http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ en Fri, 24 Jul 2015 20:43:04 +0000 http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335411 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 18:47:07 +0000 sof davar 335411@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Fair enough.</p> <p>However, from my perspective, it would seem right to check that out before publicly criticizing those who devote their lives to giving a Torah education to children not yet fortunate enough to have one.</p> <p>One layman's unsolicited opinion. Take it for what it's worth.</p> <p>p.s. I thank you for an intelligent and respectful discussion. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335400 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 18:22:36 +0000 popa_bar_abba 335400@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>If I found out that they were asking appropriate rabbonim, then I couldn't criticize their decision, because I can't ask more of them than to ask appropriate rabbonim. </p> <p>I would still think it is not my hashkafa to do what they do. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335388 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 17:44:54 +0000 sof davar 335388@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>So, hypothetically speaking, if you were to find out that Kars 4 Kids had the approval of their rabbonim, would you retract your criticism? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335203 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 12:27:37 +0000 popa_bar_abba 335203@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>sof davar: The people who criticize are usually specifically criticizing the gedolim, to whom they impute all sorts of things. These issues aren't remotely related. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335200 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 12:22:02 +0000 apushatayid 335200@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Rav Chaim Mintz is the Founder, Director, Spiritual Leader and Advisor of Oorah according to their website, on oorah.org </p> <p>Does everything they do have his haskama, I have no idea. However, you can easily reach out to him and ask him. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335192 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 12:13:26 +0000 sof davar 335192@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Well, I can agree to your second point (the lack or relevance). However, would you then agree that if someone did not know of any Rabbonim who condone not going to the police, that it would be appropriate for them to criticize those who advocate that position? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335184 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 12:04:40 +0000 popa_bar_abba 335184@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>No.</p> <p>Or if it is, it certainly is not relevant to whether I trust gedolim or not. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335181 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 12:02:00 +0000 sof davar 335181@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Wouldn't it be incumbent on you to find that out before criticizing them in an open forum? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335166 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 11:43:18 +0000 popa_bar_abba 335166@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>I don't know that any rav approves what they do. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335159 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 11:23:00 +0000 sof davar 335159@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>My question was not based on either premise. When others critisized rabbonim, you indicated that it was inapropriate regardless of whether it was "their rav" or not. You also did not say that if one's rav agreed that a certain approach was incorrect, that it would then be OK to criticize the rabbonim who did take that approach. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335134 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 10:07:29 +0000 popa_bar_abba 335134@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>So this question has two premises which I do not concur in.</p> <p>Premise A. Oorah is run by people whom I consider rabbonim of mine that I need to be mevatel daas to. </p> <p>Premise B. That I have not discussed this with any of my rabbonim. </p> <p>Like it says in Atlas Shrugged: There are no contradictions. When you see an apparent contradiction, check your premises. </p> <p>Look, I think some of the things they do is a bit odd at best. I don't think it passuls the whole organization. I definitely don't think it is a good idea to go forward with a conversation about what they do. I do think they should have some frank discussions with their rabbinic advisers, and perhaps introduce a certain NY Post article and this video as exhibits. </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335133 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 10:05:57 +0000 HaKatan 335133@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>I didn't see either thread, nor do I know who's involved here, but, to try to answer your question, I would say that when Daas Torah (or anyone) does something wrong then you are not supposed to follow nor condone that.</p> <p>So I fail to see how you juxtapose his criticizing this organization for doing something wrong to either of the other points. If anyone does something that is clearly forbidden then they are not to be condoned. Which would explain why he criticized them, if you say he did. </p> <p>Why should it then follow that Daas Torah is not any more reliable in any and every other case? </p> http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/question-for-pba#post-335112 Mon, 19 Dec 2011 08:32:46 +0000 sof davar 335112@http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/ <p>Reading your posts lately, I have come across a conflict that I would like you to resolve.<br /> In the many threads about abuse and cover ups, you have made it clear that you believe that people should not act based on their own perception of the best course of action, but should rather be subservient to their rabbonim. Not only that, but when one sees a rav doing what the individual believes to be correct, it would be inappropriate to praise the rav and contrast it with what other rabbonim have done because that would be akin to a child praising one parent for giving more candy.<br /> However, in another thread you criticized a well established organization with many rabbonim for “ripping off goyim”. This criticism seems to be based on your perception of right and wrong without regard for what their rabbonim may say.<br /> Can you please clarify your position as to when one needs to be subservient to daas Torah and when one should use their own sense of right and wrong.<br /> Thank You </p>