December 15, 2012 11:50 pm at 11:50 pm #607443
My sister is wondering why her Rabbi did not discuss the shooting during his drasha or say Tehillim. I explained to her that we don’t mourn on Shabbos.December 16, 2012 1:15 am at 1:15 am #913247
I dont see why a Rabbi must mention it at all and who is she to “tell the Rabbi” what he should be mentioning. He is the Rabbi for a reason, he knows what the kahal needs to hear be it a dvar Torah on the parsha or a dvar halacha or whatever.
Additionally, we have enough things going on in our own communities to say Tehillim for. If you want to say Tehillim for them go ahead but it has never been the minhag in klal yisroel to say Tehillim for non Jews brabim in shul. In fact most shuls only said Tehillim brabim during the rocket barrage issue in eretz yisroel. So it would be extremely strange and unhear of to be saying Tehillim in shul for them. Lets be busy with our own issues. There are enough non Jews (311,591,917 million people living in the USA) to say psalms pray and give charity for for them. They dont need our Tehillim.December 16, 2012 1:20 am at 1:20 am #913248
Did Jews die in the shooting?December 16, 2012 2:16 am at 2:16 am #913249
A Jewish child, Noah Pozner. Six years old, was killed in the shooting.December 16, 2012 2:48 am at 2:48 am #913250
Discussing the Jewish view is not mourning. Rav David daSola Pool spoke about JFK after his assassination (which was on erev Shabbat). Why didn’t your sister ask her rabbi himself?December 16, 2012 3:13 am at 3:13 am #913251
WIY, your lack of sympathy is disturbing. She didn’t ask why the shul did not say tehillim. She asked why it wasn’t mentioned. A Jewish child was killed but that is not the point. This was a horrific tragedy and we will be mourning those poor children’s lost lives forever.December 16, 2012 3:32 am at 3:32 am #913252
We talk about the Mekoshesh Eitzim on Shabbos Shelach Lecho & about murderers going to Orei Miklot on Shabbos Massei, so of-course these topics can be discussed on Shabbos.December 16, 2012 3:41 am at 3:41 am #913253
Some news outlets have also identified Ben Wheeler as jewish.
Noah Pozners twin sister and older sibling survived the shootingDecember 16, 2012 3:56 am at 3:56 am #913254
There was more than one “Jewish name” among the victims. But even one CHILD, Jewish or not, twists my kishkes. I cried like a baby when I heard the news reports. How terrified they must have been. Truly the boogeyman come to life. My heart goes out to the families of ALL the victims, children and adults alike.December 16, 2012 3:59 am at 3:59 am #913255
“My sister is wondering why her Rabbi did not discuss the shooting during his drasha or say Tehillim”
I have plenty of sympathy.December 16, 2012 4:02 am at 4:02 am #913256
My apologies I didn’t see the last part of what he wrote.December 16, 2012 4:11 am at 4:11 am #913257
I feel a strong moral imperative to say prayers for and offer help to suffering people, Jewish or not, where I can. I have a Catholic relative who went to a concentration camp to protest how Jews were being treated by the Nazis…it is absolutely necessary to reach out to help the rest of humanity. We are all G-d’s creations.December 16, 2012 4:58 am at 4:58 am #913258
All people are created B’Tzelem Elokim.
The Chief Rabbi of the UK authored tefillos and ordered reciting tehillim for victims of the earthquake in Haiti, genocide in Darfur, and other innocent non-Jews who suffer.
We are obligated to love and treat with dignity all non-Jews. One thing that stuck with me was how the yeshiva Hadar haTorah in Crown Heights has a food pantry where scores of non-Jewish residents come for food. The righteous of all nations have a place in olam haba, and it is our duty to do chesed for all people (Gittin 61).
I find the racist attitudes expressed here to be a shanda and a chillul HaShem. A person who has no rachmanus on murdered children is heartless and soulless.December 16, 2012 7:23 am at 7:23 am #913259
I do not know what is wrong with someone stating that they are more concerned over Jewish tragedies.
I view other Jewish people as extended family and I think it is natural for someone to feel more concern over members of their family then other people.
Of course this does not mean that my heart does not go out to thos eparents suffering from this horror right now, however I do not view non-jewish people in the same way as I view Jewish people.
Which I am sure is the same way vice-versa.
Ex. Several years back during the Second Intifada I was in the car with a group of people in the the US.
We got word there had been a bombing in a certain part of Israel.
I asked urgently if it was in the Chareidi section of that city.
Someone else blew up at me.
How can you even ask that, and irreligous jews mmean nothing to you.
I kept quiet rather then explain I have a vast number of reletives throughout Isreal.
However the person who blew up at me came to understand it on his own.
The next day I recieved word my first cousin was in the blast and her child was killed instantly R’L and she, and her husband sustained severe injuries (that have left their mark till today).
My point is that we are naturally more concerned with our own then with others.
Of course if someone would view themselves as an equal member of the non-jewish community this would not apply.December 16, 2012 11:31 am at 11:31 am #913260
I explained to my sister that we do not mourn and speak of sad and terrible things on Shabbos. For example, if Tisha B’av falls out on Shabbos, we postpone the fast to Sunday. Also, if one chas v’shalom is sitting shiva, you don’t sit shiva on Shabbos. “G-d created the world in six days and rested one the seventh. Shabbat is not an escape from reality, it is an escape TO reality. Time to connect with our real selves, the soul. and recharge yourself to reengage with our broken world.”
Still, my sister felt that this was on everyone’s mind and the Rabbi should have spoken about it. So it is hard to explain to her.December 16, 2012 1:31 pm at 1:31 pm #913261
In my arrogant opinion, the natural inclination for a Jew is rachmanus and chesed. That is why Jews typically fail certain mitzvot which require the suppression of this natural inclination.December 16, 2012 1:34 pm at 1:34 pm #913262
Ben Levi, I think that the response was obvious considering the foolish way you put it. You should have noted the fact about where your relatives live at the outset.December 16, 2012 6:25 pm at 6:25 pm #913263
It is natural to be more concerned with our own than with others, just as we would be mroe concerned with our own immediate mishpacha, versus other Jewish families. Kal v’chomer, Jews over non-Jews. But that said, no one could possibly listen to these reports and not feel anhuish for ALL the families including those of the adults who were martyred, even as they tried to save the children.
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