Toy Weapons

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  • #589827
    Incognito
    Member

    My preschooler has a new obsession with swords. Any stick becomes a weapon.

    I’m curious to hear what people think about the idea of pretend weapons – Do they promote violence or are they just harmless fun?

    #1154809
    kapusta
    Participant

    anti, anti, anti.

    *kapusta*

    #1154810

    i teach -we dont let weapons of any kind

    #1154811
    mchemtob
    Member

    I strongly oppose toy weapons of any sort…it promotes violence and initiates a wilder form of play hence pple getting hurt. am i scared that in the future my son would be interested in viloence and weapons not really but the play that comes out of it is unhealthy, meaning physically dangerous and not at all intellectually stimulating…but thats just my opinion. Shabbat Shalom

    #1154812
    zaki
    Member

    I don’t see what the big deal is. Jews have always been fighters – as long as you promote the right message to your children, there’s no harm in pretend fighting, especially if the child is being bullied in school or has a confidence issue.

    #1154813
    anonymisss
    Participant

    Toy weapons contribute to a more wild and violent form of play. I believe that this form of play breeds aggression in children, which eventually becomes part of their personality. Why would you, as a parent, want to contribute to creating an aggressive child, and eventually adult?

    ~a~

    #1154814
    mchemtob
    Member

    zaki… it’s a very big deal. and there can be harm in play fighting, ask any er nurse, or school teacher. teaching a child to fight doeas not breed confidence and fighting doesnt necessary mean that they will overcome issues with a bully. kids that fight grow up into adults that fight. how do you feel when you see hamas pictures of little arab children with toy uzis is that harmless play as well. think about it before buying your children as much as a water gun this summer. please.

    #1154815
    anonymrs
    Participant

    so the majority of you are saying that play fighting is negative. does that mean that boys should not be allowed to fool around? i have never met a boy who does not like the occasional wrestling match with his father friend brother etc. does this mean that they will all grow up to be violent?

    i think perhaps some thinking needs to be done. there is nothing wrong with pretend play as long as everyone involved realizes that it is PRETEND and not acceptable outside of play time. there is nothing wrong with boys pretending to wrestle, as long as they dont resort to such behavior when they get into an actual fight. playing with guns is a bit more serious, and it depends on what is being done with them. then again, i grew up with a water gun and neither i nor anyone i know would consider me a violent person.

    what about paint ball? is that wrong too? and what about sports? they can get violent at times….are we now going to say that children (both boys and girls) should not be allowed to play sports?

    #1154816
    anonymisss
    Participant

    anonymrs, check the thread title.

    ~a~

    #1154817
    Incognito
    Member

    anonymrs definitely has the right idea. And I do think there is a difference between swords and guns, although I have to agree, didn’t we all have water guns as kids?

    mchemtob, do you only allow your children to engage in intellectually stimulating activities? My son loves books, blocks, etc and he does not have a wild personality at all, but like any other boy, play fighting fascinates him as well. He has a very active imagination, which I actually attribute to his intellect, and I can’t see any real harm in letting him play with toy (foam, I might add) swords .

    #1154818
    anonymrs
    Participant

    i did check the thread title. my question was if this is how someone feels about toy weapons, how would that person feel about pretend play.

    #1154819
    tzippi
    Member

    Yeah, I don’t like toy guns, etc. but it’s almost inevitable with little boys that any two thin items will be held perpendicular and become a gun. It’s a phase, and as long as they have other toys, etc., that is, this is not their whole play time, you should be fine.

    #1154820
    oomis
    Participant

    Opposed on all counts. My kids were not allowed to play with toy guns of any type (even water guns that resembled real guns), and they did not grow up to be ax murderers of suffer from problems of self-esteem. We taught them that weapons are NOT toys, and people can really get hurt from certain types of so-called toy weapons (like BB guns, swords, playing with sticks). A kid will only make a weapon out of two thin items held perpendicular, if he SEES such a weapon either by other children or watching violence in the media. Otherwise, he would have no way of knowing about “guns.” I screende my kids’ friends carefully, and they played in homes where other parents had a similar hashkafa to ours vis a vis toy weapons. It was never an issue.

    #1154821
    sms007
    Member

    My parents never let us play with toy guns, even on purimma and I plan to do the same with my own children, b”h.

    #1154822

    Play fighting has always been a safe and natural way for kids to get out their aggression and blow off steam; it’s healthy. As has been said before, any kid will make a sword out of two long thin items. The kid won’t grow up to be a killer and he won’t grow up to be a detriment to society. As long as the weapon is foam (for safety) and that’s not all the kid does, I’m in favor of toy weapons.

    #1154823
    Mrs. Doubtfire
    Participant

    I agree with those who wrote boys will be boys and will turn anything into a “weapon”. My boys are always making guns and swords out of clics and guess what? Because they never watch violence they think that when they “shoot” me I get all wet!

    #1154824
    anuran
    Participant

    One of the things children do in play is experiment with controlling their environments. Play with toy weapons and acting out conflict is part of that exploration. And to a certain degree it’s healthy and natural. If it’s allowed to go too far it can lead to inappropriate uses of violence.

    It doesn’t matter if you forbid anything that looks like weapons. A rag doll can become a nuclear missile in a child’s imagination.

    A teacher from whom I learned a great deal is the famous Massad Ayoob, one of the foremost trainers of elite law enforcement and military personnel in firearms and defensive tactics. His daughters could have all the squirt guns they wanted as long as they were shaped like animals. And they could whack away at each other with Nerf swords.

    Anything that looked like a real weapon was to be treated like a real weapon which meant safety-first, by-the-numbers training. Any time they wanted to do that Mama or Poppa would take some time to give a lesson or practice session. After a certain age they could fire any real firearm in the house which they could safely handle. Again, under supervision. And they had to completely strip and clean it afterwards. The forbidden allure of handling a gun gets old really fast when it means an hour of hard work with patches, bore snakes, toothbrushes, oil and Hoppe’s Number 9.

    The Ayoob household is a little different than yours or mine. But the same principle applies. Any toy weapons must be distinctly toys, nothing like real tools. And anything which looks or acts like a real weapon must be treated as if it were one.

    And if the really are interested? Well, Lord knows we Jews have to rely on ourselves. If you have a natural Shomer Yisroel, then get him or her proper training. It could save Jewish lives down the road. And that’s a Good Thing(tm).

    #1154825
    hereorthere
    Member

    Mchemtob posted; “teaching a child to fight doeas not breed confidence and fighting doesnt necessary mean that they will overcome issues with a bully. kids that fight grow up into adults that fight.”

    I can tell you from personal experience this is totally wrong.

    I have had to live in fear of others who were bigger then me or trained in some kind of fighting skills or who simply had plenty of friends who would help them bully others.

    I have passed up lucrative jobs because they would have been in situations where physical controntaton might be likely either from customers (knocking on doors to seell something for example) or from cowrokers (like in warehouse or construction where everyone spends their free time, thinking about how ‘tough’ they are and sizing everyone else up.

    If I were a Blackbelt in some martial arts I woudl not have had that fear and I would have been able to take some of those jobs which in turn would have led to a much better life then I have now.

    I was also bullied in school and I am no skileld fighter but I have learned a couple of moves since then and if I knew as a kid what I know now I could have beat those bullies and again my whole life would be very different and far better.

    Anyone who thinks fighting skills have nothing to do with self confidence or can’t help stop bullying has no clue, as to what they are talking about.

    #1154826
    oomis
    Participant

    I agree with Anuran. Children may make “weapons” out of almost anything, but playing with toys shaped like realistic weapons should not be encouraged. How many tragedies have happened because kids found guns in their parents’ houses and thought they were toys? You wanna burn off agression – let them play SPORTS. OUTDOORS!!!!!

    #1154827
    hereorthere
    Member

    It’s not just about “burning off aggression” it’s about learning to handle someone elses aggression when you can’t get away and will not listen to anyone trying to talk calmly.

    Like in Crown Heights riots for example, if thugs shouting “Kill the Jews” attack a Jew, he needs to know how to defend himself, whether they have sharp objects or weapons or whatever.

    The earlier kids start learning this the better they will be able to handle themselves when the time comes.

    I remember in Crown Heights many years ago, someone in an apartment building with a mix of Jews and Gentiles, wrote to the Rebbe saying some non Jews were physiaclly harrassing his boy.

    The Rebbes response for what I heard was “teach your boy to fight”.

    #1154828
    oomis
    Participant

    hereorthere, you are talking about apples and oranges. I totally agree with you that kids have to know how to defend themselves (and when to run away), but that has ZERO to do with playing with toy guns and knives. They should be taught self-defense from an early age, and also how to carry themselves. But being aggressive because of playing aggressive games leads to violence often with trqgic consequences. Kids are too young to differentiate between what is play and what is real. They see violent cartoons and think that Wile E. Coyote gets up and walks away after being flattened by a boulder.

    #1154830
    hereorthere
    Member

    I saw the same cartoons and always knew that no one gets up and walks away from such things.

    I did not have the chance to play fight so much and because of that was far less coordinated and slower then the bullies when the real fights came.

    Without the many hours of such coordinating skills in such play a kid is at serious disadvantage compared to thsioe he has to face later on.

    #1154831
    checkmate 27
    Member

    any thing can be a weapon it’s up to the owner to decide what to do with it gun’s can be made for peace and u have those who use them to kill anybody who say’s something they don’t like . stick’s can be used for building houses some people go around hitting people with them it all depends on the owner

    #1154832
    anuran
    Participant

    Sometimes it’s not a matter of “burning off” aggression. Sometimes it’s a matter of learning how to use if effectively and appropriately. In another life I spent about ten years teaching women’s self defense, martial arts and basic firearms safety and marksmanship. There’s an appropriate level of comfort with violence and aggression which makes a kind, law-abiding person capable of fighting or defending herself when appropriate. Think of it as driving on the highway. Go too slow, and you’re a danger to yourself and others. Go too fast, same thing. The tricky part is getting people into the right range. You can go just as wrong either way.

    Students who were never permitted to roughhouse as kids and ones who weren’t made to stop both presented challenges. Girls who grew up with older brothers were right in the groove 🙂

    #1154833
    vas1820
    Member

    What’s wrong with pretending??? As long as the kid doesn’t end up when he get’s older in these kind of stuff. Also, it’s for pretend!! *VAS1820*

    #1154834
    anuran
    Participant

    vas1820, play is good. Play is how children explore and build up their notions of how the world works. As a very wise person said “Play is the work of children.”

    But part of that experimentation is finding out what the acceptable limits are. There is some play which crosses the line of what is healthy and right. For instance, if kids were playing “Cossacks whipping Jews” or “Klansmen lynching Blacks” anyone with a heart or brain would put a stop to it. If play is excessively or repeatedly or increasingly violent that’s not just for pretend. It’s a warning sign that something else is wrong.

    #1154835
    👑RebYidd23
    Participant

    Most animals and many humans play fight when young.

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