The Riddle Thread….

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  • #1068244

    Dr. Pepper-

    I’ll b’n give it a shot, but your challenge is quite likely beyond my math skill level (& smarts). I need some time, though, so some other math maven may rescue me – ..er I mean beat me to the solution in the meantime.

    I agree with “The Big One” that you come across as older than you are for several reasons: 1) A math PhD is more common among older folks (like me, but sans degree). 2) Your experience as a teacher 3) Your style of speech is more comfortable and mature, and less “reactionary” than some younger posters. 4) Precise word usage, accurate grammar and accurate word spelling.

    The fact that you B”H just had a mazel tov clued me in that you were a bit younger than my first impression. If I had to, I’d guess that this is your first (you mentioned the nachas you and your wife are B”H having, but not sibling reactions, as well as a detail or two first-time parents focus on more), but I’ve been wrong before.

    #1068245

    squeak
    Participant

    Sorry that I dropped that riddle and then left. I meant to look up the source before I posted the answer, but I just haven’t had the time. Maybe someone here can post the source after seeing the answer.

    The Halacha says that a person is required to bow down at the words Modim Anachnu Loch. (The gemara says that one who does not bow down by Modim loses the chance to be part of techiyas hamaisim.) The Halacha also states other specific points in Shemona Esrai where one bows down. But one is not allowed to bow at extra points in the Shemona Esrai because doing so will create confusion.

    There is a shittah that if one is about to start the silent Shemona Esrai while the Chazzan is repeating it out loud, and it is clear that the chazzan will reach Modim before one is finished with his own Shemona Esrai, then one may not daven Shemona Esrai because he will not be able to bow down. He cannot bow down when the Chazzan reaches Modim because one can only bow at specific points in Shemona Esrai and therefore one may not daven until after the Chazzan passes Modim.

    P.S. I am virtually certain that this is not how we pasken lehalacha. It is just a riddle, and there IS a source (which can be found in a Shulchan Aruch). Can someone else find it and post?

    #1068247

    moish01
    Member

    ok what’s the code in this:

    ??”? ?”? ?”? ???”?

    no hints – it’ll give it away!

    #1068248

    squeak
    Participant

    Um, maybe the office was on a low gravity planet, like Mars (or Vespa to be more realistic)?

    On that note, here’s a similar riddle: If an Olympic high jumper can vault a bar 5 feet off the ground (on planet Earth), how high a bar can he clear on the Moon, assuming gravity on the moon is 1/6 of Earth gravity? (If you need to make assumptions in your answer, be sure to state them).

    #1068249

    veyatziv
    Member

    ames

    Just guessing- He didn’t fall to the ground. He fell onto the 21st floor porch or something.

    or- He was wearing a parachute and forgot to unfasten it before he jumped

    #1068251

    Dr. Pepper
    Participant

    ames-

    “and jumped through it”, when he jumped through it was he going from inside to outside or from outside to inside?

    #1068255

    Dr. Pepper
    Participant

    ames-

    Please don’t confuse me with the drink. The drink is Dr Pepper (without the period).

    #1068256

    teen
    Member

    ames: not really the ground πŸ™‚

    #1068257

    squeak
    Participant

    no, ames. The moon has gravity just like any other object, so the astronaut will be drawn back to its surface. Just with less acceleration than on planet Earth.

    P.S. I think my solution to your riddle should be acceptable too, providing that you replace “Mars” with a planet that has a lower gravitational pull. Falling 210 feet would not create a dangerous velocity if we assume that the gravitational pull is sufficiently low.

    SJS or Dr. Pepper should be able to reverse engineer the maximum acceleration that would allow such jump to be safe.

    #1068259

    squeak
    Participant

    Nobody???

    OK, a possible answer can be reasoned as follows:

    Assume a high-jumper is a 6 feet tall man who can vault a 5 foot bar. Further assume that the center of gravity on such a man is 3.5 feet off the ground. Therefore, to jump over the bar he must raise his center of gravity by 2.5 feet.

    On the moon, gravity is 1/6 that of Earth. So a jumper could achieve 6 times the height he could on Earth. The high jumper would be able to raise his center of gravity by 2.5 * 6, or 15 feet in a moon jump. Add back to that the height of his center of gravity, which is 3.5 feet, and you get that he can jump over a bar that is 18.5 feet off the ground.

    #1068260

    moish01
    Member

    hey squeak no one knew mine and that’s a jewish one. shame you in people!

    #1068262

    squeak
    Participant

    But don’t worry, moish, I know the answer, I just didn’t want to post it. It appears in Megillah 32b regarding the daled parshios we lain this time of year.

    #1068263

    moish01
    Member

    ha ok, shame on me, then. i didn’t even know where it’s from

    #1068265

    The Big One
    Participant

    Wow, ICOT, lets not get carried away here. Our good Doctor may not be a Zaide yet, but we aren’t talking a newlywed!

    http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/why-yidden-are-the-best#post-1181

    #1068267

    ames-

    I agree, it is a tasty drink (one of my favorites, in the diet variety, of course). (fortunately, I realized that your comment contained a typo)

    I like your riddle. My answers would’ve been a) he was superman b) 21 floors were underground c) he was unhurt after landing, but during landing he was hurt quite badly

    The “real” answer is much better.

    Dr. Pepper-

    Please don’t post the solution – I am intrigued by the question and would like to see if I can figure it out, but I haven’t had time to try yet.

    BTW – the drink had a period until 1950.

    moish01-

    squeak-

    I didn’t know the solution to “moish01″s question, so Google showed the answer in Rashi on Megilla 30b. 32b is the blank page following the conclusion of Megilla, so I assume that that was “squeak”s Purim Torah.

    squeak-

    Your “lunar leaper” question was a good one, but I couldn’t answer it because I was too busy (honest). Since high-jumpers and vaulters both use the “Fosbury flop” technique, the center of gravity is indeed key. Lack of air resistance would bring the height up slightly. Also, we must assume that the vaulting pole’s tensility is unaffected. If someone throws a ball as high as he can on the moon, it will actually land with greater impact than it would on Earth, due to no air resistance ascending or descending (and assuming that a human being can’t achieve escape-velocity speed on his throw).

    The Big One-

    Nice catch!

    I have a deerstalker cap that hopefully fits you – size 7 3/4.

    You can call me Dr. Watson or Inspector Lestrade, as you prefer.

    #1068268

    Dr. Pepper-

    one more thing I forgot to mention – Your thoughts in the post “The Big One” pointed to are very well put.

    #1068269

    squeak
    Participant

    Did you reason that out yourself ames, or is it something you researched? It is pretty well thought out. You are correct that your jump will be 6x higher than on Earth (though how you get to 40-50 feet with this, I don’t know – you must be able to jump really high! Have I seen you in the Olympics?) If you lift your feet 3 feet off of Earth, you can do 18 feet on the Moon. The trick in the riddle was that most people will multiply the height of the bar (5 feet) by 6, which is incorrect because the part of the body that clears that height starts out 3.5 feet above ground to begin with.

    I think that the main difference between a jump on the Moon and on Earth is that cracking the faceplate of a spacesuit is not a risk on Earth.

    #1068270

    Dr. Pepper
    Participant

    The Big One

    I can only try

    Getting back to your posts from two weeks ago, my wife was teasing me that if I keep pulling my pants up higher and higher while my sense of humor keeps getting worse and worse that people will start thinking I’m a grandfather. Then she saw those posts and couldn’t stop laughing.

    This baby is our fourth Bli Ayin Hara.

    By the way- her older siblings are crazy over her.

    There was one subliminal message hidden in the post though.

    When my previous child, a son, was born I had told a friend that I had a “baby”. He spread the word that we had a girl. He later said that when one has a boy they say that they had a boy, but when one has a girl they say that they had a baby.

    I was curious to see if anyone would pick up that I didn’t specify the gender and figure out that we had a girl.

    #1068271

    Dr. Pepper
    Participant

    I can only try

    Let me know when you’re ready for the answer (or a hint) to ??”? ?”? ?”? ???”?.

    #1068272

    Dr. Pepper-

    “This baby is our fourth Bli Ayin Hara.

    By the way- her older siblings are crazy over her.”

    B”H I’m happy to hear that.

    Our older ones too are/were crazy about the new arrival(s) to the extent my wife and I had to shoo them away from hanging around the bassinet.

    “Moish01″s puzzle I got the answer to via google a.k.a. cheating.

    I was talking about the “32 cards out of 52” puzzle.

    #1068273

    moish01
    Member

    Dr. Pepper, my problem is that i wouldn’t know how it falls out because i don’t know the hebrew dates. all i know is that purim is next week (which day is it anyway??)

    #1068274

    squeak
    Participant

    14th of Adar, moish

    #1068275

    moish01
    Member

    very funny, squeak.

    seriously is it tuesday?

    #1068276

    squeak
    Participant

    yep – monday night too. but you could have gotten that answer more easily on google.

    #1068277

    moish01
    Member

    hey that means my road test is on monday! woo hoo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (i know that was more asdfghjkl’s type than mine but i’m so excited!)

    oh and i forgot i could’ve googled it πŸ˜‰

    #1068278

    squeak
    Participant

    You know what they say about road tests? Not eating the day of a road test is supposed to be a segulah for a guaranteed pass….. I think it goes from Dawn until Night 8^B

    #1068280

    moish01
    Member

    hey TO. you meant because of taanis esther?? i completely forgot – i didn’t even get it till this second. (not that slow – four minutes)

    #1068281

    moish01
    Member

    hey i sent one in between there πŸ˜‰

    #1068282

    squeak
    Participant

    Haha moish, I figured you would get it. But I didn’t expect you to let on. Now you stopped a great debate before it started. But anyway, that is how a lot of segulos get started….

    #1068283

    moish01
    Member

    well my in between post said that i’m not exactly the segulla kind of guy.

    we’ll see – if i pass maybe i’ll be in such a good mood that i won’t need one of my daily milkshakes… and without one of those i have no problems fasting.

    #1068284

    areivimzehlazeh
    Participant

    speaking of road tests, if you’re smart DON’T TELL ANYONE you are taking the test; or if they know, don’t tell them WHEN. For a few reasons:

    – if you fail, no humiliation involved πŸ˜‰

    – it’s a bigger pressure when you know there are expectations

    – the surprise from your parents and friends that you went, took it and passed is well worth it

    #1068286

    Riddles, people! This topic is for riddles!!

    I shut one down yesterday, please, PLEASE don’t make me shut another

    (You can talk road tests in the General Shmooze 2, that is what it is there for)

    YW Moderator-39

    #1068287

    moish01
    Member

    ok, so can you post my last one in general shmooze? please? just for me – we’re friends, aren’t we??

    #1068288

    areivimzehlazeh
    Participant

    mod- before I pressed ‘send post’ i debated if I should take my post to the general shmooz thread. Then I figured it’ll get lost between the cracks- so I took the risk of getting my post deleted… then I’d try again in general…

    see- we members actually do think before we post πŸ˜‰

    #1068289

    moish01
    Member

    thanks. so mine got deleted instead.

    #1068290

    Not sure if I can/how I can. Sorry, you are going to have to rewrite it

    #1068291

    The Letter “E”

    #1068292

    moish01
    Member

    hey 39, next time you wanna answer a riddle that quickly, switch to your other user name. at least pretend we had a fair chance.

    #1068294

    22OldGold
    Participant

    The match?

    Then the stove cuz it provides heat and light at the same time?

    #1068295

    feivel
    Participant

    You want to send a valuable object to a friend securely. You have a box which can be fitted with multiple locks, and you have several locks and their corresponding keys. However, your friend does not have any keys to your locks. How can you send the object securely?

    you could send him the key in a separate envelope, but according to my rules i am eliminating this as an answer, to make it more difficult

    #1068296

    squeak
    Participant

    Can I use 128 bit encryption?

    If my friend is Simon Singh there would be no problem πŸ˜‰

    #1068297

    feivel
    Participant

    the box has to be secured with a physical everyday lock.

    and opened with a normal physical everyday key.

    #1068298

    squeak
    Participant

    Oh, so my response didn’t tip you off to the origins of this puzzle?

    #1068299

    squeak
    Participant

    BTW, feivel, you don’t have to make an exception to your rule. You could mail the key in a separate envelope but it would be stolen out of the envelope unless you locked the envelope too. Then you’d have the problem how to let your friend unlock the envelope to get the key to unlock the box. The postal workers will open everything that is not locked.

    #1068300

    Dr. Pepper
    Participant

    If you are sending it with a trusted courier then just lock the key onto the shackle and let your friend break it off when he receives it. (He’ll be able to tell if it was tampered with or not.)

    If not- send the box with one lock, have your friend attach another lock (while keeping the key to himself) and send the box back to you.

    Now you can remove the lock you put on originally and send the box back with only the lock that he put on.

    #1068301

    squeak
    Participant

    tada! Right, Dr. P, as usual. Which is exactly how 128 bit encryption on your web browser works. You have a public key and a private key. The site you are sending to only has the public key. This involves very large prime numbers, which should be right up your alley.

    #1068302

    squeak
    Participant

    You know what, ames? You were right before – it’s really starting to get to my head.

    Jack of all trades, master of none…

    #1068303

    kapusta
    Participant

    …except humility πŸ™‚

    #1068304

    squeak
    Participant

    A master of humility? That one certainly not. But you are kind.

    #1068305

    Dr. Pepper-

    1) Derive the odds of 125,994,627,894,135 combinations by

    2) there are 14 possible ratios of hearts to non-hearts: 0/20, 1/20, 2/20, 3/20, 4/20, 5/20, 6/20, 7/20, 8/20, 9/20, 10/20, 11/20, 12/20, 13/20

    The following chart contains the rest of the work:

    Hearts   Of     OddsH    Odds NonHeart    Total Odds              Ratio * Total Odds
    0 20 0 68,923,264,410 68,923,264,410 0
    1 20 13 68,923,264,410 896,002,437,330 44,800,121,867
    2 20 78 62,359,143,990 4,864,013,231,220 486,401,323,122
    3 20 286 51,021,117,810 14,592,039,693,660 2,188,805,954,049
    4 20 715 37,711,260,990 26,963,551,607,850 5,392,710,321,570
    5 20 1,287 25,140,840,660 32,356,261,929,420 8,089,065,482,355
    6 20 1,716 15,084,504,396 25,885,009,543,536 7,765,502,863,061
    7 20 1,716 8,122,425,444 13,938,082,061,904 4,878,328,721,666
    8 20 1,287 3,910,797,436 5,033,196,300,132 2,013,278,520,053
    9 20 715 1,676,056,044 1,198,380,071,460 539,271,032,157
    10 20 286 635,745,396 181,823,183,256 90,911,591,628
    11 20 78 211,915,132 16,529,380,296 9,091,159,163
    12 20 13 61,523,748 799,808,724 479,885,234
    13 20 1 15,380,937 15,380,937 9,997,609

    Total OddsH: 8,191 (not important)
    Total Odds Non-Heart: 343,797,240,803 (not important)
    Total Odds: 125,994,627,894,135 (very important)
    Total (Odds * ratio), line-by-line, then totaled: 31,498,656,973,534 (very important)
    Total odds next card is a heart 125,994,627,894,135 / 31,498,656,973,534 = 0.25 (this is the proof)

    To demonstrate the calculation involved where there are 10 hearts and 10 non-hearts:
    ((13*12*11*10*9*8*7*6*5*4)/(1*2*3*4*5*6*7*8*9*10)) * ((39*38*37*36*35*34*33*32*31*30)/(1*2*3*4*5*6*7*8*9*10))

    Hopefully the above columns that I tried to line up came out OK.

    Now that I’ve schvitzed over this, what method would a normal person use to prove the 1/4 likelihood of the next card being a heart?

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