Comments on: Report: Lalum Goes Underground Amid Threats

By: RG

RG — Sun, 27 Jun 2010 03:04:25 +0000

I accompanied the women of the Emanuel case to the hearing on Tuesday June 22.

The Slonimer Rebbe’s sister was there.

She said, “we do not speak negatively about anyone. We hope all Jews will repent, and may we all dance together, including Yoav Lallum and his friends, at the arrival of the Moshiach.

The words of the Slonimer Rebbe’s sister.

By: apushatayid

apushatayid — Thu, 24 Jun 2010 18:12:51 +0000

Again. YOU are quoting the author of the article. The reporter is clearly extrapolating from what the Rav said. For starters, Mr. Lalum has a Rav who gave him the OK to go to the courts. Agree with that psak or not, it is irrelevant with regards to Mr. Lalums halachic right to use a secular court.

Did it ever occur to you that Rav Ovadia Shlita was decrying the fact that this had to go to secular courts, because secular courts do not generally follow the halacha and look what happened as a result of going to courts, even when within ones halachic rights to do so? I believe that is what R” Yosef was addressing, not Mr. Lalum and his portion in the world to come.

By: mw13

mw13 — Thu, 24 Jun 2010 14:16:28 +0000

#15 – “Again, you (or the reporter you are quoting) are extrapolating from the Ravs words.”
I quote: “in relation to Yoav Lalum and the Emanuel case… the Gadol HaDor decrying Lalum’s actions, quoting the Rambam regarding one who turns to secular courts that do not rule in line with Torah Law, those who don’t have a share in the next world.”
I don’t see any extrapolation, only quoting.

By: apushatayid

apushatayid — Thu, 24 Jun 2010 10:52:43 +0000

Again, you (or the reporter you are quoting) are extrapolating from the Ravs words.

(This is not relevant to what I am saying, but the Rambam quoted about going to non jewish courts doesn’t apply when one has permission from a Rav – which he reportedly was given).

And again, calling someone a liar is not the same as saying he should rot in gehennom, has no chelek in olam haba or some of the other choice “brachos” given by YWN readers.

By: mw13

mw13 — Wed, 23 Jun 2010 13:45:45 +0000

#13 – “Rav Ovadia Shlita did NOT say that… Read the reported story”
I quote:
“R’ Ovadia Shlita has spoken out many many times against those seeking to adjudicate their differences in the secular court system instead of a din torah, most recently on motzei shabbos in relation to Yoav Lalum and the Emanuel case.”
“It would appear that despite his intentions of stopping discrimination, Lalum’s actions are not being praised by Chacham Ovadia Shlita, actually quite the contrary, with the Gadol HaDor decrying Lalum’s actions, quoting the Rambam regarding one who turns to secular courts that do not rule in line with Torah Law, those who don’t have a share in the next world. “There are Rabbinical Court where they rule in adherence to Torah and not chas v’sholom courts that turn their backs on Torah”.”
“R’ Deutch, I’m sure, is someone chashuv and reliable, however, the story says he called Mr. Lalum a liar, not a rasha, not someone who should rot in gehennim and some of the other invective and vitriol heaped upon Mr. Lalum by some of the writers here.”
I am not saying that everything that is said in the comments section is true. I am, however, quoting chashuv rabbonim who have made it clear that Lalum is a “liar” and has no olam haba to repudiate #10′s claim that “not a single gadol has said anything negative about this man.”

By: apushatayid

apushatayid — Wed, 23 Jun 2010 11:38:20 +0000

MW13:

Rav Ovadia Shlita did NOT say that. That is the (erroneous) extrapolation of the person reprting the story, and (and if not the same person) the person who writes the headlines for the news briefs. Read the reported story (and after the headline, I wonder how reliable the story really is), not the headline, and if possible, read what is reported without the bias of the headline.

R’ Deutch, I’m sure, is someone chashuv and reliable, however, the story says he called Mr. Lalum a liar, not a rasha, not someone who should rot in gehennim and some of the other invective and vitriol heaped upon Mr. Lalum by some of the writers here.

By: Dr D

Dr D — Wed, 23 Jun 2010 03:08:38 +0000

Apushatayid is 100% correct. Why is Hashem having a modern day Hitler threaten us with extinction??? It also appears that the world very well may let him get his nuclear bombs and the world with Obama will just look the other way and let him use it and he knows that. Isn’t it odd that at the very time we are at each other’s throats, accusing each other of everything under the sun, with machlokes in almost every home, every community, Bobov and Bobov, Lubavitch and Lubavitch, Satmar and Satmar, Ponevisch and Ponevisch, and on and on. Chareidi and Chiloni, Chareidi and Chareidi, and on and on. At this very same time that we have nothing kind to say about each other, that the whole world has nothing kind to say about us???? At the same time that we threaten each other, now the world threatens us??? Why are we in Golus??? Because of sinas chinam, one Jew can’t get along with another Jew, children of Hashem that refuse to get along with each other. The 3 weeks are about to start, our Galus of 2,000 years and how many pogroms and slaughters of Jewish communities, and we still don’t learn. Wake up please from this madness! We are 98% alike, why are we constantly fighting over the 2% difference, making Hashem chas v’shalom and the world despise us? D’rocheha darchei noam, v’kol nesivoseha shalom, these comments are NOT the derech of Hashem. Those who attack other Jews with little knowledge of the facts, bring chas v’shalom a churban on Kllal Yisroel.

By: mw13

mw13 — Wed, 23 Jun 2010 02:52:18 +0000

#10 – “Which Gadol said Mr Lalum will rot in gehinnom?”
Rav Ovadya Yosef has said that Lalum has no Olam Haba.
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/Emanuel+School+Crisis/62963/Cacham+Ovadia:+Lalum+has+No+Place+in+Olam+Haba.html
“Everyone hides behind “the gedolim said”, yet, not a single gadol has said anything negative about this man.”
The bais din that Lalum went to to “settle” the whole affair has canceled all agreements with Lalum because “the beis din was manipulated by him to advance his agenda and to satisfy his needs regarding the media”. The Av Beis Din, Rav Avraham Dov Levine, has said that Lalum is, and I quote, a “liar and he cannot be trusted” and that “despite his denials, receives funds from non-kosher sources, including the New Israel Fund”.
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/Emanuel+School+Crisis/63023/Yerushalayim+Beis+Din+Cancels+Lalum+Agreement.html
Perhaps you should look into the matter before you decide what the Gedolim did or did not say.

By: apushatayid

apushatayid — Wed, 23 Jun 2010 00:49:32 +0000

Which Gadol condones threatening Mr Lalum and R Yosef? Which Gadol said Mr Lalum will rot in gehinnom? Is responsible for a miscarriage? Is a moser? Not a single one. Did any speaker at the marches say anything negative about Mr Lalum? Why are YWN readers? Everyone hides behind “the gedolim said”, yet, not a single gadol has said anything negative about this man. You want to be upset at his actions, fine. But the hate and invective some are heaping on this mans head are beyond the pale. To date, not a single gadol has indicated it is ok to do so.

By: mw13

mw13 — Tue, 22 Jun 2010 23:45:49 +0000

#6 – #2 was not “crying” about anything. He raised a very good point: if we don’t follow the halacha (by threatening violence, which is not called for al pi halacha), what makes us better than Lalum?