October 25, 2013 9:44 pm at 9:44 pm #611033
I am trying to locate a teshuva from ?’ ????? ?????? about ??? ???? ?????, It also briefly discussed ??? ???? ?????.
if any one knows where it is . or can help me find it, i would be very makir tov.October 27, 2013 2:53 am at 2:53 am #1004749
attn otzar hachochma experts or hebrewbooks.org can you help me?December 10, 2013 4:02 pm at 4:02 pm #1004750February 16, 2014 3:31 pm at 3:31 pm #1004751
BTW – would u have any idea why rabbi wosner says in todays days the din might be more chamoor?
Maybe since fish oil supplements became common, with the fish oil encapsulated but not mixed with anything, he’s ???? that it’s become ???? ?????.February 16, 2014 5:06 pm at 5:06 pm #1004752rabbiofberlinParticipant
DaasYochid: you have an uncanny ability to find virtually everything in Hebrewbooks! or maybe you are just that more proficient with the computer than me! (not very difficult, I am practically illiterate in computer skills)
Thanks for showing the source! BTW- I wonder how one fits that psak in with the so-called “kula-ization’ of yiddishkeit….February 16, 2014 5:32 pm at 5:32 pm #1004753
Rabbiofberlin, thank you for the compliment.
As far as your second point, I will make the precise point I was trying to make about fruits and vegetable; when the metzius changes, the halacha must be evaluated anew. When new infestation is discovered, the old methods of inspection and washing may become irrelevant, and possibly, when an item recently becomes commonly eaten, the old status of “shelo k’derech achilah” changes.
The halacha didn’t change, nor did our approach to halacha change; its application to a particular item changed.February 16, 2014 6:16 pm at 6:16 pm #1004754rabbiofberlinParticipant
DaasYochid: must be off to mincha and I don’t want to start that debate again. i fully agree with you about the change in “metzius”. However, I have not seen anyone argue that the fruits and vegetabales are MORE infested now than before….February 16, 2014 8:23 pm at 8:23 pm #1004755ItcheSrulikMember
DY: That being said, I still don’t understand how the fact that more people take fish supplements should force us to reevaluate how we apply the din of derech achila to pills. Could you explain, or point me to a canonical definition of derech achila that would cover it?
rob: I don’t think anyone worth listening to is arguing that. They are arguing that different vegetables are infested than before, or that we are eating different vegetables than before and therefore have to reevaluate what is muchzak b’tolaim and what isn’t. A good place to start is ??? ???? ????? which lays out definitions of muchzak b’tolaim, miut hamatzui, nir’eh l’anayim and so on. (I’ve been avoiding the bug wars here because I don’t have my own copy to look things up in and I haven’t done hilchos tolaim yet).February 16, 2014 9:49 pm at 9:49 pm #1004756
IS, the Shevet Haleivi is going according to the Mishnah L’melech and Noda Bi’Yehuda that swallowing without chewing is still considered derech achilah. The fish oil is still not derech achilah, because it’s not a substance consumed on its own.
If fish oil became a substance which is consumed on its own, then although according to the Toras Chaim’s definition of shelo k’derech achilasan it would still be muttar to swallow it as a pill, but would become assur according to the ML”M and NB”Y.
I am not sure if he is only m’supak if it changed l’issur because he’s not sure that it’s common enough to be considered k’derech achilasan, because he’s not sure that even according to the ML”M the proliferation of swallowing pills makes something as a pill makes it kd”a, or because he’s not sure how to pasken in that machlokes.February 17, 2014 12:23 am at 12:23 am #1004757
THANKS FOR THE SEVORAH DASS YOCHID–
how did you get e/o to follow you to the old thread?February 17, 2014 1:00 am at 1:00 am #1004758
You’re welcome. They followed me here when I posted on this thread.February 17, 2014 4:21 am at 4:21 am #1004759ItcheSrulikMember
DY: Thank you. I might add another safek whether even if swallowing without chewing might be derech achila according to ml’m, it wouldn’t be if the thing being swallowed is never “eaten” any other way and is not eaten for nourishment in any case. After all, we’re talking about something that is essentially refua and the question is the description of how the refua is administered. AFAIK Rav Moshe, Rav Tendler, Rav Asher Weiss and many others pasken that swallowing something not meant to be chewed is not derech achila (the determination being talui in the pill as well as how it’s taken) but I don’t claim to know anything at all about medical halacha.February 17, 2014 4:40 am at 4:40 am #1004760
I think that’s the same as my second possibility, which was supposed to read: “because he’s not sure that even according to the ML”M, the proliferation of swallowing something as a pill makes it kd”a”.February 17, 2014 4:59 am at 4:59 am #1004761
DASS YACHID – DO YOU MEAN TO SAY THAT RAV WONSNER SHLITA WOULD NOT AGREE TO TAKE any traifah medicine ina capsule. (HE never discussed capsules but only discussed drinking fish oil plain)
BTW this is very noggea l.masseh because there is a prescription drug called lovaza which is madw from 100% fish oil.
many people take vitamin fish oil but that you can get with a hechsherFebruary 17, 2014 5:19 am at 5:19 am #1004762
I’m not sure if you’re asking about gelatin capsules in general (he is mattir), or fish oil capsules (at worst, he says “yitochen” that it changed for the worse).
Lovaza undergoes a process called esterification, so that might be a consideration, but more importantly, its purpose is to lower cholesterol, so if it is the most effective medication available, for a particular patient, it might be a situation of pikuach nefesh.
In short, it’s not a question for the CR, but for a posek mumcheh.February 18, 2014 2:39 am at 2:39 am #1004763
DY -THE REASON WHY WE DISCUSS HALACHAH IN THE CR Is because an educated consumer always does best.
Just like when you see a dr,if you are well read on the subject you will ask better questions and understand the dr better and avoid misunderstandings
the same is true when you speak to ur LOR u are always better off if you are some aht familiar with the subject b4 discussing it with the LOR.February 18, 2014 2:43 am at 2:43 am #1004764
DY-now- there are those who say that any traifah med can be swallowed in a tissue or a veg cap.
my QUESTION TO RABBI YACHID IS id r vozner just not ok with drinking fish oil plain (or yitochen) or the whole heter of a capsule being “korcheh bisiv” is being “yitochen’ that it changed for chumrahFebruary 18, 2014 1:54 pm at 1:54 pm #1004765
I don’t know what he holds about pills, but the yitochein seems to address plain fish oil.February 18, 2014 7:33 pm at 7:33 pm #1004766
SO THE QUESTION REMAINS IS LOVAZA MUTTER BASED ON TEH FACT IT IS IN A CAPSULE?
OR WUD R VOZNER say that perhaps the halacha changed?
does anyone have any input from any other poskim on this matterFebruary 19, 2014 6:48 am at 6:48 am #1004767👑RebYidd23Participant
Halocha or circumstance?February 19, 2014 12:21 pm at 12:21 pm #1004768
The capsule itself is probably gelatin based.February 20, 2014 4:05 am at 4:05 am #1004769
THE CAPSULE RABBI WOSNER WAS MATTIR—
the question is about teh traifah fish oil in the capasule.
aprox 100 yrs ago the mhari halevi wss mattir that. however would rabbi vosner say that the capsule heter perhaps changed?February 20, 2014 4:48 am at 4:48 am #1004770scroller2Member
??”? ???? ???? ??? ? – ???? ???? ???? ??
??? ????? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ??? ????, ????? ????? ?”? ???? ????? ???? ???? ????? ?????? ?????? ????, ??????? ??? ????, ??? ???? ??”? (??’ ??? ??”?) ???????.February 21, 2014 8:34 pm at 8:34 pm #1004771
SCROLLER HOW DO U KNOW THAT LOVAZA WAS ?????
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