What in the world is "Cheilek Elokah Mima'al" supposed to mean?

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  • #609717

    playtime
    Member

    ?

    #960300

    Dr. Horse
    Member

    Hashem blew a Neshama into Adom HaRishon, & everyone gets their Neshama the same way. Hashem does not have a mouth to blow with or lungs to contain ruach; anthropomorphics is just a way for us to understand on our own level. When Hashem blows into us, He blows Himself into us, & because He is not dividable into parts, we remain always attached to Hashem by virtue of our Neshamos. Each one of use (our true essence, our Neshama) is a cheilek, a part of Hashem.

    #960301

    playtime
    Member

    That’s all very nice. But with all due respect, Dr., Cheilek means ‘part’. ?

    #960302

    kkls45
    Member

    Cheilek elokah mima’al means a part of God up above. Like Dr. Horse said, when Hashem created man, He Created Adam’s body from the earth. However the real you, you neshama, was given to you by God Himself blowing into the nostrils “vayipach biapo chayim.” Therefore, your essence is a cheilek of Hashem.

    #960303

    playtime
    Member

    Blowing into the nostrils is one thing. It is a godly ‘spirit’ within me. I get it.

    But to say that I am ‘Cheilek Elokah’, is to say that I am part and parcel of god.

    #960304

    rebdoniel
    Member

    It means that all people have a spark of Divinity within them and an intimation of immortality. All souls stem from G-d and will ultimately find their way back to Him because all souls belong to Him, due to all souls containing a spark of the Divine with them.

    #960305

    mdd
    Member

    A WARNING! The abovementioned statement is from Kabbolah. One has to be vey careful when analyzing it. To understand it ke’pshuto is apikorsus. The Christians belive that Yoshke is a cheilek of HaShem. That’s why their religion is an avodah zorah.

    #960306

    playtime
    Member

    rebdoniel- It means that all people have a spark of Divinity within them

    I would agree if it said “cheilek ruchni”.

    mdd- A WARNING! The abovementioned statement is from Kabbolah

    You make it sound like I am eliciting excerpts from the Zohar. – This is quoted everywhere – in Chasidus, and out of Chasidus.

    To understand it ke’pshuto is apikorsus.

    What is your source?

    #960307

    kkls45
    Member

    It is exactly like you said that you are a part and parcel of God. When you say “I am feeling sad, happy, etc.” the I that you are talking about is not your body, its your soul. And that’s the part of God that He gave to you.

    #960308

    Dr. Horse
    Member

    Check out parshas haazinu (Devorim 32:9). The posuk says “Ki chelek Hashem amo”, “for a portion of Hashem is His nation”. Check out the commentaries on that verse. If you Google Devorim 32:9, you’ll get hits that explain it well. (I don’t want to get the Mods riled up so I won’t post the links. Maybe they’ll let me tell you to check Na-aleh and Torah Portion).

    #960309

    HaLeiVi
    Participant

    I think RebDoniel expressed it very clearly and eloquently. Ruchnius is not the word for divine; Eloki is.

    #960310

    rebdoniel
    Member

    The Transcendentalists believed (le havdil) in more or less the same concept.

    #960311

    playtime
    Member

    HaLeivi- Ruchnius is not the word for divine; Eloki is.

    Nice try. ‘Eloki’ means godly. ‘Elokah’ means God.

    kkls45- It is exactly like you said that you are a part and parcel of God. When you say “I am feeling sad, happy, etc.” the I that you are talking about is not your body, its your soul. And that’s the part of God that He gave to you.

    So I am partly god?

    #960312

    rebdovid
    Member

    The Neshama is a creation. But it is different than every other creation. So much so that the term “creation” when referriing to the Neshama means something different than “creation” when referring to everything else. The creation called a Neshama was created from the highest “source” possible, and directly from Hashem – not through the usual succession which starts with the spiritual and ends with the physical. The phrase “Chelek Elokah Mimaal” is borrowed from the Posuk in Iyov (31:2) ????? ????? ???????? ???????? ????????? ????? ??????????? and the source of the idea is the Sefer HaKanah, though oftentimes you will see it quoted from the Zohar (because the content is there, though not the exact quote), which comments on the Posuk ???? ????? ???? ???? – that ?? ????? ???? ??? ????. “He Who blows, blows from Himself.”

    The rest of creation was created by the ???? ??????

    Speech is a metaphor for Chitzoniyus

    The Neshama however comes from Hashem’s pnimiyus

    Speaking, one can speak for a long time (sometimes people talk way too long 🙂

    Blowing however you can’t do for too long because it is mamosh a part of you

    and this is the diference between the neshama and the rest of creation

    #960313

    kkls45
    Member

    You are not God but you have God in you.

    Honestly, Im just a teen myself, and this is probably way above me to be answering these type of questions, but I have had discussions with people about these things so I was just trying to share some of what I had learned. However I really suggest asking these questions to a teacher you respect, or to get in contact with someone like Chevi Garfinkel or Rabbi Mechanic who would be able to give you the right answers (unlike here in the CR where you don’t know whos giving you answers…)

    #960314

    Dr. Horse
    Member

    playtime-So I am partly god?

    In a sense, yes. You have a G-dly part to you. It is the part of you that allows you to feel & be spiritual. You are supposed to be spiritually inclined in a physical world. The spiritual can’t function in a physical world without help, but sometimes the physical wins out. But that’s the challenge. Check out the gemara in Nidda 31a. There are 3 partners in the creation of a person. G-d gives the G-dly part (the Cheilek Eloka). But as I said before, G-d is ONE & can’t detach part of Himself, so in effect, you are walking around with G-d as part of you (mima’al).

    #960315

    mdd
    Member

    Playtime, (a different name would be more appropriate for a discussion such as this), Chassidus is all based on Zohar and Kisvei Ari.

    My source? It is the same source that says that Christianity is avodah zorah. Namely, all Chachmei Yisroel from Chazal down.

    #960316

    HaLeiVi
    Participant

    Partly G-d is not quite the way to put it. But you have a Neshama which is G-dly.

    You obviously came here with an ax to grind, and that’s why I didn’t bother to offer any explanation. I only mentioned that your comment on RebDoniel is not valid.

    #960317

    WIY
    Member

    Technically speaking if you exist you are part of Hashem. He is everything, and something is part of everything therefore every something is a part of Hashem.

    #960318

    playtime
    Member

    I believe Rebdoniel’s second post contains Shem Hashem. ?

    #960319

    WIY
    Member

    playtime

    Google “Chelek Elokah Mimaal” you will find some answers.

    #960320

    playtime
    Member

    What? Is it Chol?

    #960321

    benignuman
    Participant

    Playtime,

    I have wondered about this for years. The best guess I have is that it means something similar to “tzelem elokim.” It means that we have independent consciousness (a.k.a the mind, a.k.a. the soul) and ability to make moral choices. That independent consciousness, in contrast to our brains and bodies, are not the product of nature and physical processes but comes directly from on high.

    In other words it doesn’t mean a piece of G-d, but a piece that is like G-d. It is not uncommon for Tannaic writing to use somewhat exaggerated writing (to leave out a “like”) or to use metaphor to describe something.

    #960322

    rebdoniel
    Member

    You’re confusing me with Reb Dovid, maybe?

    #960323

    MHY
    Participant

    The neshama is a high, spiritual creation of Hashem. We say in davening, every morning, Elokai, neshama shenosata bi tehorah hi. Ata verasa – you Hashem created the neshama. Note that it does not say Elokai, ata nosata cheilek atzmecha bi (ch”v).

    The posuk in Iyov, poshut pshat (remember, ein hamikra yotzei midei pshuto) is not talking about what is discussed here. See the posuk and mefarshim there. Since the amount of people who learn and know sefer Iyov nowadays is not that great, people can easily be misunderstood about what it actually says there. The answer is to go right to the source. Open up an Iyov and learn it.

    Re the posuk in Bereishis, Vayipach be’apav nishmas chayim, and the commentary on it, that is also misunderstood. If someone blows up a balloon, or a bottle of glass, the air in the bottle or balloon is not a part of the blower, rather just air. People misunderstand the mashal and take things too literally sometimes.

    #960324

    WIY
    Member

    playtime

    Its a passuk in Iyov that he cut and pasted.

    #960325

    mdd
    Member

    MHY, Good job! +1!

    #960326

    playtime
    Member

    sorry, rebdoniel.

    rebdovid’s post contains shem Hashem.

    #960327

    WIY
    Member

    MHY

    There are Kabbalah and Chassidish as well as non Chassidish seforim that say not like you. Google “Chelek Elokah Mimaal” you will find some info on this.

    #960328

    mdd
    Member

    WYI, please, read my warning above.

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