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It seems divorced women have a poorer remarriage prospect than divorced guys. Firstly, there are more women than men in the general shidduch pool, due to the age gap. So, some girls never get married in the first place (much more so than men.) Then, when a divorced guy is looking to remarry, his potential shidduch pool consists of the never married girls (left over due to the age gap) PLUS the pool of divorced women. OTOH, divorced women’s shidduch pool consists of divorced men. (This is all generally speaking. Of course there are exceptions where a divorced woman might marry a never married guy, but that is exceedingly rare.)
And on top of all this, considering her pool is mainly of divorced guys, this pool often has big issues. After all, they got divorced for a reason. So, many from this pool are very poor marriage prospects. And taking them out of consideration as marriage partners, your pool is further severely reduced. So the fact remains, for these hosts of reasons many divorced women will never be able to remarry unfortunately.
And even if she does remarry, she never knows if her new marriage will be any better than her first. It may even be worse. Then what? Divorced again, and try to marry a third time?
Which all leads to the serious thought if divorcing was worth in in the first place. Or if, perhaps, the better alternative would have been to live with whatever issues or problems existed in ones first marriage, rather than throw the dice into the unknown abyss.
and what was the point of this post? A lot of what u said is harsh, unfairly judging, stereotyping, lumping wrongly, and just wrong and mean. IMO of course.
postal, Its not our job to make these types of cheshbonos, in my opinion. If it is the right thing for a person to get divorced, that doesn’t change later. If they rashly decided to get divorced, they shouldn’t’ve done that irrespective of their new ‘chances’ to get married. Most people don’t get divorced thinking about their new marriage prospects. Its a neccessary evil to get out of a problematic situation. For the record, i know personally many divorced women who did get remarried, as well as divorced men who never remarried. The bottom line is that a person has to take each challenge in their life as is comes and handle each one with thought and da’as torah. With that you can’t go wrong.
Chas V’shlaom, she may have to marry someone who actually works for a living.
Interesting observation. My wife had a neighbor that got divorced 5 yrs after getting married and never got remarried. Its been like 13 yrs, scary. He got remarried not long after their divorce.
Among goyim, divorced people are more likely to get married than single people the same age who have never been married. I suspect that is the same among us. It would be interesting if someone figured out a way to do statistics.
My wife was divorced, and she’s the best thing that’s ever happened to me. I’d be nothing without her. And she has a daughter from her first marriage, now age 21, who’s a very dear and accomplished person with lots of potential. And, to make sure she would turn out that way, we made a point of remaining on friendly, civil terms, with my wife’s former husband.
Unlike the posts above, it sounds to me like you are feeling frustrated, and even hurt. I’d just like to tell you, don’t give up. Be yourself, daven a lot, and ask Hashem to help you find the one who’s really right for you.
Postal:
I struggle to appreciate your rationale. If a divorced guy (DG) has a pool of Divorced women (DW) as an option, then dws have a pool of dgs. Meaning, if a dg marries a dw then automatically a dw is marrying a dg. therefore it stands to reason that dgs and dws have equal chances with each other.
Therefore the only advantage for dg over dw – according to what you were trying to suggest – is the “availablity” of unmarried women to dgs whereas there are few unmarried men for dws!
As for the serious thought you mention at the end, IMO no-one in their right mind will opt to remain in an unstable marriage especially if it involves violence, just because of someones non-scientific survey on what is available in the market and some ones theory of their remarriage chances?!
Hi postal.
I hear what you are saying, and it makes sense.
I wonder why this site does not have a shidduch section, or something.
Being a single man, and I am sure there are others on this site who may be able to relate, I would consider meeting someone for marriage, yet I read posts from ladies here saying they are having a hard time.
So, here I am, and people like me, reading about someone having a hard time. And there is the other person, with the hard time, on the other side of the computer, and there is no bridge in between.
The irony of technology.
Anyway, hatzlacha to everyone in any situation or condition. We all deserve to find our other half and must believe they are, in fact, out there somewhere.
BTguy: there are many frum dating websites..
“Which all leads to the serious thought if divorcing was worth in in the first place. Or if, perhaps, the better alternative would have been to live with whatever issues or problems existed in ones first marriage, rather than throw the dice into the unknown abyss.”
And it is even harder for the divorcee, because she loses an entire subset of eligible men – Kohanim. Which is why, BTW, when my friend’s ex-husband refused to give her a GET for well over a decade, though he was a known wife abuser, her rabbonim notified her ex that on such and such a day the entire kehillah was getting together to say Tehillim and daven for her to be kosher to marry a Kohein. She had the GET almost immediately thereafter.
The better alternative to divorce IMO, is not to get married too quickly without really knowing someone a great deal better than most couples do nowadays. And though dating for a longer period of time is no guarantee of compatibility, it nonetheless helps to underscore certain character issues that often do not reveal themselves in the first few weeks of a budding relationship, the “honeymoon” phase of dating. It really is only when someone lets his/her guard down, that certain personality issues become more evident. I don’t think couples should shlep around either, for long periods of time, but I have seen too many 5-week wonders that culminated in divorce within the first year (some within the first 3 months).
Hi PBA.
Should people like me just google “frum or orthodox dating sites”?
Are there some which are known to be particularly good?
We have had threads about them before.
Try Saw you at sinai, and also frumster.
Thank you PBA! It is greatly appreciated.
Also, postal, while statistics represent what is going on to a degree, they say, “The road is not the map”. Don’t be discouraged because of the statistics. Individuals with all kinds of individual issues are finding someone every day.
Hatzlacha!
I love how the fact that a guy was divorced means that they probably have issues “after all they got divorced for a reason”, but when a girl gets divorced her ex was the one with the issues. Stop blaming everything on the guys. Maybe there’s a reason these girls (single or divorced) are not married.
postal: And on top of all this, considering her pool is mainly of divorced guys, this pool often has big issues. After all, they got divorced for a reason.
This may true but by the same logic, the opposite is also true. That divorced women also have big issues. Hence from that perspective they are equal.
MCP: You beat me to the punch.
BTguy: I didn’t go with computer dating sites. I tried a “frum” dating service a couple of times, but with no luck. Actually, the way I met my wife was that she and her daughter came into shul where she baked the cakes for Shabbos Kiddush. I’d come in to talk to the Rov about my dating problems. . . .
postal, if a marriage is truly dysfunctional, then all these practical considerations aren’t important. It really is better to be single forever *gasp* than be emotionally or spiritually destroyed. I think that you are making this cheshbon becasue you think that most divorces really don’t center around such issues. I have no idea if that’s true or not, but any rate, this is bad advice to give across the board.
Marriage requires constant effort and work by both parties. The expectations are different today than they might have been in our parents and grandparents times. What is of utmost importance is to treat your spouse with respect and not to take each other for granted.
Simple as it sounds its adherence affects every waking moment of the day.
All problems usually start from failure to respect these tenets.
This is not to say that sometimes people are genuinely non compatible and should seek counselling. Divorce should be a last resort and not a quick exit strategy as it is today.
For the most part, most people are not better off after a divorce unless there was physical or emotional abuse taking place.
I strongly believe that just as there are chosson and kallah classes, there shiuld be pre marital classes required for all engaged couples be they Litvish Chassidish YU type etc. We are all subject to the same knee jerk human behavior that has to be controlled when one gets married.
PS. They once asked this couple who were married 40 years as to whether either one ever contemplated divorce. The husband responded by saying : Never divorce but quite often murder 🙂
postal: I have an issue with the way you are presenting this issue. Your very utopian outlook and unrealistic concerns are telling me that you don’t know very much about the reality of divorce. (See, I can jump to conclusions, too.) So you should probably stop while you’re ahead.
Postal- Being a divorced man I must tell you that no, you don’t stay married because of the thought 2nd time may not be better. If a couple is getting divorced there better be good reason for it, and I agree with the poster that said better to be single ur whole life than to stay in an abusive relatinship or for that matter a horrible relationship that can’t be fixed and I mean no way to fix it. There are instances where you can be the best spouce possible but that won’t do anything for the marriage. I experienced it. As far as the guys being the trouble, I don’t know where u got that from, every divorce is different at times they’re both “good” people but not for eachother at all. And at times one may never be a good spouce to anyone they’ll marry. Well all I can tell you is that all the stats and all the data of divorced people, good or bad, there’s a creator who runs the show and sends one they’re zivug sheini too, its not at all different than the first time around in this respect. As far as the hishtadlus part that we do, It definately reccomended to spend more time with the prospective husband or wife before deciding to get engaged so you get a real feeling and understanding of who they are. Date for months if that’s what’s it takes. And to all those out there looking for ur spouce first timers or second, Hashem is the one you should be talking to, after all its all in his hands.
Experience shows, that most people who have been divorced, Davka wish to remarry, to a divorce[e] and not a never married, as it is easier to relate to & identify with someone who has also been down this same ugly path of divorce.
Gee thanx Postal. But i hafta disagree. For sum reason I have more prospects now then my first time around. its wierd. (maybe cuz my mothers friends r in a frenzy trying to set me up..?)
And regarding ur advice-dont worry. Most Beis Dins do NOT make it easy for a couple to get divorced. They will warn the girl that it will not be easy for her and she may never get remarried. A woman does not have it within her nature to go searching once shes already in a relationship. Usually they stay way longer then is good for them. If she is thinking of leaving its usually neccesary. Women r terrified of being alone. Why rub it in? Theres alot of craziness in the world today. Lets open r eyes a liiiitle. Divorce is destructive and sometimes destruction is GOOD.
..dont think i just made grammatical sence but my thoughts were downloading too quick..
Tot 147! Those regular people.. they just wont get it..
postal -“It seems divorced women have a poorer remarriage prospect than divorced guys.”
Basically your theory is that divorced women have a smaller pool than divorced men.
Well I think that your theory is false. A lot of divorced women don’t want to ever remarry or at least till their kids are grown.
A lot of older girls won’t go out with divorced guys, even though some will.
So either the pools are about equal or there are more divorced men than divorced women looking to remarry!
Hi PBT.
That is a very nice story. Thank you for sharing that.
I sometimes see someone that may be interested (not wearing a sheitel, of course), then I dont know what is acceptable to get to the next step.
You should see me walking around on Shabbos. Anytime a female of any age is on the same side of the sidewalk, even seeming miles away, I cross to the other side. I zig zag the whole day. Great exercise.
Well, I will keep my eyes open and believe Hashem’s plan is out there waiting to meet me.
Hi Health.
Really?
Speaking of false and true. How did you determine “a lot” of divorced women dont want to remarry.
Also, how did you determine “a lot” of older girls wont go out with divorced guys.
Specifically, how many do you know that drove you to conclude ‘a lot” versus, say “a few”?
Kindly (key word is kindly) let us know “about” how many women in each case did you determine this to be true. 2500? 3000? Are you talking about any specific communities?
Being that you are a person of science, I hope you have genuine data and did not call out someone’s view for being false based on a hunch, similar to what you would feel if you believe you picked the correct, winning lottery numbers.
How many is a lot, and how did you come to hear their opinions on the matter?
BTGuy -“Hi Health.
Really?
Speaking of false and true. How did you determine “a lot” of divorced women dont want to remarry.”
Just a piece of advice -if you want to be able to get married -don’t always look for an argument or a fight. These are my opinions, just like e/o else here -they are stating their opinions. Do you know the difference between opinion & fact?
“Also, how did you determine “a lot” of older girls wont go out with divorced guys.
Specifically, how many do you know that drove you to conclude ‘a lot” versus, say “a few”?
Being that you are a person of science, I hope you have genuine data and did not call out someone’s view for being false based on a hunch, similar to what you would feel if you believe you picked the correct, winning lottery numbers.
How many is a lot, and how did you come to hear their opinions on the matter?”
Just for your info, my opinion is based on my own personal observations, not from any statistical analysis that I have done.
But, I think you know this, but for some reason you like to argue with me. You also know that e/o else’s opinion here is also not based on any statistics. So there is no right and wrong, just opinions!
And btw, when I post something that I consider as fact -I say so.
This is usually when I post something regarding (medical) science!
Hi Health.
Calm down.
Your loss of footing and back peddling is very transparent, so save the coverups.
Sadly, your “points” are set ups for anger and hate.
I see tremendous flaws in a lot of what you say and thought you would not mind a two-way conversation, especially since you are very energized and happy to “correct” others.
The bitterness and seeming vengeance is so far outside the scope of the conversation, that I wonder if you are not classified with some sort of temperament issue. I will go easier to not offend you if that is the case.
But perhaps you, too, can have a lighter touch when disagreeing with someone.
Somewhere I read something to the effect:
“Kindness is the highest form of wisdom.” ~ The Talmud.
I will try to embrace that realize there may be a good
reason you are WAY more sensitive to getting criticism
than you are to giving it out.
Health & BTGuy, quit this, now. What are you two, monkeys in a cage with too much testosterone? Argh. What happened to ignoring insults?
As for the topic: I think postal is quite right, however, as several others have already mentioned as well, the fact that many divorced men have ‘problems’ applies to the ladies equally so.
BTGuy -“Calm down.”
I am calm. Your posts to me -don’t upset me the least.
“Your loss of footing and back peddling is very transparent, so save the coverups.”
As far as I know -I haven’t covered anything up, nor have I lost my footing or done any back peddling.
“Sadly, your “points” are set ups for anger and hate.”
I see nothing in my posts that would cause even a guy on the edge to get angry & start hating me.
“I see tremendous flaws in a lot of what you say and thought you would not mind a two-way conversation, especially since you are very energized and happy to “correct” others.”
Of course you do -that’s why I posted what I did to you above. I have no problem having a two-way convo -if it goes like this -My opinion differs because of so & so; not when it goes -prove it you’re wrong.
“The bitterness and seeming vengeance is so far outside the scope of the conversation, that I wonder if you are not classified with some sort of temperament issue. I will go easier to not offend you if that is the case.
I will try to embrace that realize there may be a good
reason you are WAY more sensitive to getting criticism
than you are to giving it out.”
It’s time you start looking in the mirror. Did you ever hear of the saying -Kol Hapoisel B’momo Posel?
My response to posts are based on the post, not on the SN beside them!
I come here and post my opinions -if you want a reply you have to explain your opposition. I’m not going to respond to “prove it or who said so?”
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