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	<title>Comments on: Frum Yid Hosts Drug Dealers in Lakewood</title>
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		<title>By: KalpeiMaaleh</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108827</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[KalpeiMaaleh]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 17:09:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[Let&#039;s forget Websters for a second.  The headline reads:  &quot;Frum Yid Hosts...&quot;  Now, if you open up any frum newspaper, or other event posting, &quot;Hosting&quot; something means, in general, that a person pays money to locate something at their house or venue, in a spirit of tremendous good will.  I think it would be very hard to argue with that assertion.  Pashut, that&#039;s what &quot;hosting&quot; means.  Avraham Avinu was known as the ultimate &quot;Host.&quot;  His house was open on all four sides, the medrash tells us, no?  So when a &quot;news&quot; site uses the phrase, &quot;Frum Yid Hosts...&quot;  there is a preestablished meaning.  If you were to just do articles on Landlord-Tenant issues, your headlines would probably say, &quot;Landlord Rents....&quot; but you did not choose to do that.  You chose to use the word &quot;hosts&quot; instead of &quot;rents,&quot; which would be the most commonly used term regarding landlords and tenants.  Choosing emotionally charged, highly loaded verbage when composing your headlines, probably produces plenty of traffic.  However, that kind of writing, and you can look this one up in Websters or Oxford or the Encyclopedia Brittanica, if you like, that&#039;s called &quot;propoganda.&quot;  Propoganda is essentially sheker, manipulated by an ill-willed author with the intent to shape public opinion or create controversy for one&#039;s own unstated goals.  I&#039;ve seen the term used &quot;geneivas Daas&quot; regarding this kind of manipulation.  The same thing would apply to having ulterior motives for posting pictures of swastikas on a chareidi site, or for using the term, &quot;Bus full of Orthodox Jews,&quot; on another headline, as if the writer is not frum himself or does not know his audience.  I&#039;m not going to state what I think the ulterior motives of such writing is, but it should be clear to anyone with a modicum of seichal, why a website would want to create a firestorm.  Surely there are other motivators.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s forget Websters for a second.  The headline reads:  &#8220;Frum Yid Hosts&#8230;&#8221;  Now, if you open up any frum newspaper, or other event posting, &#8220;Hosting&#8221; something means, in general, that a person pays money to locate something at their house or venue, in a spirit of tremendous good will.  I think it would be very hard to argue with that assertion.  Pashut, that&#8217;s what &#8220;hosting&#8221; means.  Avraham Avinu was known as the ultimate &#8220;Host.&#8221;  His house was open on all four sides, the medrash tells us, no?  So when a &#8220;news&#8221; site uses the phrase, &#8220;Frum Yid Hosts&#8230;&#8221;  there is a preestablished meaning.  If you were to just do articles on Landlord-Tenant issues, your headlines would probably say, &#8220;Landlord Rents&#8230;.&#8221; but you did not choose to do that.  You chose to use the word &#8220;hosts&#8221; instead of &#8220;rents,&#8221; which would be the most commonly used term regarding landlords and tenants.  Choosing emotionally charged, highly loaded verbage when composing your headlines, probably produces plenty of traffic.  However, that kind of writing, and you can look this one up in Websters or Oxford or the Encyclopedia Brittanica, if you like, that&#8217;s called &#8220;propoganda.&#8221;  Propoganda is essentially sheker, manipulated by an ill-willed author with the intent to shape public opinion or create controversy for one&#8217;s own unstated goals.  I&#8217;ve seen the term used &#8220;geneivas Daas&#8221; regarding this kind of manipulation.  The same thing would apply to having ulterior motives for posting pictures of swastikas on a chareidi site, or for using the term, &#8220;Bus full of Orthodox Jews,&#8221; on another headline, as if the writer is not frum himself or does not know his audience.  I&#8217;m not going to state what I think the ulterior motives of such writing is, but it should be clear to anyone with a modicum of seichal, why a website would want to create a firestorm.  Surely there are other motivators.</p>
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		<title>By: Flatbush Bubby</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108667</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Flatbush Bubby]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 20:06:55 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[nfgo, please, please go to another website!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>nfgo, please, please go to another website!</p>
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		<title>By: veryinteresting</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108599</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[veryinteresting]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 14:57:49 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[This is another reason why a good education, in the language of your land, is important.  There is no cutting corners in having a complete education in addition to learning Torah.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is another reason why a good education, in the language of your land, is important.  There is no cutting corners in having a complete education in addition to learning Torah.</p>
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		<title>By: veryinteresting</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108597</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[veryinteresting]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 14:56:05 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[That is a terrible headline.  If the &quot;frum yid&quot; is a landlord, how can any landlord know the doings of who they rent to.  I think an apology is in order for the wording that a frum yid &quot;hosted&quot; a drug dealer.  The implication of connecting the landlord to the sale of drugs is false.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That is a terrible headline.  If the &#8220;frum yid&#8221; is a landlord, how can any landlord know the doings of who they rent to.  I think an apology is in order for the wording that a frum yid &#8220;hosted&#8221; a drug dealer.  The implication of connecting the landlord to the sale of drugs is false.</p>
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		<title>By: deepthinker</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108591</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[deepthinker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 14:48:07 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[I think you&#039;re all overlooking the fact that these tenants were Hispanic, and a landlord who throws out Hispanics will likely be sued by those wonderful &quot;Civil Rights&quot; law groups for &quot;discrimination.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you&#8217;re all overlooking the fact that these tenants were Hispanic, and a landlord who throws out Hispanics will likely be sued by those wonderful &#8220;Civil Rights&#8221; law groups for &#8220;discrimination.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Abisselsaichel</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108558</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Abisselsaichel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 05:20:24 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[Attn: Trachtglat. Good post, however...

The relevant translation of a news headline, is the realistic perception of its audience. If it took you that much time to research the Oxford Dictionary for this, then apparently even you, who seems a bit more sophisticated then the typical poster here, did not initially understand it as such. Certainly the typical reader&#039;s perception of &quot;host&quot; is not encyclopedic, but rather how it is used on the street, and that is, a non-paying guest. In a borrowed sense, it is similar to hilchos nedarim, or hilchos schiv merah, where the used street terminology is more important than the researched technical translation. 

Secondly,  

&quot;It also makes no difference whatsoever if the landlord rented to these specific tenants before the neighborhood’s current law-abiding citizens moved in. This is because the right to live in a decent and safe neighborhood comes before, and trumps any landlord’s right to harbor anything otherwise. Period.&quot;

Apparently, you are not familiar with hilchos Shcainim, or at least you need a chazarah. See Tshuvos HaRivash 322, Shulchan Aruch 154:32 and Rema 155:36.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Attn: Trachtglat. Good post, however&#8230;</p>
<p>The relevant translation of a news headline, is the realistic perception of its audience. If it took you that much time to research the Oxford Dictionary for this, then apparently even you, who seems a bit more sophisticated then the typical poster here, did not initially understand it as such. Certainly the typical reader&#8217;s perception of &#8220;host&#8221; is not encyclopedic, but rather how it is used on the street, and that is, a non-paying guest. In a borrowed sense, it is similar to hilchos nedarim, or hilchos schiv merah, where the used street terminology is more important than the researched technical translation. </p>
<p>Secondly,  </p>
<p>&#8220;It also makes no difference whatsoever if the landlord rented to these specific tenants before the neighborhood’s current law-abiding citizens moved in. This is because the right to live in a decent and safe neighborhood comes before, and trumps any landlord’s right to harbor anything otherwise. Period.&#8221;</p>
<p>Apparently, you are not familiar with hilchos Shcainim, or at least you need a chazarah. See Tshuvos HaRivash 322, Shulchan Aruch 154:32 and Rema 155:36.</p>
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		<title>By: toivayin</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108538</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[toivayin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 03:59:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[can someone for the sake of the tzibbur let us know the exact location of this place so that we can stay out of harm&#039;s way????]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>can someone for the sake of the tzibbur let us know the exact location of this place so that we can stay out of harm&#8217;s way????</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: trachtglat</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108519</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[trachtglat]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 02:37:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/?p=25671#comment-108519</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I believe that YWN&#039;s usage of the specific phrase &quot;Host&quot; is proper. 

First. It is consistent with the authoritative Oxford English Dictionary&#039;s definition that even when a Landlord provides lodging FOR PAYMENT he may still be referred to as a &#039;host&#039;. They cite several proofs for this definition beginning with writings from contemporary times and going back over seven hundred years. If you would research the subject correctly, you will find several more definitions than you may now realize. Though you may not be personally accustomed to using the word this way, rest assured that YWN is correct on this. 

THIS LANDLORD IS “HOSTING” THESE HOODLUMS. Everyone is ANXIOUSLY WAITING for him to do the right thing.

(There is still room for debate regarding if one can &#039;Host&#039; only with a short-term stay or also permanent housing.. but from the mashma’us of the various instances cited (ibid.) it&#039;s seems indicated that this terminology applies even with long-term lodging. Veyesh leha&#039;arich oid..)

However, even if YWN would not have been technically correct, he should still be commended for driving home the point that so many agree with. The real estate Business is no different than every other Business that has its ethical rules. When a landlord allows for a situation which impinges on people&#039;s right to live in a quality, peaceful, nuisance-free, and most importantly, crime-free neighborhood, he is in many senses complicit in the evils perpetrated by the dwellers. He is providing direct aid and is a ‘Mesyeya’ to these law-breakers and needs to answer for his action/inaction permitting the circumstances. This is an old concept found often in the Gemara.

It also makes no difference whatsoever if the landlord rented to these specific tenants before the neighborhood&#039;s current law-abiding citizens moved in. This is because the right to live in a decent and safe neighborhood comes before, and trumps any landlord&#039;s right to harbor anything otherwise. Period. Again, as was publicly stated in many earlier postings, the neighbors and community leaders have expressed their protests loud and clear.

Second. To elevate the sichas chulin, I would like to point out that there are indeed differing shitos in the Poskim, as to whether a host which accepts compensation towards lodging fulfills the Mitzvah of Hachnosas Orchim and is therefore permitted to exercise the various dinim/kulos relevant to this Mitzvah. [See Teshuvos Ateres Baruch Y”D 5,  Daas Torah O”C 306-4, Teshuvos Tzitz Eliezer 13:28-9, Teshuvos Divrei Yisroel 1:100, Teshuvos Divrei Moshe 42-4, Teshuvos V’Hanhagos 2:197, Sefer Derech Tzadikim pg. 28, v’oid..] 

So, it’s kumt ois that YWN can hold like the Poskim that one can still have the Halachic status of “Host” even while making money. U’baze Meyushav.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe that YWN&#8217;s usage of the specific phrase &#8220;Host&#8221; is proper. </p>
<p>First. It is consistent with the authoritative Oxford English Dictionary&#8217;s definition that even when a Landlord provides lodging FOR PAYMENT he may still be referred to as a &#8216;host&#8217;. They cite several proofs for this definition beginning with writings from contemporary times and going back over seven hundred years. If you would research the subject correctly, you will find several more definitions than you may now realize. Though you may not be personally accustomed to using the word this way, rest assured that YWN is correct on this. </p>
<p>THIS LANDLORD IS “HOSTING” THESE HOODLUMS. Everyone is ANXIOUSLY WAITING for him to do the right thing.</p>
<p>(There is still room for debate regarding if one can &#8216;Host&#8217; only with a short-term stay or also permanent housing.. but from the mashma’us of the various instances cited (ibid.) it&#8217;s seems indicated that this terminology applies even with long-term lodging. Veyesh leha&#8217;arich oid..)</p>
<p>However, even if YWN would not have been technically correct, he should still be commended for driving home the point that so many agree with. The real estate Business is no different than every other Business that has its ethical rules. When a landlord allows for a situation which impinges on people&#8217;s right to live in a quality, peaceful, nuisance-free, and most importantly, crime-free neighborhood, he is in many senses complicit in the evils perpetrated by the dwellers. He is providing direct aid and is a ‘Mesyeya’ to these law-breakers and needs to answer for his action/inaction permitting the circumstances. This is an old concept found often in the Gemara.</p>
<p>It also makes no difference whatsoever if the landlord rented to these specific tenants before the neighborhood&#8217;s current law-abiding citizens moved in. This is because the right to live in a decent and safe neighborhood comes before, and trumps any landlord&#8217;s right to harbor anything otherwise. Period. Again, as was publicly stated in many earlier postings, the neighbors and community leaders have expressed their protests loud and clear.</p>
<p>Second. To elevate the sichas chulin, I would like to point out that there are indeed differing shitos in the Poskim, as to whether a host which accepts compensation towards lodging fulfills the Mitzvah of Hachnosas Orchim and is therefore permitted to exercise the various dinim/kulos relevant to this Mitzvah. [See Teshuvos Ateres Baruch Y”D 5,  Daas Torah O”C 306-4, Teshuvos Tzitz Eliezer 13:28-9, Teshuvos Divrei Yisroel 1:100, Teshuvos Divrei Moshe 42-4, Teshuvos V’Hanhagos 2:197, Sefer Derech Tzadikim pg. 28, v’oid..] </p>
<p>So, it’s kumt ois that YWN can hold like the Poskim that one can still have the Halachic status of “Host” even while making money. U’baze Meyushav.</p>
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		<title>By: proud of KAJ WH TIDE</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108505</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[proud of KAJ WH TIDE]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 00:44:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[lease the landlord new exactly what his tenents were up to! He was probably involved! The Jewish community needs to wake up and deal with the social problems at hand.

Comment by miriamm
This is a classic example of an illiterate .If you can&#039;t spell or write correctly,no one will take you seriously.This remark is so stupid.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>lease the landlord new exactly what his tenents were up to! He was probably involved! The Jewish community needs to wake up and deal with the social problems at hand.</p>
<p>Comment by miriamm<br />
This is a classic example of an illiterate .If you can&#8217;t spell or write correctly,no one will take you seriously.This remark is so stupid.</p>
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		<title>By: miriamm</title>
		<link>http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/25671/frum-yid-hosts-drug-dealers-in-lakewood.html#comment-108483</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[miriamm]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Nov 2008 23:25:06 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[Please the landlord new exactly what his tenents were up to! He was  probably involved! The Jewish community needs to wake up and deal with the social problems at hand.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please the landlord new exactly what his tenents were up to! He was  probably involved! The Jewish community needs to wake up and deal with the social problems at hand.</p>
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