March 4, 2012 3:10 am at 3:10 am #866367
Thank You, moishy. And that really puts a stop to this conversation, because we dare not argue with HIM, huh ?March 4, 2012 3:23 am at 3:23 am #866368
Is the halacha about getting drunk on Purim different for a 13 year old than for a 23 year old? Does anyone have a source that the halacha is different based on age?March 4, 2012 3:33 am at 3:33 am #866369
Yes, its a b’feirushe se’if in the Fifth Shulchan Aruch.March 4, 2012 3:42 am at 3:42 am #866370
That cheilek can be whatever you want it to be. Anything written?March 4, 2012 3:53 am at 3:53 am #866371
It can’t be whatever you want, but I know what you mean.
I was trying to say that’s the only place you’ll find it.March 4, 2012 4:08 am at 4:08 am #866372
Nisht Ahe Nisht AherMember
YOU DON’T HAVE TO GET DRUNK IF YOU CAN’T!!!!!!
IT’S MORE IMPORTANT TO BE HEALTH-SAFE THAN TO GET DRUNK!!!!!!!March 4, 2012 4:12 am at 4:12 am #866373
Wow, those capitals are really convincing!
Thanks for adding that brilliant, NEW twist to the conversation…March 4, 2012 7:47 am at 7:47 am #866374
HaLeiVi: Can you explain what you said earlier about the misconception in the Rama? I looked at it today and he says explicitly that you’re Yotzei because you don’t know the difference while you’re asleep.March 4, 2012 11:14 pm at 11:14 pm #866375
Sam: The Rama doesn’t required the wine be what puts you to sleep??April 5, 2012 4:30 pm at 4:30 pm #866376
So what do I do for the Seder? After the second Kos, my stomach is kicking from the wine.April 5, 2012 5:01 pm at 5:01 pm #866377
RSZA says in Halichos Shlomo ( dont have exact citation at the moment) that grape juice is fine for the arba kosos.April 5, 2012 5:11 pm at 5:11 pm #866378
hershi: You can’t drink grape juice either?
(Also, isn’t there a gemara about this amorah who was sick from pesach until like shevuos? or something like that)April 5, 2012 5:33 pm at 5:33 pm #866379
Red wine is most hudor for the Seder. Any wine is better than grape juice.April 5, 2012 6:16 pm at 6:16 pm #866380
“Red wine is most hudor for the Seder. Any wine is better than grape juice”
So Shein is it safe to say you are iber poskening Rav Shlomo Zalman ZT”L?April 5, 2012 6:43 pm at 6:43 pm #866381
Rav Shlomo Zalman did not say anything in conflict with what I posted (which, in fact, is what any number of gedolim have said themselves.)
Wine is mhudor, grape juice is yotzei.April 5, 2012 6:49 pm at 6:49 pm #866382
No difference between wine and grape juice at all!April 5, 2012 7:41 pm at 7:41 pm #866383
Shein: Okay, and for someone who gets sick from wine there is no issue whatsoever with grape juice. Besides, many Poskim say the Hiddur in wine is that alcohol is Derech Cheirus. So just add a drop of wine to the grape juice and you’re pretty much okay.April 6, 2012 11:56 am at 11:56 am #866384
popa: Yes, like mentioned earlier, I can perfectly tolerate any amount of grape juice. Yet, I would much prefer to use wine, and would appreciate suggestions as to what wines might be easier consumable.April 6, 2012 2:10 pm at 2:10 pm #866385
Hershi: If you can tolerate it, add a drop of wine to your grape juice. That’s pretty close to Lechatchilah L’chol Hadei’os. (By the way, I saw the Mishnah Brurah yesterday who points out that if wine gives one a headache then one is Mechuyav to drink anyway but if it will make you sick enough to have to lie down then you don’t need to try to have wine.)April 6, 2012 2:42 pm at 2:42 pm #866386
Sam: That would work, thanks. I could dilute the wine with grape juice and tolerate it just fine. Is it correct though that that would be lchatchila lchol hadeios? And does it matter with any deios how much is grape juice and how much is wine in the mix?
Also, does anyone think a very low alcholic content wine (i.e. 3.5%) might be more tolerable for the stomache? And if it is, is using such a wine entirely, more m’hudor than mixing a higher alcohol wine with grape juice?April 6, 2012 4:00 pm at 4:00 pm #866387
Hershi: I can’t say L’chol Hadei’os for sure. I don’t know every single opinion out there. But the general opinion (especially if you live in America since Rav Moshe said that grape juice is basically the same as wine) is that there is a separate Hiddur of wine on the Seder night because it’s more Derech Cheirus if there is alcohol. Obviously, an alcohol content closest to that of a normal wine makes the most sense. But seeing as you can’t do that, then a low-alcohol wine or a wine diluted with grape juice wouldn’t be the most Derech Cheirus possible, and it probably Yotzei this Hiddur of having wine (unless your LOR tells you otherwise).April 6, 2012 8:57 pm at 8:57 pm #866388
Pardon the ignorance, but how is wine produced differently than grape juice, considering both come from grapes? And what makes one wine have a higher alcoholic content than another wine? Does wine have a natural amount of alcohol that producers can manipulate by increasing or decreasing?February 18, 2018 6:23 pm at 6:23 pm #1471511
BumpFebruary 18, 2018 6:24 pm at 6:24 pm #1471512
Sometimes when a person becomes ill from drink9ng wine it is because of an interaction between the wine and other ingredients,in food or medications.
I found a kosher, sulfite-free wine online: Or Haganuz Elima 2014. I’m sure there are others.February 18, 2018 9:11 pm at 9:11 pm #1471568
out of town yidParticipant
I have a medical condition called gout. I cannot consume much alcohol at all. For me, it can lead to severe joint pain. I use CONCORD KAL for the seder.(3.5 % alcohol content.) It may have sulfites I just use low sugar grape juice otherwise year round, as I also must watch sugar. To all…..PLEASE be careful on Purim with the drinking. Do not injure yourself or others. Do NOT create any chilul Hashem! Purim is a joyous time, it should NOT have any sadness associated with it. PLEASE be responsible.February 18, 2018 9:43 pm at 9:43 pm #1471584
I recall this posting (and several similiar threads) from several years ago and the inyan of “getting drunK’ as somehow being necessary to be yotzeh the mitzvah is as disgusting now as it was then. People die from vehicular accidents and falls related to intoxication….jiust about all rabbonim who have addressed the issue assur anything more than modests amount of alcohol and those who explicitly “permit” excessive drinking and thereby creating a risk of dealth and serious injury to the entire tzibur are putting their own families in the front of the line for such a tragedy.February 19, 2018 10:27 am at 10:27 am #1471782
The RMA 695:2 says that a person should drink as much too fall asleep, at which he cannot differentiate Haman and Mordechai, whom to bless and whom to curse. The Eyin Yaakov says that there is a logic to bless Haman because 48 neviim could not accomplish what he did, whereas there is also some logic to curse ch’v Mordechai for starting up with Haman for not bowing down to him so he would not know whom to bless and whom to curse. The truth of the matter is, explains the Chasam Sofer, that even though the others were able to bow down to Haman, Mordechai could not because Haman was his slave and so people will say that he is bowing down to an idol form Haman was wearing not to give respect to him.February 28, 2018 6:08 pm at 6:08 pm #1479596
Ad Dlo Yoda!
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