Comments on: The Two Earner Family & The Yeshiva System An Open Letter to Yeshiva Administrators

By: mytake

mytake — Fri, 05 Oct 2012 14:05:02 +0000

Just wanted to comment on the line that “fewer children will be born because of the price to educate them”. That’s not true. Maybe fewer children will be born because parents forget that tuition money comes from Hashem and He can handle the costs of educating three children just as easily as that of seven.

I’m not defending the cost of tuition. Just making a point about this particular line.

By: Dr. E

Dr. E — Fri, 05 Oct 2012 13:07:19 +0000

The writer is spot-on. It shows a disconnect between Yeshivos/Bais Yaakovs and the real world in America. Yes, in Israel Succos is a national holiday that is a fixture in the calendar. But that is not the case here. I think that many import this mindset from Israel. (the truth being that there, there is always one less day of Yom Tov). This whole notion of the bloated “Bein Hazemanim” in the Yeshiva World is based on a time in Europe when the travel itself back to Yeshiva by horse-and-buggy took a week-and-a-half! I’m glad that this letter writer is taking them to task.

The retail tuition rates are set towards dual-income families. Yet, the school calendar is skewed away from working parents, who are taken for granted. It is quite common for not only Isru Chag to be off l’chatchila. Also take a look at the week before Pesach, when instead of the cleaning/cooking help that mothers need, it is a week of clothes shopping, pizza shops and ice cream. For those who go away to family and hotels, this exacerbates the total bittul zman being created.

Come Thanksgiving and the end of December, when most parents are off and would not mind having their kids home and vacation-eligible at that time, the Yeshivos are stuck in their ideological stances that they must remain open, lest the world think that they are following the Umois Haoilam. To that I say, grow up and get over it! Your kid will still find a shidduch even if he attended a school that gave off on Thanksgiving!

The kids being off-the-wall on Isru Chag is merely a red herring that is a weak rationalization for keeping the school closed. Any half-way decent teacher will be able to be creative.

Let’s just be honest about this. School Administrators want a “travel day” for both themselves as well as their traveling Koillel kids and eniklach.

Let there be more dual-earner couples bringing in income to the community and then we can pay the teachers more, including the expectation that they will be back at work the day after YT like the rest of America.

By: SIZ

SIZ — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 22:09:39 +0000

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR WRITING THIS IMPORTANT LETTER. THANK YOU. And the point about people feeling concerned about having more children as the tuition is too expensive to afford is absolutely true. Readers, you can judge it all you want, but it is a fact, and as a community, it this issue must be addressed.

By: abcd2

abcd2 — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 20:55:03 +0000

along this line of thought:
A) I do not understand why all yeshivas cannot get together and make a standard week for winter vacation.(I am not saying that they should all give the same amount of time off but at least during the same week.) It sometimes means killing two weeks at work. I really do think that this is something that parents if organized in a letter writing campaign can demand from our schools.

B) Why do most preschools end between 2-3:30 pm? And even during the summer months almost all yeshivas prek-mesivta end bet 12-1 pm Erev Shabbos?How are we expected to pay tuition if school hours make it hard to find decent work or a huge chunk of salary goes to a babysitter. There is no reason why prek should end before 4pm.If certain kids might be tired at that time of day so use it as free play and arts and craft time. Most people are working dual incomes just to pay tuition. The schools should give parents that extra hour a day.

I think the realization about a connection between parents working = teachers getting paid is sometimes lost in the collective conscious of parents and teachers alike.

With my above suggestion I would ask a typical pre-school teacher to look at it from an objective perspective. In a full month (a rarity except for cheshvan due to the nature of our calendar)you work between 92-110(5-6 hours mon-thurs, fridays 3-3.5 hours) hours. 9-4 is still not full-time and of course there are summers, Fridays, winter and yom tov vacations etc…
Additionally, we must lobby our schools that on friday Yeshiva for all grades should not end earlier then 1pm. In the spring after we change the clock there is between 6-8 hours after dismissal to get ready for Shabbos. Why are we dismissing are kids from Torah Learning and a safe environment before it is even Chatzos Hayom? It does not make any sense!

These minimally longer hours would be most beneficial to the under age 40 crowd in the school who are the ones with the most kids in pre-k-middle grades and struggle most with balancing tuition needs and family.(I write balancing tuition needs and family as opposed to work and family as 90% of the time most mothers are working as much as they do or undertake post grad education solely for tuition)

The short extra time the schools give can only help the tuition crisis, and might even better enable parents to pay more regularly or to have less parents dependent upon scholarships.

By: Gadolhadorah

Gadolhadorah — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 20:21:14 +0000

I think the vast majority of posters agree that this isru chag “day off” meshugaas has to end and hopefully soon. Some of the rather bizarre arguments only reinforce the notion that this is simply a way of giving more perks to menahallim and teachers. Since when is there a “special cost” to yom tov that requires yidden to go their parents’ homes? Last time I checked, making yom tov cost no more or less than making shabbos and you simply adjust your budget to your income. If you cannot afford prime rib every night for dinner, get by with flanken, chicken or Tofu. why do teachers need a special day off before or after yom tov to build a succah, change the dishes for pesach etc. So do ALL OF US who work, and we don’t get a paid day off to do so. Why are your kids “crazy” mozti yom tov?? If you cannot control them, them you have bigger problems but not a reason to close the schools?

Pleeeeese, enough with these rather silly reasons for a day off from work.

By: ChanieE

ChanieE — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 19:37:28 +0000

A follow-up about arranging childcare at school …

Yes, paying for babysitting on top of paying tuition is hard, but my experience has been that just finding a caregiver is even harder. I don’t know of a babysitter who is sitting around waiting for you to call her on an as-needed basis. For a while I had arrangements for the school bus to drop off at a babysitter straight from school, but this woman did not take in other kids when her own children had off so here I was, with a system in place, but I still had no coverage for erev yom tov, isru chag, mid-winter vacation, snow days or the weeks between school and day camp. I managed because I have been incredibly fortunate to have a lot of flexibility in my jobs, but many parents don’t have that.

Where are we supposed to FIND appropriate childcare for all this time off? And the letter writer is 100% correct that the last-minute decision not have school throws everyone for a loop.

By: computerbubby

computerbubby — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 18:51:00 +0000

To number 33, you must be the exception. The administrators I know personally (& I’m related to some!) DO drive fancy new cars (as do their wives & kids) their homes (all of them, summer, winter & in Florida & Israel) are magnificent. Should I continue? Don’t insult us with the “poor me, I suffer too” response. We may be long suffering and unable to change the system but we aren’t stupid.

By: hendoner

hendoner — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 18:21:11 +0000

From what I understand from this excellent letter is that whereas the writer is paying full tuition, others are not. Effectively therefore, his payment is going towards the unpaid tuition of others. It is therefore a Tzedokoh contribution and part of his tuition payments should be allowable when he comes to calculate his Tzedokoh payments.

By: eman

eman — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 18:20:46 +0000

I am a working person and I have business requirements deliverable by Monday. I was 4 hours away from home on the first days yet we drove back on Tuesday night.

By: facts1

facts1 — Thu, 04 Oct 2012 18:14:29 +0000

#33

Bais Sarah in BP, a privately held schools somehow manages to charge less then $3000.00 per child, has excellent teachers and has never missed a paycheck. No, the owner is not a millionaire or a good fundraiser, he doesnt fund-raise at all.

Schools can cover themselves if they just manage their books properly and follow the money trail.

FACT! Many administrators or higher ups do tend to live lavish lifestyles.