Survey: Are you more frum than your parents or less frum than them?

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  • #618218
    Joseph
    Participant

    Are you more frum than your parents or less frum than them?

    #1171124
    Joseph
    Participant

    A follow-up question is, if applicable, are your children more frum than you or less frum than you?

    #1171125
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Define Frum :).

    Does the definition change if someone calls themselves MO?

    #1171126
    Joseph
    Participant

    Define it yourself and explain how you defined it in relation to your response to the question(s).

    #1171127
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    I’m more Frum than my parents, but they are baalei teshuva so it’s different. As a kid, the way I viewed it was that by being more Frum than my parents, I was following in their footsteps to a very small degree (since they are more more Frum than their parents than I am more Frum than mine). So maybe they should be considered more Frum than me?

    My children are more Frum than I am – they are so Frum that they couldn’t deal with the concept of being in a world of gashmius and preferred to stay in the Shamayim.

    #1171128
    Meno
    Participant

    Some would consider me OTD along with my parents

    My kids are too young to be OTD

    #1171129
    gofish
    Member

    What do you mean by frum?

    Larger yarmulka, more chumras, a connection with Hashem, more chitzoniyus, more pnimiyus?

    #1171130
    Meno
    Participant

    My father wears a yarmulka which is about 4 times the size of mine.

    #1171131
    Joseph
    Participant

    gofish, see my response to lilmod regarding definition.

    #1171132
    gofish
    Member

    I see it now – the wonders of asynchronous conversations.

    In regards to external trappings, my parents definitely *look* frummer.

    But as to how I would define frum, I’d venture to say say that I think I’m frummer.

    I’ll post later how I would define frum – I have to think about how to concentrate it into one post.

    #1171133
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Meno – either his yarmulka must be huge or yours must be teeny or both. Which is it?

    And how could both you and your parents be OTD? They went from Chareidi to MO and then you went from MO to Chiloni? Or they went from Chassidish to Yeshivish or vice versa and then you became MO?

    I always thought you sounded pretty Frum from your posts as far as I can recall.

    #1171134
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Gofish: “In regards to external trappings, my parents definitely *look* frummer.

    But as to how I would define frum, I’d venture to say say that I think I’m frummer.”

    That sounds interesting. I’m curious to hear how you define Frum.

    #1171135
    Meno
    Participant

    LU,

    I wear a pretty small Yarmulka (not tiny) but my father wears a huge one.

    (4 times the area, which means only twice the diameter)

    And I was just saying OTD according to some of the definitions that have been popping up around the coffee room. It was a joke. Most of the things I say are just jokes.

    #1171136
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    considering both my parents reside in a place that is purely emes and spirituality I don’t think it’s even comparable.

    #1171137
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Meno – Don’t worry, I realized it was a joke.

    #1171138
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Joseph – what about you?

    #1171139
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Syag – your response reminds me of a shidduch resume I was sent. For the question “location of parents”, the guy responded with the name of the cemetery.

    #1171140
    Sparkly
    Member

    Joseph – it depends. im less frum than my dad but as frum as my mom.

    #1171142
    Sparkly
    Member

    Meno – why are you considered OTD? wearing a small yarmulka DOESNT make you OTD. what makes someone OTD is if they stop keeping shabbos and kosher and some other stuff.

    #1171143
    Little Froggie
    Participant

    My mother doesn’t even wear a yarmulka (gasp).

    Truth be told, I unfortunately do not come up to their ankles in being frum or Yiras Shamaim. My father works in Kiruv, one-man-band, 26/7 as a side job. His regular job is in Kiruv, mass scale with a known organization. My mom also works… She is a role model of what a Jewish Jew ought to look like.

    Sorry Mommy I’m so lacking. Maybe one day…

    #1171144
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Little Froggie – it’s the hasagos that count the most…I remember a teacher of mine once saying (possibly quoting Rav Hutner Ztzal) that someone who did not spend his whole life learning and now wishes he had is greater than someone who spent his whole life learning and wishes he hadn’t.

    #1171145
    dovrosenbaum
    Participant

    I’m definitely more religious than my parents.

    #1171146
    Person1
    Member

    Socially we’re similar. In pnimius they have their stronger points and I have mine. With that said I’m in awe of their avodas hashem sometimes.

    #1171147

    I don’t want to be mekatrik on myself therefore this question will remain unanswered on my part

    #1171148
    Meno
    Participant

    Sparkly,

    I have a smartphone. I think some people in the coffee room had said that having a smartphone means you’re OTD

    #1171149
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Meno, I’m not sure, but I think if that was said it was probably only said in a certain context. Like, maybe in response to a post about smoking being OTD, someone said that IF smoking is OTD, then having a smartphone for sure is. I could be wrong, but it’s a bit hard for me to imagine that someone in the CR could have said that and meant it literally.

    #1171150
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Meno – I feel better now though knowing that’s what you meant. I was going to ask you, but I was worried about what the answer would be…

    #1171151
    Excellence
    Participant

    We think we are something we really are not.

    Lets not kid ourselves. If we were frum why are we still reincarnating time after time? The yester h doesn’t mind; another lifetime of sins to collect. The issues we have today are baggage we hauled from our previous lives.

    We need to make tikun and try to clean up ourselves.

    #1171152
    Person1
    Member

    Meno I’m not sure whether you’re joking. I said something similar and it was in the context LU explaind. Also it really doesn’t matter what name you give something.

    #1171153
    Meno
    Participant

    I was joking. I’m usually joking. I’m a clown, that’s what I do. If I’m ever not joking, it will be very clear that I’m not joking.

    #1171154
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    I thought you were an engineer…

    #1171155
    gavra_at_work
    Participant

    I’m certainly more concerned with externals (definition of “Frum”) than my parents. It is a sign of the times.

    A Galach is Frum, a Yid is Erlich.

    #1171156
    Meno
    Participant

    Engineer is only my profession. I am a clown

    #1171157
    Person1
    Member

    Meno I had a friend once who made jokes all the time. I forget what happened to him.

    #1171158
    FriendInFlatbush
    Participant

    Yes

    #1171159
    Meno
    Participant

    Person1,

    Hmm. I had a friend once who was a person. Maybe it was you

    #1171160
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    gavra _ at_ work:”A Galach is Frum, a Yid is Erlich.”

    I read that in Rav Yaakov Kamenetzky zatsal’s kehila, they used to refer to people as Ehrlich, not as Frum.

    I really like that. It has a much more pnimiusdik connotation, and sounds like it includes both Bein Adam l’Makom and Bein Adam L’Chaveiro, both Halachos involving actions and chovos halevavos.

    #1171161
    Joseph
    Participant

    FriendInFlatbush: In what way?

    #1171162
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Joseph – what about you?

    #1171163
    Joseph
    Participant

    lilmod, I was going to answer the same as my parents, but after reading Little Froggie’s excellent response I reconsidered and realized him to be correct for me too.

    (Thanks, LF!)

    #1171164
    smerel
    Participant

    I can’t really answer the question because my parents didn’t deal with the same internal or external situations (nisyonis) that I do. Nor did they grow up with the adanatages I did.

    All things being equal who is/would be frummer? I don’t know.Only Hashem knows who is really frummer.

    #1171165
    Lilmod Ulelamaid
    Participant

    Smerel – we are not talking about who is better. That no one knows as you wrote.

    #1171166
    gavra_at_work
    Participant

    I read that in Rav Yaakov Kamenetzky zatsal’s kehila, they used to refer to people as Ehrlich, not as Frum.

    I really like that. It has a much more pnimiusdik connotation, and sounds like it includes both Bein Adam l’Makom and Bein Adam L’Chaveiro, both Halachos involving actions and chovos halevavos.

    Exactly. Frum means Chitzonius, how you want others to view yourself. Erlich means “honest” (literally), which is how you want to relate both to the RBSO and others.

    #1171167
    nachumberg
    Participant

    more or less frum doesn’t quite make sense

    either you are frum or you are not

    I am frum & so are my parents PERIOD

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