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Cleveland or Chicago?
Is this a world series question?
Huh?
Riverdale.
Lithuania
Shanghai during the war
lakewood yomim noraim minyan
well since cleveland telz almost doesnt exist and chicago telz is a thriving yeshiva… no question there.
telz chicago is one of the best yeshivos in america, very quietly. the rosh yeshivas shlita are gedolei yisroel, baalos midos tovos, tzaddikim mamesh.
“Shisha Sidrey Mishna”
kesher?
Abba_S,
Unfortunately, Telshe didn’t manage to escape the horrors of WWII and was mostly destroyed. The Telshe yeshivos that were set up in America are reconstituted, but unfortunately not direct continuations of the original.
(I hope I haven’t said anything wrong – but I admit I don’t know a lot about this particular subject)
the telshe yeshivos in america are indeed direct successors to lithuania. the sirit of telz litte is alive and well.
Geordie613,
R’Baruch Sorotzkin and several others, were in Shanghai during the war
Also, there were several americans who had been in Telz ;Telshai
Geordie613,
Gateshead calls themselves still Beis Yoseph ,although there is virtually zero connection
Of course there were Telshe talmidim in the new telshe yeshivos, but it wasn’t a direct continuation of the original. Compare it with the Mir.
The Mirrer yeshiva escaped intact from Mir, travelled across Russia, to Japan and then to China. They then travelled to America and set up there. Meanwhile, the Mirrer Rosh Yeshiva had travelled to Eretz Yisroel and set up a new yeshiva there called The Mirrer Yeshiva. After the war, Reb Chaim Shmuelevitz and the mashgiach Reb Chatzkel joined him. So it was reconstituted, but you could argue that the original Mir is now in Brooklyn, even though the original Roshei Yeshiva settled in Yerushalayim.
It is Time for Truth,
True, that’s why it’s called Gateshead, not Novhardok. As much as my son isn’t my grandfather even though he’s called after him.
BTW, there is a tenuous connection. My Rebbi in Mir, R’ Nissan Kaplan is from the family of The Alter of Novhardok, (he’s related to the Shmuelevitz’s who are/were Novhardok). He said to me once, Ich bin Novhardok in dem dor. And R’ Nissan is Rav Avrohom Gurwicz’s son in law. So there you go!
Geordie613 is right. The Telshe Yeshiva belonged to the community, not the Bloch family. The American Yeshiva was a new Yeshiva that followed the same path as the original.
Geordie613 is right You are right it was Mir that escaped to Shanghai. Sorry
Abba_S,
Obviously!
There were also chevra from other yeshivos who were TOLD to retain their own Kevutzos
Though finacially ,etc. they were all attached to the Mir
typo
financially
On the subject of Telshe and this week’s worldwide Shabbos Project coming up…
Rabbi Warren Goldstein Shlita, Chief Rabbi of South Africa, who is behind this whole project, holds himself as a Telshe talmid even though he never learned there. The Yeshiva Gedola of Johannesburg was set up by Telshe talmid Rav Azriel Goldfein zatza”l along the Telshe derech. Rabbi Goldfein was a talmid muvhak of Rav Gifter zatza”l and lhbchl”ch Rabbi Goldstein is in turn a talmid of his.
So there’s out-of-town-Telshe and really-out-of-town-Telshe.
Yeshiva Gedola of Johannesburg was set up by Telshe talmidim Rav Azriel Goldfein zatza”l
and Rabbi Tanzer
Wikipedia:
The yeshiva was co-founded in the mid-1950s by Rabbi Michel Kossowsky, an Eastern European Talmudic scholar who had settled in South Africa during the Holocaust, and Rabbi Joseph Bronner, an alumnus of the Yeshiva Rabbi Chaim Berlin in Brooklyn, New York, who had settled in South Africa after World War II and was active in the business world. The yeshiva was named for Rabbi Kossowsky’s father, Rabbi Yitzchak Kossowsky, who had preceded him and had served as one of the heads of Johannesburg’s Beth Din (“religious court”.)
The first full-time instructor of Talmud at the yeshiva was Rabbi David Sanders (rabbi), who was brought out from the Telz yeshiva in the United States to teach the young students Talmud in the traditional style of the Lithuanian yeshivas. He in turn helped to bring Rabbi Avraham Tanzer, also an alumnus of the Telz yeshiva in the U.S., to teach at the yeshiva. Eventually Rabbi Tanzer was appointed the Rosh yeshivah (“dean”) of the school, a position which he has retained.
Rabbi Tanzer in turn brought out Rabbi Azriel Goldfein [1] (again, a fellow Telz yeshiva alumnus) to be a co-Rosh yeshiva; Rabbi Goldfein eventually left to establish the Yeshivah Gedolah of Johannesburg.
So they must’ve split
I am not aware that Rabbi Tanzer was involved in the Yeshiva Gedola. I think you are referring to Yeshiva College. That is a secondary school, also called Beis Yitzchok.
In your last line, you quote “Rabbi Goldfein eventually left to establish the Yeshivah Gedolah of Johannesburg”. That is what I am talking about.
Telz yeshiva in america was founded by rav eliyahu meir bloch ztzl, son of the telz yeshiva rosh hayeshiva maharil bloch ztzl. together with his brother in law rav chaim katz ztzl. it was founded according to the spirit and style of the lituanian telz yeshiva and is still operated in that path. telz chicago and riverdale are off shoots, also operated along the original telzer deredch by telzer talmidim of rav bloch and rav katz. although cleveland isnt as big as it used to be, chicago and riverdale are thriving yeshivos, among the best in america. those are facts. anybody cotradict that is basically complete not in the know of what telz is.
Thank you, theprof1. Exactly what I was saying.
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