Punishment for Adulteress

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  • #604616
    avhaben
    Participant

    Why is an adulteress executed in front of her father’s house? Because the assumption is he brought her up wrong leading to her sinning. But if she sinner many years after getting married (i.e. after 20 – 30 years of marriage), why should her father be at fault?

    #892202
    ✡onegoal™
    Participant

    It all starts somewhere. It may have started years ago but it still started there.

    #892203
    vochindik
    Member

    Is it done in front of the father’s house in all cases? I thought that was when the aveira occurred in his home. (i.e. Between the erusin and the nesuin.)

    #892204
    Sam2
    Participant

    I also thought that was only for the Na’arah M’urasa (and I thought it was at the Sha’ar Ha’ir, but that I could easily be mistaken on).

    #892205
    Health
    Participant

    vochindik – I agree. I think it’s only for a Naarah.

    #892206
    Health
    Participant

    Sam – Pins on you. I posted before yours was up.

    #892207
    avhaben
    Participant

    A Kohen’s daughter who is guilty of this is burnt rather than strangulated. Reason being that she embarassed her father with her sin, since people will say he didn’t teach her right as a child. So the idea of the father bearing some fault seems to be accurate.

    #892208
    akuperma
    Participant

    It is unlikely anyone was ever executed for “adultery” since people normally don’t do that sort of stuff with witnesses (not to mention warning).

    #892209
    ScooterJew613
    Participant

    Only punishment she really gets if she is m’zanah with another Jew by a goy this doesn’t apply. She also doesnt get punished either if its with a goy. The Rambam has a whole sheitah on this and is also in his Misha Torah. Many other people poskin like the Ramban too.

    #892210
    walton157
    Member

    What is the punishment if a man cheats on his wife?

    #892211

    If the woman is married(and there is eidim and hasraah), the man gets killed. If she is single, he has to marry her and can never divorce her. If he is ashkenazi, he probably has to give her father 50 silver coins.

    It could be he also get lashes for violating the “Lo tihie kedeisha,” though it may depend if thats what she was.

    All this is in addition to kares, which he gets if she was a niddah.

    If she was not a niddah, she was probably under age, which would be statuatory rape, and hell probably go to jail.

    If she was not a niddah and not underage, she is probably about to get married, and her fiance will probably kill them both.

    #892212
    Sam2
    Participant

    Akuperma: It’s unlikely that very many people were ever killed by Beis Din with the necessity for Hasra’ah.

    #892213
    avhaben
    Participant

    Walton: It depends. If it was with a nidda or goy, I think it is lashes. If it was with an eishes ish, then misa (if hasara and eidim.) If with a non-nida, then afaik nothing.

    Scooter: Sure she’s punished if with a goy, just its a machlokes whether its misa or not. Certainly she loses her kesuba and must be divorced.

    akuperma: IIRC, the gemora cites actual cases it occurred.

    #892214
    Sam2
    Participant

    Avhaben: It’s a Machlokes Rishonim whether she must be divorced if it’s with a Goy.

    #892215
    vochindik
    Member

    Sam2: It’s a machlokes even if it was consensual on her part?

    #892216
    ScooterJew613
    Participant

    Ahaven Esther wasn’t punished

    #892217
    Sam2
    Participant

    Vochindik: I believe that’s what Rabbeinu Tam says, yes. If it’s not consensual then she is Muttar to her husband even if it’s a Jew (unless her husband is a Kohen).

    #892218
    yitzchokm
    Participant

    ScooterJew613-

    Don’t you think Esther was a bit different? She was forced into it!

    #892219
    ScooterJew613
    Participant

    yitzchokm

    Go back and check your Megillah, the first few times she was forced and the Midrash says her neshama left he body during Biah. However on the other nights when she sought out the King she seduced the King. The Rabbanu Tam (i believe and sure The Rambam both clearly state that she was not forced under that circumstance along with many other rishonim. Therefore Tozfos sites a source along with Rambam that a women is not held punishable if she has relations with a goy. EVEN when she is a niddah. Goyim dont have the mitzvah of niddah and are therfore putar.

    I am not saying I agree its a tough pill to swallow in A rav in 5 towns gave a shmuz on this I dont hear so I can say his name but I went and asked a rebbi of mine in Ner Yisrael Rav Singer and he personally showed me the sources.

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