Comments on: Op-Ed: The Chutzpah of the Chareidim

By: Ein.Yerushalayemer

Ein.Yerushalayemer — Tue, 07 Aug 2012 09:15:43 +0000

Poor Soul. There are self-hating Jews and I guess there are also self-hating Chareidim.
“Where were the tehillim and tears for Gush Katif”?… “Where is the solidarity with the dati leumi?”???!!. When it happened we had plenty of empathy for them and we davened for them PRIVATELY. But public solidarity? I told my children – no way. And why? Because I said that the day they come to close down the yeshovos and hall us all off to the army the Mizrochnikim will not give one hoot about us and our concerns.
Lo Aleynu I’ve only been proven too right. Not only have they done nothing they have actually been happy allies of
Plesner in his attempt to close down the Yeshivos.
We should show solidarity with the Dati Leumi when they abandoned us to the wolves who want to destroy Klal Yisroel?
Something tells me the writer of the article doesn’t think Plesner is so terrible either.

By: wollenberg

wollenberg — Thu, 19 Jul 2012 05:46:01 +0000

to #28 most foods especially staples and children’s foods do not carry sales tax so it’s not true.

By: josh_v

josh_v — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 13:31:30 +0000

23 and 26. I agree with you. That in USA it is “need” based and in EY it is based on something else. My point is just that the USA also gives money to people so that they can sit and learn and not go out and work (I understand the point is not to let them sit and learn, the point is to help them in their time of need). The method and motive is of course different, but at the end of the day the result is the same – families are able to sit in kollel indefinitely by relying on government largess without the need to go out and work for a living.

By: uneeq

uneeq — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:34:19 +0000

“The only person who could write such a piece is one with firsthand information of the chareidi lifestyle, one who knows from the inside.”

Which is why this article is absolute junk. The author is clearly a dati leumi mizrachnik that doesn’t live in a charedi community.

Oh, your so upset that I’m assuming things? This article is one massive list of assumptions.

By: thinkingverydeeply

thinkingverydeeply — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 08:56:09 +0000

Actually I think the guy is more into letting out his anger then anything else. He knows very little about facts. He knows the lies the media feeds him. And he knows the resentment felt by the Mizrachim which believe that the Torah is kept with fighters in the Israeli army too. They are reknowned, and experts at accomadating the Chilonim, compromising on their religious needs for the sake of peace. And it really bothers them that the Charedi majority challenge this.
The Israeli political system wants to accomadate the Frum to a very large extent, in order to prove its jewishness, this especially in need when claiming that Eretz Yisroel belongs to us. The pennies the Israeli government give to the Charedim for this, is a absolute joke. Charedi families are struggling financially way worse then the fraye. This is all one big blood libel. And to see a jew who calls himself religious, and if I’m not mistaken he even claims to be Charedi, is just a joke if you ask me.
How dare people claim that Charedim on the whole are living off the Israeli government sucking her resources, enjoying the coffee given to them at kolel? Are you people being realistic? Do you know what financial difficulties these people encounter daily? I am sure most Americans would simply not put up with the limited amount of money most of these koilel people put up with. And their wives have it even harder. It is done with belief and trust in Hashem, you don’t understand it, fine. But why make us lies?
Again I am not condoning those who resort to fraud. Claiming they are koilelim when they are simply not. Fraud unfortunately exists everywhere. Everyone has a Yetzer Hara. Its a false belief that your Yetzer Hara goes away the holier you are. But the majority of Charedim are not into fraud. And if the vast majority of the Israeli Parliament which is secular wanted to get rid of all the religious issues they are funding. They could have done that a long time ago. But they don’t, and they won’t for obvious reasons. Almost every Israeli government since the creation of the state, had religious parties in its coalition, because the truth deep down is well known. And you can’t preach about a jewish state when the identity seems more secular then anything. And so the Charedim are giving plenty. Not to mention the massive chesed organisations that give to everybody including the majority being given to the fraye. And no the fraye don’t give the frum half of what the frum give them. You wanna believe otherwise. Go ahead attack, and attach yourself to the media. Live in your bubble Mr editor. I know you bitter, but please stop the fabrications.

By: y me

y me — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 07:53:23 +0000

MDShweks -
I am a Jew who made Aliyah from the US years ago and I have served in both the general Israeli world as well as the chareidi world. I thank you very much for not taking personal pot shots at me or anyone else – including the Dati Leumi yidden who learn tremendous amounts of Torah, have many wonderful gedolei haTorah upon WHOM they rely, and serve our nation in many ways (army, sherut leumi, medicine, law, businness, absorption of millions of Jews to our Land, kiruv, etc, etc, etc). I really do understand that you feel your rabbanim are the be-all and end-all of our Holy Torah but I doubt the gedolei haTorah that you quote would agree with your motzei sheim rah comments, nor would they agree with you being on the internet right now. They are true gedolim & are modest to say that they don’t have all of the answers and there are other valid opinions in the True Torah world.

That said, you are correct, one cannot run around “doing whatever you want & find some Rav.” What you are doing there is accusing huge numbers of frum yidden of doing something that they may or may not be doing. I can tell you that there are certainly some people who do what they want & then quote a Rav upon whom they rely. However, many of us truly follow the guidance of our rabbanim. When you put the word “Rav” in quotes like that, I assume you are trying to insult the status of true lomdei yisroel who have forgotten more Torah than many have even learned. Before you become so obnoxious as to make those insinuations, perhaps you should meet and learn from some of these rabbanim. Mishna Avos says that the smart man is one who learns from everyone. Is it possible that there are Torah True Jews out there, ones with semicha from a yeshiva other than YOUR’s, that understand something about our mesorah?

By the way, I strongly recommend you learn a sefer called אם הבנים שמחה (Em Habanim Semeacha) that was written during the Holocaust by a great chassidic rav, Rav Yisachar Shlomo Teichtal, while he was on the run from the Nazis. It’s been translated to English twice. He was a chareid anti-Zionist that can teach you many things. In fact, he was one of the famous chareidi giants of Europe who signed famous letters against the Zionists. Long story short – he ends up agreeing with Rav Kook’s & the Lubavitcher Rebbe’s lines of thinking while he was in hiding & writing his sefer. He carefully explains how & why he went from anti-Zionist to where he ended up (I’m not going to say he ended up as a Zionist but you can read the sefer & decide). I’m not saying you have to agree with Rav Teichtal, the Lubavitcher Rebbe, Rav Kook, or anyone else but I think you’d do well with learning what it is that they say. Learn & be humbled before you go off with nasty remarks about people you’ve never had the honor to meet.

In the meantime… my flag boy & your flag boy sitting by the fire… My flag boy said to your flag boy, gonna set you flag on fire…”

By: hardworking

hardworking — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 04:33:38 +0000

I don’t know who you are, but you seem to have an agenda against the chareidim and people that are sitting and learning. Walk into hundreds of kollelim around Eretz Yisrael and you will find THOUSANDS of bnei torah sitting and leaning dilligently with tremendous self sacrifice. Where is your respect and value for torah learning? How do you know that the bachur you see doing “whatever it is you don’t like” is not a gem in the eyes of the almighty? Imagine what the army would do to him! Yes, his “only” 5-7 hours of daily learning is very valuable in shomayim! Do you think that only “R Chaim Kanievskys” or “R’ Steinmans” or “R Elyashivs” are allowed to learn Torah? Is it only their Torah that is choshuv in the eyes of the Eibishter? Why are you so bitter? Obviously, everyone needs to have concerns and care about their fellow jew, Chareidim for Mizrachi, Dati Leumi, secular, etc. AND the Mizrachim, Dati Leumi, secular for the Chareidim. I’m not quite sure what you’re so upset about. Do you like Chareidim?

By: mdd

mdd — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 03:22:56 +0000

#28, wake up a smell the coffee!!! The non-Chareidim are the majority, and they run the show, you have to take that into account. Do you think when Yidden lived in Europe they defied the Government like that?

By: bklynmom

bklynmom — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 02:34:11 +0000

‘Those who live in Israel with large families like most Charedim do, and buy food pay huge amount of taxes from their food bills automaticaly to the tax system. Which gives the Charedim a very small amount in return’

LARGE FAMILIES HAVE LOTS OF GARBAGE AND THE TAX $$$ PAYS FOR GARBAGE PICKUP PLUS MANY SUBSIDIZED FOOD PRODUCTS (eggs, bread, cheese, milk) . So the benefits are many.

By: tayner

tayner — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 01:27:22 +0000

is it just me, or does nobody follow this guys logic? apparently he has many gripes about the frum community, and decided that now was a good time to let them all out…