A Sukkah’la lyrics

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  • #1368406

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    I heard that there is a new poster out this year with the lyrics for the classic A Sukkah’la.

    Does anyone know the authoritative words to the song?

    #1368489

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    א סוכה’לע א קליינע
    פון ברעטעלעך געמיינע
    האב איך מיר א סוכה’לע געמאכט
    צוגעדעקט דעם דאך
    מיט אן ביסעלע סכך
    זיץ איך מיר אין סוכה’לע באנאכט

    א וינט א קאלטין
    בלאזט דורך די שפאלטן
    און די ליכטעלעך
    זיי לעשן זיך פיל
    עס איז מיר א חידוש
    ווי איך מאך מיר קידוש
    און די ליכטעלעך זיי ברענען גאנץ שטיל

    צום ערשטן געריכט
    מיט א בלאסן געזיכט
    ברענגט מיר מיין טעכטערעל אריין
    זי שטעלט זיך אוועק
    און זאגט מיט שרעק
    טאטעלע די סוכה פאלט באלד איין

    זיי נישט קיין נער
    האב נישט קיין צער
    זאל דיר די סוכה ניט טאן באנג
    עס איז שוין גאר
    באלד צוויי טויזנט יאר
    און די סוכה’לע זי שטייט נאך גאנץ לאנג

    #1368562

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    What is the source of this version?

    #1368618

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    The back of the Rabbis’ Sons record called Hallelu.

    #1368819

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    Wow! You typed out the whole thing?

    #1369152

    CTLAWYER
    Participant

    @DY……….
    now I know we are contemporaries. Down in my basement are all those Rabbi’s Sons albums bought when I was a very new teenager

    #1369222

    Joseph
    Participant

    Never woulda thunk DY is in the grandpa age parsha…

    #1369403

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Wow! You typed out the whole thing?

    Yes, and fixed one typo. They actually sing it a bit differently than that.

    #1369536

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant
    #1369652

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    So now the question is – are the Rabbi’s Sons lyrics authoritative?
    I have heard many versions.
    Did you see the new poster?
    Do the lyrics match?

    #1369667

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    I saw it.

    They’re close, but not precise (and the spelling is quite different).

    The Rabbis’ Sons sing a couple of words as on the poster, differently than the lyrics on the record.

    #1369671

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    Does anyone know where I can find the REAL original song from Europe?
    I don’t think it was composed by the Rabbis Sons…

    #1369682

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    It was originally a poem by Avrom Reisen. There have been several versions in song.

    The ones I’ve heard are The Rabbis’ Sons, Yiddish Classics incomplete) and Eli Lipsker.

    Here is a different version of the lyrics (apparently from a record of a lady singing it. I haven’t heard it, but found this).

    #1369697

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    I found this. It might be the original poem:

    א סוכה מאת אברהם רייזען {1876-1953}

    אסוכה אקליינע,
    מיט ברעטער געמיינע
    האב איך קוים מיט צרות געמאכט:
    געדעקט דעם דאך
    מיט א ביסעלע סכך,
    און כ”זיץ אין איר סוכות ביי נאכטץ
    מיט פארזאגטן געזיכט
    דאס ערשטע געדיכט
    עס טראגט מיר מיין וויב באלד ארייןץ
    זי שטעלט זיך אוועק
    און זאגט מיט שרעק:
    דער ווינט ווארפט די סוכהבאלד איין
    פון ווינט דעם קאלטן,
    וואס בלאזט דורך די שפאלטן,
    מיין ליכטעלע לעשן זיך וויל,
    דאך מאך איך מיר קידוש
    און זעט נאר דעם חידוש,
    מיין ליכטל ברענט רויק און שטיל…
    כאטש דער זומער איילט שוין אונטער,
    שטייט שוין באלד פון יענער זייט.
    זע נאר יידיש יינגעלע טייערס,
    ס”אראגעסט עס קומען או:
    ראש השנה מיט א שופר
    שימחת תורה מיט א פאן.
    אלע געסט און אייביק נייע,
    תמידאנגעלעייגט און ווויל,זון און פרייד אין זייערע אויגן,
    זיסער שמייכל אויפן מויל

    #1369700

    Miriam377
    Participant

    Can someone post the english lyrics? All I remember was this:

    My succaleh was small
    not fancy at all
    but it was special and dear to me.
    some schach I threw over it hoping to cover it
    and there I’d sit and think.

    #1369821

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    Where did you find that original?
    It seems very different!

    #1369825

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    I googled the author’s name, and the word succah, in Hebrew, and it led me to an Israeli site.

    #1369826

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Miriam377, that translation sound like it comes from this:

    My Sukkahleh is small, not fancy at all
    but is especially dear to me.
    Schach I put on a bit, hoping to cover it,
    there I’d sit and think. (2x)
    The wind was a cold one,
    the cracked walls were old ones,
    the candles were flickering low.
    At times as if dying, but suddenly rising,
    as if they did not want to go. (2x)
    My sweet little daughter
    sensing the danger,
    got scared and started to cry.
    “Father,” she cried,
    “Don’t stay there outside
    the Sukkah is going to fall!” (2)
    Fear not my child, its been quite a while
    the Sukkahleh still stands strong.
    The wind has been worse my dear,
    but its almost two thousand years
    yet the Sukkahleh still stands strong! (2x)

    (Mendel’s Messages)

    The translation is not precise, which is inevitable since they made it rhyme.

    #1369871

    kvetcher
    Participant

    I also learned it from the RS album.
    You’ll never find an “authentic” version. Besides, it’s not exactly Torah Moshe. It’s the message that counts.

    #1369870

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    I found this English adaption by Rabbi Avi Shafran:

    A sukkaleh, quite small,
    Wooden planks for each wall;
    Lovingly I stood them upright.
    I laid thatch as a ceiling
    And now, filled with deep feeling,
    I sit in my sukkaleh at night.

    A chill wind attacks,
    Blowing through the cracks;
    The candles, they flicker and yearn.
    It’s so strange a thing
    That as the Kiddush I sing,
    The flames, calmed, now quietly burn.

    In comes my daughter,
    Bearing hot food and water;
    Worry on her face like a pall.
    She just stands there shaking
    And, her voice nearly breaking,
    Says “Tattenyu, the sukkah’s going to fall!”

    Dear daughter, don’t fret;
    It hasn’t fallen yet.
    The sukkah will be fine, understand.
    There have been many such fears,
    For nigh two thousand years;
    Yet the sukkahleh continues to stand.

    #1370612

    kvetcher
    Participant

    אַ סוכה’לע אַ קליינע

    אַ סוכה’לע אַ קליינע,
    פֿון ברעטעלעך געמיינע,
    האָב איך מיר אַ סוכה’לע געמאַכט,
    פֿאַרדעקט דעם דאַך,
    מיט אַ ביסעלע סְכַך,
    זיץ איך מיר אין סוכה’לע ביינאַכט.
    פֿאַרדעקט דעם דאַך,
    מיט אַ ביסעלע סְכַך,
    זיץ איך מיר אין סוכה’לע ביינאַכט.

    אַ ווינט אַ קאַלטען,
    בלאָזט דורך די שפאַלטען,
    און די ליכטעלעך זיי לעשען זיך ווילד,
    עס איז מיר אַ חִדוּשׁ,
    ווי איך מאַך מיר קִדוּשׁ,
    און די ליכטעלעך זיי ברענען גאַנץ שטיל.
    עס איז מיר אַ חִדוּשׁ,
    ווי איך מאַך מיר קִדוּשׁ,
    און די ליכטעלעך זיי ברענען גאַנץ שטיל.

    צום ערשטען געריכט[1],
    מיט אַ בלאַס’ן געזיכט,
    ברענגט מיר מיין טאָכטער’ל אַריין,
    זי שטעלט זיך אַוועק,
    און זאָגט ווי מיט שרעק:
    “טאַטע’לע די סוכה פֿאַלט באַלד אַיין!”
    זי שטעלט זיך אַוועק,
    אַון זאָגט ווי מיט שרעק:
    “טאַטע’לע די סוכה פֿאַלט באַלד אַיין!”

    – זיי נישט קיין נַעֲר,
    האָב ניט קיין צַעֲר,
    זאָל דיר די סוכה ניט טאָן באַנג[2]!
    עס איז שוין גאָר,
    באַלד צוויי טויזענד יאָהר,
    און די סוכה’לע זי שטייט נאָך גאַנץ לאַנג.
    עס איז שוין גאָר,
    באַלד צוויי טויזענד יאָהר,
    און די סוכה’לע זי שטייט נאָך גאַנץ לאַנג.

    [1] Course, serving
    [2] Sorrow

    #1371593

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    Interesting question:
    In the last stanza, first line, the word “Na’ar” is spelled with an Alef in most versions.

    Is that the proper yiddish spelling of the word?
    Because in Hebrew it is with an Ayin.

    #1371600

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    In Yiddish, it’s נאר.

    I misspelled it.

    #1371637

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    Do the Yiddish and Hebrew words mean the same thing?

    #1371639

    DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Approximately, but not precisely. You’re not going to learn Yiddish by studying and comparing the Yiddish and English song lyrics, but you will get the lyrics’ message.

    #1371860

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    Just so I understand, naar in Hebrew is a noun, is naar in Yiddish an adjective?

    #1371895

    Ash
    Participant

    @DY that’s not quite right. In yiddish an aleph is used for kamatz or pasach sound (almost like vowels in English), and an ayin for a segol sound when using a native Yiddish (or German or English) word. Hebrew words are usually written in their proper spelling especially if they’re clearly not Yiddish in origin.

    (Exceptions include שאבעס for שבת but even that spelling is not usually used and even then only to show that it’s the “heimish” pronunciation.)

    So נאר is “nohr” which means only, whereas נער in the first version is clearly the Arameic word (for fool, the line means “on’t be fool”) and so would be written with an ayin.

    All the IIRC.

    #1371912

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    Ash
    You do not recall correctly DY is right. The spelling in yiddish for the word fool is נאר.
    The word נער in Yiddish is pronounced Ner since as you correctly point out ayin makes a short e sound.
    Words Like שבת and נר (candle) are usualy spelled the same way since they dont have vowels (in yiddish as you know the letters Aleph, Ayin, Vav … are the vowels, there are no nekudos) so there is no confusion as to how שבת is pronounced you just memorize the vowels. In yiddish the word נער is pronounced Ner it has a vowel. If you want to write Fool ie Nar the correct spelling in Yiddish is נאר it is ALSO the correct spelling for the word Nur as in only.

    Of course if you incorporate a Hebrw/Aramic word for fool נער it isnt wrong, it just isnt yiddish (Then again the word נר isnt Yiddish either a candle is ליכט)

    #1372351

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    I am confused.
    Are you saying that the Yiddish and Hebrew word mean the same thing but are spelled differently?

    On a different note, I noticed that there a variant spellings of the word “beinacht” or “banacht”.

    Any explanation?

    #1372439

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    “Are you saying that the Yiddish and Hebrew word mean the same thing but are spelled differently?”

    without question.

    This comes up a lot with last names where the origin is yiddish. For example the name Goldberger. In Yiddish it is quite lengthy גאלדבערגער with the א…ע..ע serving as vowels, however in Hebrew the vowels are nekudos though often omitted/assumed thus an Israeli might spell his name גלדברגר. Its the same name, pronounced the same one is spelled in yiddish the other in Hebrew.

    Thus the word נער pronounced Nar is not a yiddish word. There is a yiddish word that means the same thing and is pronounced the same way, and stems from that word. To get the word pronunced Nar in Yiddish it is spelled נאר.
    OTher than names I cant think of any other such example at the moment, though Im sure they are out there.

    As for your last question the correct spelling is בײנאכט. different locales pronounce that differently as Baynacht Bynacht so the spelling may have shifted to באנאכט. You have to keep in mind most Yiddish speakers dont really care what YIVO has to say. so there isnt really a formal body governing the “correct” spelling of words. Im sure you will find the word fool spelled נער in some places though it isnt technically the correct yidish spelling. Furthermore there is generally no formal yiddish grammar class that most current speakers study. I did have a basic spelling book/class in the second grade but after that we just learnt by rote and “what sounded right” based on what you heard

    #1372612

    Ash
    Participant

    without question.

    Very much with question. Do a google search for “זיי נישט קיין נער” (with quotes, ideally) and then for “זיי נישט קיין נאר” and you’ll find they have a very similar number of results, and many from heimish websites/publications for both.

    I don’t know about WIVO or academic yiddish but for an actual first-language Yiddish speaker it would be quite odd to spell it in a way that it too similar to “nohr/nur” (“only”) IMO and in colloquial Yiddish it is very common to write hebrew words as-is (like שבת) not because of the lack of ambiguity because many words are simply written in Hebrew. This trend is compounded by the transliteration and appropriation of many English words into Ivrit.

    In Yiddish it is quite lengthy גאלדבערגער with the א…ע..ע serving as vowels,

    Almost. Hungarian Yiddish (e.g. perhaps Satmar) usually leave ער at the end of words, but for the “er” suffix (and other similar suffix), Litvish or Polish Yiddish would leave out that final ער so it would be written גאלדבערגר.

    Name’s aren’t a good example though as they tend to be spelled the same way as they first were written long ago but any other word e.g. “הייליגר” / “הייליגער” might be a better example.

    #1372712

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    ASH

    ” Very much with question…”

    You arent realy Questioning nor even disagreeing with my point. My “without question” was in reference to this “Are you saying that the Yiddish and Hebrew word mean the same thing but are spelled different”

    You agree that at the least the word נאר is yiddish as “they have a very similar number of results, and many from heimish websites/publications for both.”
    Of course נאר isnt a Hebrew word thus this is, as I said, “without question” a “Yiddish and Hebrew word mean the same thing but are spelled different”
    Unless you are arguing that the word נאר does NOT mean fool, which you very much imply isnt the case (as you say ” because many words are simply written in Hebrew.” Yes if you write the word “in Hebrew” the word is נער, no argument there.

    The only question is whether the Hebrew word נער is ALSO a Yiddish word. This point is more semantics, since if we ignore YIVO (not WIVO) Yiddish evolves it is possible that now the Hebrew word נער is considered Yiddish much like coup which is clearly French is now an English word. However you said “נער in the first version is clearly the Arameic word (for fool, the line means “on’t be fool”) and so would be written with an ayin” which is clearly not correct. IF you had written “so COULD be written with an ayin” I concede that it can.

    for what it is worth if you Google translate Fool” into yiddish you get נאר.

    (your interesting tidbit abut Yiddish names is only tangentially related, we arent discussing differences among different dialects of Yiddish rather Yiddish vs. Hebrew)

    #1372723

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    I’m not sure if I did your experiment wrong “זיי נישט קיין נאר” yielded 214 results while “זיי נישט קיין נער” yielded 154 results. that makes the former 40 % more common. Im not sure I would term that a ” similar number” let alone a “very similar number of results,”

    Again though, even if they were equally used, DY’s spelling is still correct.

    #1372728

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    “but for an actual first-language Yiddish speaker it would be quite odd to spell it in a way that it too similar to “nohr/nur” (“only”) ”

    Ive been trying to think of an example here is one: what does פאר mean?
    Without context (or sticking in a nekuda) you dont know. Here are two contexts to help:

    איך פאר אהיים (travel)
    איך מיז זיין אהיים פאר די זמן (before)

    (of course the word זמן is technically Hebrew but like the word שבת it doesnt contain any yiddish vowels so it is left alone)

    #1376677

    Ash
    Participant

    When I did the search there were fewer than 20 results between them 180 vs 160 or something. Anyway, you can try other words and examples.

    I don’t get your distinction and what are words that “contain yiddish vowels”? Every word can be written with “yiddish” vowels.

    The suffix thing shown that sometimes the vowels are left out when it doesn’t add. There are better examples no doubt.

    I am making up rules based on experience not formal knowledge of grammar, but I suspect that your “yiddish vowels” rule is similarly made up. True?

    #1377204

    mitzvahcard
    Participant

    Is it true that the difference between Banacht and Beinacht would be a litvish vs chassidish yiddish?

    #1377514

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    ASH

    “I don’t get your distinction and what are words that “contain yiddish vowels”?

    Hebrew vowels (nekudos) are ַַָאָאַאֶאֵאִאׁ (ignore the
    The corresponding yiddish vowels are א א ע יי י ו

    The word זמן doesnt contain a yiddish vowel nor does שבת. Thus in yiddish they are written the same way,
    The hebrew word נער does contain a yiddish vowel, the ע which of course makes an ־ֶ sound. thus in yidish the word נער is prounced Ner.

    “The suffix thing shown that sometimes the vowels are left out when it doesn’t add. There are better examples no doubt.”
    weve already provided examples like זמן שבת. In the case of נער a vowel isnt being left out, a “wrong” one is put in.

    “I am making up rules based on experience not formal knowledge of grammar, but I suspect that your “yiddish vowels” rule is similarly made up. True?”

    Im not sure which rule you refer to. Strictly speaking the correct spelling is נאר. I agree languages evolve and today perhaps נער is correct as well.
    However your first line “So נאר is “nohr” which means only, whereas נער in the first version is clearly the Arameic word (for fool, the line means “on’t be fool”) and so would be written with an ayin.” wasnt quite right

    #1377562

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    “Is it true that the difference between Banacht and Beinacht would be a litvish vs chassidish yiddish?”

    Im not sure at all. I am open to other suggestions.

    #1485779

    ubiquitin
    Participant

    Ash

    I’m not sure if you are still around, over Purim I thought of another example. (Inyanei deyoma)
    The Yiddish word for drunk is שיקער this obviously stems from the Hebrew word שיכור (In yiddish would be pronounced shichor)
    ודו”ק

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