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167996 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 11:12:45 +0000 popa_bar_abba 167996@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Yeah. You might want to find out if you can get some heter to wear pants. I don't know of one, but who knows. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167994 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 11:08:06 +0000 charlie brown 167994@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>attention frum women (and their husbands and fathers),<br /> the TSA in their wisdom seems to have decided that any female in a skirt is probably a terrorist and needs to go thru a pat down to make sure their skirt is not hiding any explosives.</p> <p>I kid you not.</p> <p>LINK: <a href="http://www.wzzm13.com/news/news_story.aspx?storyid=140233&amp;catid=14"> <a href="http://www.wzzm13.com/news/news_story.aspx?storyid=140233&amp;catid=14" rel="nofollow">http://www.wzzm13.com/news/news_story.aspx?storyid=140233&amp;catid=14</a> </a> </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167985 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 10:53:03 +0000 popa_bar_abba 167985@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>I am flying later in the morning. I hope you are through security by the time I get there. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167968 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 10:17:56 +0000 WolfishMusings 167968@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p><em>You can always take the bus.</em></p> <p>Not to Israel.</p> <p>The Wolf </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167954 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 10:01:38 +0000 squeak 167954@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>popa- me too. 6 am. See you there? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167895 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 00:08:54 +0000 ronrsr 167895@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>has anyone asked an LOR about this? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167891 Fri, 19 Nov 2010 00:03:29 +0000 charliehall 167891@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>I flew earlier today. No problems. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167873 Thu, 18 Nov 2010 23:07:53 +0000 HaLeiVi 167873@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>With Chanuka in mind, you are probably familiar with their law of having every Kalla being tried out first by an official. I'm sure they had some kind of logic then too. The realisation frightens and sickens me that you probably would have bought into that, too. Can't you tell when something went too far?</p> <p>I don't know what makes you so happy about the fact that a man will grope your little boys. As long as it's not your son's Rebbi? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/airports#post-167869 Thu, 18 Nov 2010 22:59:06 +0000 HaLeiVi 167869@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>This is a very unnecessary evil. First of all, some things are just off limits no matter if you have a good reason. Second, the burn himself bomber could have and should have been rejected with a system already in place. His bomb was pounced upon by those who couldn't wait for something that they can use to publicize it. Olam Golam falls for it. Third of all, which is my ever repeated point, there is no reason for a person to view any picture at all. A computer can very easilly follow the simple vector of the human form, and can spot a foreign object much more efficiently than a human. They want this because they are pigs. </p>