UPDATED: YESHIVAWORLD EXCLUSIVE: Hillary Clinton To Visit Lakewood This Evening


david lichtenstein.jpg(UPDATE BELOW STORY) Presidential contender Hillary Rodham Clinton will be visiting Lakewood today, Yeshivaworld has learned. Mr. David Lichtenstein, Chairman and CEO of The Lightstone Group, who lives in Monsey, NY and whose company Lightstone Group has its headquarters in Lakewood, is hosting a fundraiser for Hillary at 20 Autumn Road this evening at 6:00PM.

There are numerous construction vehicles, police cars and nondescript government vehicles parked in the area of 20 Autumn Road – the location of Lictenstein’s (former) Lakewood home.

A source tells Yeshivaworld that Mr. Benjamin Ringel, who lives in Lawrence, NY, and is active in the Clinton campaign, has been leading the campaign in the Orthodox world to raise funds for the Democrats – and is running this event with Lichtenstein.

Many rumors have been passed around regarding the Senator possibly visiting BMG. Yeshivaworld has confirmed, that she will not be meeting with any Lakewood Roshei Yeshiva, nor will she be brought into the Yeshiva.

UPDATED 6:20PM EST: Yeshivaworld has learned, that NJ Governor Corzine will be attending the fundraiser at the (former) home of Mr. David Lichtenstein this evening.

Dozens of cops from the federal, state, and local levels are in the area currently. K9 dogs, SWAT teams, and a Hatzolah ambulance are there as well. Additionally, Kimball Medical Center has been placed on “stand-by”.

(YW News Desk / YW-456)


  1. Just Remember who this woman is:

    Suha Arafat, the wife of Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat, used a U.S. grant presentation to accuse Israelis of using poison gas against Palestinians. Hillary Clinton sat by silently, and later kissed Suha Arafat.

  2. yemach shmoh vzichroh – she is worse than that guy from iran – how dare they let her have drisad regel in Lakewood Ihr Hakodesh – anybody who sees her should rias kriah

  3. As usual there are Blinded Jews only interested in their pockets and what is good for them. Not what is good for Yidden and Eretz Yisroel.
    How a Torah Jew can vote Democrat has always been beyond me.
    May Hashem continue to protect us . We understand that all He does is always good – so we accept happily what happens in our lives. But to support openly a candidate that is the antithesis of the Torah Values is sad!

  4. For tuition they don’t have enough money,but to collect for this me’chasheifo they do? They think they’re going to buy her love? She doesn’t care about anyone but herself and will do whatever is good for her ambition,not what’s good for us. Why support this immoral being? “Al tiftechu bi’nedivim”. In Lakewood they ought to know better.

  5. This is a public forum and it helps no one to degrade powerful public officials especially when you courageously keep your identity anonymous. All through history our gedolim have dealt with government officials, many who actually had Jewish blood on their hands .I am not pretending that David Lichtenstein is daas torah, but there is precedent to dealing with public officials whose views we don’t agree with and there are no precedents for publicly degrading people in power.

  6. This is a chillul Hashem!! We don’t put our money where our our mouth is. Do we stand for values that the Torah teaches us or do we need to be ‘loved’by a cold-hearted goyta?? Where are the roshei yeshiva and rabbonim of Lakewood and BMG??

  7. It just boggles the mind how far some people would go for a little publicity. To raise money for this “machsheifa” in a town like Lakewood!!!!
    Is he trying to get people pardoned like New Square did? Why would anybody from the frum community want to give a penny to her or for that matter any “DEMO-RAT”. The only reason she is in office is because Guliani got cancer and dropped out. We must always remember “lev melochim v’sorim b’yad Hashem”.

  8. a vote or dollar for her is a vote or dollar for NUN shaarie tumah – this lady is a fake-fony-fraud – unfortunately we live in weak tkufah where Hashochad yiaver einie pikchim devours us






  10. I am so disgusted with what will be happening in Lakewood today. Hiliary Clinton hugged Fatimah Arafat, she stands for all things that are against the Torah. How many of you are aware that in college she was a big supporter of the Femimnist movement. How can anybody with sechel buy her two-face act. She just pretends to love the us so she can get our votes. The biggest Menuvalim in Hollywood are the biggest supporters of her. The worst thing in the world would be to have her as President. She wants to wipe Eretz Yisroel off the map just like her beloved friend the Arabs.Hilary has never spoken a word of truth. How many of you are also aware that her husband Bill invited Eretz Yisroel hating-Arab leaders to the whitehouse more than any other president? Are you aware that Bill clinton had Osama bin Ladin in his control after the first World Trade center and let him go free.How can we as Frum Yidden allow this wicked person to be given kavod as though she is -Lehavdil Eleph Havdalos- a Gadol Biyisroel. Those of you in Lakewood who are inviting her are making the biggest Chilul Hashem. after 120 you will explain to Hashem why you supported this RASHA MERUSHA!

  11. Rabbi Avigdor Miller Said a torah jew Must only vote republican. I have never seen a fake person like her in my life besides for her other terrible issues she is the embodiment of sheker. And daye zuger You are right but thats only if she chalila Wins the office but until then we must only support the republicans.

  12. Shebochol Dor Vdor Oimdim OLAYNU Lchaloisynu – maybe in this Dor it should read Oimdim EIMONU…… by the way its 2300 dollars a plate to attend – are we in the Goldenah Medina or the Traifa Medinah??? – you tell me

  13. If she does who it could be very benefitial in many ways for her to have had frum supporters. Cover all bases. We learn from Yakov Avinu to give presents to rishaim when needed.

  14. I am not settling down on this one! As frum jews we should be voting 100% Republican. We, more than any other nation in the world should be worried about the Very Real threat of terrorism in America & Israel. Hillary Clinton is a known flip flopper on all political issues & is NOT someone we could entrust our security with! How dare Lichtenstein & Ringel throw a fundraiser for her?! Get this Two-Faced Back-Stabbing Flip-Flopping piece of Clinton out of town!


    We are not talking about meeting a Government official for Askonus purposes. This meeting in Lakewood is for fund-raising to put her into office, in preference to other candidates.

    We should not be getting ourselves involved in such activities, since this causes KinAh and SinAh on the part of the other candidates who we snubbed.

  16. Well the mageifa starts with money & ends with money no good comes from this & hopefully no bad will come of this. I’d like to hear David’s reasoning behind this abominable deed.

  17. To Mr. David Lichtenstein & Benjy Ringel Esq.

    Please be advised at the most recent Aipac Dinner the Keynote Speaker was Hillary Clinton. The Speech started off with all the things we as Jews wanted to hear. She then proceeded to speak on the topic of Iran and she stated the following “When it comes to Iran we must sit down with our enemies and understand them”. Let me know were we suppose to sit down with Hitler and understand him or maybe we should sit down with Khaled Mashal from Hamas and break bread with him to “Understand Him”.

    Ps: If you would like a transcript of that speech at Aipac I would be happy to send it to you through YW Editor.

    Thank you
    A Concerned Fellow Jew

  18. IY”H we should all be zoche to have Hillary be mechabed us by becoming our president. You want to give me some allegedly non-Jewish-friendly anecdote about her? I’ll give you ten about a Republican. Democrats are the only ones who actually pay more than lip service to the Torah values of tzedoko and chesed. Remember that if it were up to the Republicans they would cut off all the welfare recipients in Lakewood because they are ideologically opposed to welfare. BMG should beg Hillary to be mechabed them with her presence.

    Anyone frum person who votes for the Republicans is unfortunately delusional. Since when is saber-rattling and fearmongering about a few thugs in caves (al Qaida) and a fourth-rate military power (Iran) something the Torah world should be cheering for?

  19. Loz up! Whats wrong with David who is a legitimate “big player” out there hedge his bets with some other “big players.” I am sure they are also contributing to others.

    All of you who are so up in arms think a little out of your daled amos and think what ‘we’ would accomplish by tuning off every democratatic politician? or a aino yehudi who doesn’t follow the ‘daas torah’ wake up! they are from the outside world and accept that and do what we can do with what we have available to us.

  20. We have a right to protest on the streets. We know the address – start making placards now of her hugging arafats wife.
    Remind her of who she is. We should all go there tonightwith our children and let her know what we think.
    ORGANIZE ORGANIZE. And the next time Lichtenstein brings his money to Lakewood for Purim tell him to giveit to Hillary instaed. Hashem will provide for allof uswitrh or without supporters of a Sona Yisroel!


    Edited by Site Moderation Panel.

  21. I can’t understand why any person mentally balanced should even thing of supporting this “Machsheifah”, especially a wealthy person who Hilary clearly says she wants to rob his money (for so called social programs). Shame on you.

    I hope that there are’int to many people like this Lichtenstien in Klal Yisroel.

  22. Rabboisai She might be the next President Of The United States (Chs Vshlm) and the most powerful political leader of the free world.
    Think you Guys better relax and take a step back

  23. Dear David Lichtenstein

    How about getting rid of your trashy tenants at HighPoint? Well I guess you live at 20 Autumn Road, so HighPoint does not affect you. The fact that you do not care about the quality of life of Lakewood speaks volumes. It is great that you are supporting Hillary. Two peas in a pod. Both of you do not care about anyone other than yourselves.



    We are in galus. Ask Gedolei Yisrael who have a “velt’s kuk” about what do do, how to it, and with whom one may/must/should work.

    There are imbiciles who thing they are carrying the flag of “unadulterated Torah” or “Rav Aharon’s Hashkafah” or who wrap themselves in some other flag of self-determined hashkafah should do some learning, and ask sheilos of gedolei Yisroel. If today’s gedolim aren’t big enough for them, they should see what the gedolim
    they “hold of” (i.e., for the most part gedolim they never knew, of whom they have little real knowldge, and whose real pesakim and hadrachos they know nothing of) paskened in real life.

    There’s an old Yiddish saying, “az men darf dem ganav, nemt men em arup fun teliah.”

  25. Hashem Yishmor!!
    FYI public records show that the “FRUM ASKUNIM” in Lakewood have already donated over $100,000 and counting to Hilary’s campaign. Please see for yourself by googeling “fundrace 2008” and put in a zipcode (08701, 11559 etc.) WARNING: you may be shocked at what you see!!

  26. Got to LOVE the fact that out of 39 comments, only ONE is really supporting Hillary, and ONE is pareve. Beautiful Achdus here, people!!

    As to the lone Hillary’s and Dem supporter in comment no 29. Maybe if the Dems at any opportunity weren’t so eager to raise income taxes on middle-class citizens, consistently punishing the “rich” hard-working two-earner families, we would be zoche to give out more maaser and tzedaka to the institutions of our choice (like BMG), instead of sponsoring all kinds of bureaucracies and abominable “social organizations” that devour our tax money???

  27. To “camden mayor” – 31,

    What are you talking about? Every thing is a game and a “play”? You just support the guy who is going to win regardless of who and what they stand for?

    If so, then you are also a part of the same Chilul Hashem…

    Remember, Hashem is the one who takes care of us. The difference between “Hishtadlus” and “I’m running the show” becomes clear in instances like this…


  29. I couldn’t agree more that Torah Yidn shouldn’t be voting democrat, but I don’t know where you guys get the idea that voting republican is any better. While there may be a slim minority among the republicans who care about good strong moral values, the rest are slimy businessmen who care only about money and will readily stab one another in the back if it will make them a buck. Just look at Cheney’s Enron connections for starters.

    Just to be clear, I am absolutely NOT saying that democrats are the choice for us, least of all Ms. Clinton, C”V. It just kills me to see that we would support another party which is just as despicable.

    And as for the moral element in the republican party? Who do you think they are? Rabosai, don’t you say Alenu? Don’t you say shehem mishtachavim lahevel varik? Who do you think that means? What do you think would happen to us if they had their absolute way? You think just because we share moral values with heretics, pagans, and idolaters, that they would still support us if they didn’t have to? Was it so long ago in Europe that we were forced to bend to their will? Have we already forgotten?

  30. To 44:

    Right, so obviously it’s much more important to keep giving huge tax giveaways to ultrarich hedge fund managers and private equity partners that to say, fund “abominable ‘social organizations'” like children’s health care. You just keep on thinking that but I’ll stick the the sane people.

  31. To Fed Up – 41, “Ask Gedolei Yisrael who have a “velt’s kuk”

    I see already what the excuse is. Rabbi Avigdor Miller and other Gedolim who would screem about this were missing something, they didn’t have a “velt’s kuk”…

    The chilul Hashem is more and more evedent to any one with a “velt’s kuk”. It doesn’t look too beautiful to the “velt”.

    The only thing is, you’re comming from a Hanacha that “men darf dem ganav” – We need them. –Tell me that’s Daas Torah….

  32. to yeshiva world ,why dont you report the truth who is behind this ???? it makes me wonder who is paying you off !!!!

    Editors Response: No one pays us for anything. We report the NEWS

  33. T0 # 41
    Why are you so angry? Which Lakewood B’nei Torah are involved in this that you can lash out against? Who said they are not being moicheh? Are you not being Choished B’chshairim? Do u think that David will change his mind if the yeshivaleit tell him not to go thru w it?

  34. Whatever your views are about Hillary (personally I don’t like her and prefer Rudy or almost any Republican alternative), she certainly is not an anti-semite. There is a very good chance she may be our next president, and therefore it makes sense to cultivate a connection to her so that if she is elected our voices will be heard. Altho I wouldn’t give her a dime, David is doing a smart thing.

  35. during the time that nixon was in office Rabbi Avigdor Miller was clear that we should support him as well as other republicans, AT THAT TIME…..


    when he was asked at the end of one of his lectures, whether, in general, we should vote republican or democrat, he said that it depends on the candidate.

  36. ploini (45)& Sunenshine(35):
    As long as we view her as an “Eisav” then your comment is correct. Problem is that there are still a few frum yidden who support her and the Democrat party blindly (garmet 29).
    Why would you suggest that we support this vile person just because “she may win”.
    I believe standing on priciple is important.
    I am so encouraged by the oilam here on YW as we stand together opposing her.

  37. In addition to praising the Arafats — Yemoch Shemam — and having them as regular White House guests, Hillary never objected to her husband’s “track record” (vehamayvin yavin)

    I vividly remember a private conversation with one of our Gedolim, a prominent member of the Agudah Moetzes, who bemoaned the fact that then president Bill had spent his entire first week in office justifying the Toaivah of Mishkav Zachar.

    What moral filth will Ms. Clinton dump on us if — Rachmana Litzlan — she is elected?

  38. The “Clinton” brand name in American politics stands for immorality and a descent into Sodom and Gomorrah.

    For frum Yidden to publicly link themselves with the “Clinton” brand name by giving a fundraiser that will help elect a “Clinton” over other candidates is a true Chilul HaShem!

    Rav Avigdor Miller warned many times that this sort of activity–publicly supporting politicians who promote immoraly theough legislation–is a great KitRug on Klal YisRoel, and can, Chas VeSholom, bring grave repercussions.

    This is an irresponsible action by a selfish person. Shame!!!

  39. garmet (29):
    No one denies that there are some bad Republicans, I thought Coulter was good because of her conservative stances, I was wrong. James Baker y”s will live in infamy for his anti-semitism. However “rubaa d’rubbah” what conservatives say are up our ally and the same goes for the support for Israel. Wheras the left is blindly pro-Arab and their ideals and values are shameful!
    I have always said that the Democrat party left us, we didn’t leave them.

  40. #56
    We are not “supporting” her. we are showing her support. After all is said and done, David himself may very well vote for Rudy. People’s views will hardly change. Did you look up the Medrash?

  41. Ok my turn:

    I HATE Hillary Rotten Clinton her thighness but you gotta give that piece of garbage credit, she has her teams doing their research and she found a place where many people are on government programs! That is the reason she is going to Lakewood. There is a huge number of rich jews in the 5 towns who could have made this shebang for her but she wants to go to a place that will score her brownie points on election day.

    and number #29 you make me sick! I was about to see my lunch again! how in your right mind do you say “Democrats are the only ones who actually pay more than lip service to the Torah values of tzedoko and chesed.” Oh, abortion, “toeva” right, partial birth abortion (where they actually puncture the babys head so that it shrivels and dies) that definitely falls under the category of chesed, don’t you think? You make me sick! It’s all about the money isn’t it?!

    One word of advise if you are going to have a protest make sure it is b’tampt and there is no yelling so that there is no Chillul Hashem

  42. why doesn’t someone (or YW) ask David to give his explanation and then decide whether to argue? He is a smart man, and let’s hear what he has to say. his email has already been provided…

  43. It’s so sad that so many frum yidden have turned into partisan hacks for the republifascists–the party of fear, intolerance and bigotry.
    #52: right, I’m -sure- no one in Lakewood would mind if the government ended welfare. By the way I have a bridge I’d like to sell you. And whatever you think about “TO’EVA,” remember that whenever the government starts persecuting minority groups, eventually they get around to the Jews. Just keep that in mind. Ever wonder why all the racists and bigots tend to flock to one party (I’ll giver you a hint: it’s not the Democrats).

  44. Can one of the askonim/”CEO”/former Vaad Members on the list of donors please respond if Daas Torah was consulted before contributing and promoting this event.

    Please provide us w/details so we can put all the questions and allogations behind us.

    This will certainly alleviate any questions of going to the next event that U R the honoree or chairman.

  45. David L. gives plenty of Tzedakah, he helps Bikur Cholims with houses & is a Talmid Chochom. That doesn’t mean he’s Daas Torah. We don’t have to agree with him, but it’s his house & he can invite anyone he wants to it.

    But, I want to know who from our Vaad and/or “askanim” are attending. Let’s see who they associate themselves with. We need an inside spy to report to us who is attending.

    As for the traffic mess this will create – I feel bad for anyone living in 14th Street area tonight. This is gonna be one huge mess!!

  46. To Feival – 55,

    I heared myself from R’ Avigdor Miller that the rule should be: Who ever Jessi Jackson votes for you vote the oppisite. Who ever the Mishkav Zozhor’s vote for you vote the opposite.

    It’s as clear as chicken soup without Lokshen…

  47. frum blogger,

    Thank you so much for that eye opener.

    I didn’t want to comment on this post, but I feel that I must.

    Right now the Mashgiach is trying to put together an emergency meeting in Lakewood. The reason for the meeting is that there are a few school in Lakewood, that are in very serious truoble financially, and they are almost ready to close their doors. Chas V’shalom.

    The problem is that this year with the current lull in the real estate market many gverim in Lakewood are not supporting the schools.

    I am personally involved, and i read the names of the contributors on that site, and they are the same ones claiming they don’t have money right now.

    My blood is boiling!!!

    The fundraiser today isn’t as bad as that list.!!!!

    If one of those guys go I will explode!!!

  48. To the Chavrusuh of David # 14

    I will answer your very good shailuh:
    It is because if you look at the fund race 2008 site you will see other “askonim” in Lakewood doing the same unbelievable deed look at who donated to herr campain. (I mistakenly put two r’s I guess Freud was right)

    Look at the list. I am shocked.

    I cry for my Alma Mater. Lakewood Chagri Sack.
    Eich Naflu giborim. Reb Ahron vult gevaint bittere trerin.
    (Reb Ahron would especially cry for his namesake. ayin fund race)

    Do ‘family values’ mean nothing.

    I hate to use a 1980’s term but Ribono shel Olam what is going on?

    Her husband Bill (remember him) made churuv morality in this great country and she will continue the same. Nothing is sacred for them.
    Execpt kovod un gelt.

    If you type in 10952 you will not see so many shayneh yidden giving money to her campain.

    I am shocked. Speechless.

  49. in my opinion, the worst thing is not giving her kavod in lakewood, that is just ridiculous, but how can this guy rationally take away tzedaka dollars that would otherwise be earmarked for Torah Mosdos. Lakewood needs to protest en masse. How many Torahdik jews who follow Daas Torah, support Hillary?>

  50. One more point: To all those as shocked as I am about this fundraiser I have one nechumah:

    I guarantee you that if there were two fundraisers in Lakewood. One for Hillary and one for Rudy. Rudy would get 1000x more volume of people at his campaign than that of Hillbill.

    To all of you worried about the few people donating to Hillary take consolation in this fact:

    There are more of us (clearthinkers) than them.

    Rabbosai They are the meeut. We are the roiv.

    We have not all lost our minds.

  51. Welcome back illini:
    I knew this would wake you up 🙂 You never miss a chance to go against the flow. I’m proud of you. Ummm, honestly though, are you sure you wanna go there?
    The “intelligent” block of your Democrat voters?
    Keep coming back though, I’m happy to see you 🙂

  52. Tora Jews should be embarrassed to publicly support a Liberal mush’cheses who supports toeva , forces on all their “rights”, and wants to redefine their abomination as “marriage”! This is besides her support of MURDER as “right to choose”… don’t we believe in Hashem and his Tora?! For shame!!!

  53. I would like to take this opportunity to thank the chushive neighbor of Mr David Lichtenstein, Rabbi and Mrs Mutty & Tzipora Minzer for last nights true Kiddush hashem – the hachnosas Sefer Torah that was attended by all the chushive neighbors – excluding Mr Lichtenstein – it was such a beautiful experience and was such an amazing Kiddush Hashem – the Rov – R’ Osher Chaim spoke so strongly about Kovod hatorah and brought our neighborhood to a new level of Kedush Vtahara. Rav Mattisyohu & Rav Olshin also graced us with divrei Brocho.May this neighborhood be zocheh to bring many more Sifrie Hatorah to the neighborhood and Khal Zichron Shneur. thank you again Rabbi and Mrs Minzer, may this be a zchus for your family and the whole Kehilla

  54. leonard613:
    Dont be so shocked, sadly the Democrat party just gets their convoluted message out better than we do. B’rachmov Ib’roiv CHasuduv, the Riboineh Shel Oilem gave us President Bush (even the Dems will admit it was a miracle after he “lost” 2 elections 🙂 ).
    It has long been believed that as conservatives we are the silent majority of America and I still believe we are.
    We will quietly go about doing the right thing. Hopefully we will indeed be zoicheh to the awakening of Klal Yisruel bg”bba.

  55. Why do we not learn from our prevoius mistakes? How can a frum person even support this moronic idiot let alone let her into their homes? Shame on us for even thinking of supporting her. By the way her anti-semetic rants in the White House are well documented.

  56. #68

    if you are surprised that Rabbi Miller would say this, i think what he meant was:
    in general one should prefer a republican over a democrat
    but if a particular republican, for example, believes in killing children before they are born, and the opposing democrat was against this, then one should vote for the democrat

  57. Ploini,
    the Midrash says he became blind for giving Shoichad, and this blindness is calld in Chazal as Yissurim (“Yitzchok started Yissurim…”)

  58. If david lichtenstein lives in monsey and Mr.ringel lives in lawrence then can you please explain to me why in the world they are bringing this “MACHSHEFA” into our “IR HAKODESH”.

  59. To feivel – 80,

    If you heared “hundreds of Rabbi Millers tapes” and still think there’s a tzad he would have supported Hillery, you have a head as thick as the Negios behind such acts…

  60. Why does ‘Lakewood’ have to take more heat for cozying up to Clinton than Skver when they had dealings with her,or Satmar for that matter when she came to be Menachem Ovel the children ?

    They seemd to welcome her as well!

  61. i personally was told by Rav Miller zt”l that “the democratic party” will do ANYTHING to make the arabs happy. at that time bush was running against gore and gore was supposedly very pro-israel and bush was supposedly anti-israel anti-semite. YET Rav Miller STILL told me clearly to vote for bush, and made a broad, general statement about “the democratic party”. this is all besides what he would always say about the mitzva to fight in any way against anyone who supports the Toeva chayos…

  62. to no 49: stop spitting poison and twist others’ words around. obviously “child health care” is not an abominable cause. when i say “abominable”, everyone knows exactly what “abominable” is.

    as far as providing “biggest tax breaks” to the “already rich fund managers”, open your eyes WHO all the dems’ tax hikes REALLY hurt. it’s the “rich” people that make money above the poverty line and then must pay — yes, believe it or not, PAY — for same child health care and all other things that are otherwise covered under programs!!! this effectively disincentivises any extra income above the poverty level. GREAT for economy, right? and when all these “rich” ppl say — okay, so i wont work extra and end up with more money, who is gonna pick up all those great social programs’ bills? if you really believe that raising taxes the way the dems do it helps economy and social programs in the long run, you got to read up about economics 101!

    obviously, this is all besides the point… just hillary’s charming personality and her party allegiance make it a POWERFUL combo for us NOT to support her!

  63. #90: If I was registered as a republican and would be able to, i would vote for huckabee or romney and NOT for giuliani for those very reasons… however, if giuliani wins and runs against a dem, i would have to go with him (holding my nose) as atleast he will appoint pro-life pro-marriage justices to the federal courts.

  64. Welcome back “The Town Crier”:

    I must admit you are probably correct about Rudy. If he support marriage rights for the abominable and abortion on demand that I will be VERY hard pressed to support him. Although his record in support of Israel is solid, he threw Arafat out while Hillary embraced his wife, I do have issues with his liberal past.
    He has said he will nominate conservative judges which does weaken liberal poison, but you are right overall.

    There are far more conservative Republicans running like Huckabee. Thanks for reminding me.

    Be well

  65. Since when Do yiden speak like this ????
    i happen to think that even if he is not doing this “leshem shumayim”, she is still not as bad as some yw writers make her, it so happens to be that if you know the politiks…she is hated by the arabs!!!

  66. It’s ashame we have to wait till next Wednesday to see how the Yated Featuring Lakewood is going to deal with this.

    No win situation for them.

  67. I think it’ll be good for lakewood to have a visit by Hillary. It may shed some color to Lakewood!!
    She will know to dress with tznius, so dont worry!!

  68. To “The Town Crier”

    Government programs under President Bush have expanded at a record rate.

    You are paroting old Democrat party scare propaganda.

  69. #29. You are wrong if you think Democrats do tzedaka and Republicans don’t. If anything the opposite is true. Republicans give tzedakah with their own money, while Democrats vote for government programs but don’t give their own money to tzedakah. There were years in which both Gore and Kerry gave pitiful amounts of charity (a few hundred dollars), until they realized that people were looking.

  70. just a humble opinion if you all will listen. I will sign my name as I am not ashamed to say that hillary clinton is the epitome of prustkeit. I personally have spoken to supporters of her from my home town who after seeing my raayos changed their veiws. does anyone know that the reason the charges against her husband were dropped in his scandal in 1990s was because she herself was involved in toeva – vehamayvin yavin. this woman besides being a pro-arab anti semetic piece of scum is also a prusta menuval and a wife of another prusta menuval. wishing her and her chamor of a husband many years in the firepits of gehennom. amen.

  71. WOW that comment no 99! Enlighten us, Town Crier, when was it in the history of Jewish people that, if we did not have government handouts, we would be homeless, our children would be hungry, and we would have no job prospects??? We are the Yidden, not the Palestinians!!!

  72. #89
    you dont need to say ugly comments about me
    i never said nor implied that Rabbi Miller would support hilary.
    i dont support her, and im certain Rabbi Miller would not support her.

    i was merely clarifying that his criteria for voting were more inclusive than just one’s political party.

    i hope you will not make further insulting comments to anyone, neither face to face, nor hidden on the internet.

  73. Here’s the scoop on the social positions of the Republican Party candidates (from political consultant Dick Morris):

    “…Rudy is, of course, pro-choice. McCain, rightly or wrongly, was criticized for hurting the social conservative movement by limiting its ability to spend money on its pet causes in the McCain-Feingold legislation. And Fred Thompson lobbied for a pro-choice abortion-rights group in the early 1990s and has been squishy on the issue ever since.

    That leaves Mike Huckabee as the only pure pro-life candidate, a social conservative who has never moved to the left…”

    There are no pro-life candidates in the Democratic Party.

  74. All of these complaints aren’t gonna make a differece. She’s coming & it’s too late to stop her.

    I hope & pray that she’ll never become president. But, if cholila she does, we’re going to be in big trouble.

    Did anyone ask the R”Y or the Mashgiach what they feel about this inyan?

  75. Is it just me, or are we frum Lakewood Jews not supposed to be wasting our time wallowing in the tum’ah of the Internet? Shouldn’t we be saying Tehillim and listening to make sure no one is, chas v’shalom, speaking lashon hara? And watching our neighbors to make sure they are dressed tzniusdik?


    HIS RESPONSE (EXACT RESPONSE) “I’ve been asked to host this by the Yeshiva

    Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry”

  77. This is not a public event everyone is screaming like Lakewood LAKEWOOD is coming to an end. David is inviting her to HIS private house with a by-invitation only event(I didn’t see signs hanging in the coffer room or Satmar about this event) David can do as he pleases. Why is this any different than if your neighbor has a TV in his dining room and invites entertainers into his room. Do you also get all riled up? You weren’t invited to this event stay in your house with a ketsoz and forget about it. Where does public protest come from this? This is turning into a mountain out of nobodies business.

  78. TO THE EDITOR!!!!!

  79. Illini, we all understand perfectly well whats at stake. YOU are blinded thats all. If you have been paying attention you will comprehend that electing Shrillary will be a disaster. Politics shmolitics, she is vermin.

  80. YW Editor:
    Thank you so much for bringing us this story. I was feeling rather down about the shape of politics in this country. I now realize that at least my fellow Yidden are so together in support of genuine values. I’m even encouraged that there are a few who disagree which shows that our community is one capable of thinking for itself.
    It’s a very proud day for our community and one that cannot be ruined by the likes of crier, illini and garmet.
    Ahhhhh es feelt balt azoi git vi di shvitz nuch’n mikveh 🙂

  81. bsimchah (97):
    Are you suggesting that the Arabs will support a Republican over Hillary? Which one?

    Which one Arab and which one GOP candidate.

  82. To Frumblogger:

    If the Yeshiva asked him to invite Hillary, then I retract my remarks aboutnhim. He is simply carrying out his obligations as a loyal askon for the Yeshiva.

    However, my Rebbe, Horav Avigdor Miller, ZT”L, repeated many times that the Yeshivos and other mosdos are making a tragic mistake, if they think that HaKoDosh Boruch-HU has nachos from this king of ChaNuFa and support for proven ReShaIm.

    He was certain that these “p(r)ogr(o)ams will bring no good to our community.

    Perhaps the explosion of problems with “NoshRim”–troubled youth–in our community can be traced to “treifa money’ from treifa sources!

  83. sorry, town crier and others, but i’ll have to stick to principles and values before money… g-d provides money but expects us to show him how we stand up for values…

  84. 118: He did NOT veto the SCHIP program. The SCHIP program was designed and implemented by a Republican Congress in 1997. What Bush wanted was a 5 Billion dollar exapnsion of the program. The Democratic Congress sent him a much bigger expansion, to include people making up to 400% of poverty level (82,600 for a family of 4.) and adults up to age 25.

    As to R’ Avigdor Miller z’l, I once heard in the question period at the end of his tapes (no, I don’t remember which one) that “To vote for liberal Democrats is yehareg v’al Yaavor.” He said it in the late 1970s when ERA was “in play” in the political arena. He felt that there were provisions in that bill that would create situations of abizrayhu d’arayos, hence the psak of yehareg v’al yaavor.

  85. charliehall:

    I would not put much credence in anything the Jewish Press says. They like to support winning candidates and will come up with ways to justify that. The notion that Hillary is a friend of Israel is a joke. She currently supports them because it is in her self interest to do so. Her true conviction are to support the Palestinian cause as evidenced by her relationship with the Arafats before she ran for office.

  86. Are you all voting with your pocket?
    See Entry #99
    Stop living off the Government – We who work have to pay higher taxes for all those that choose not to.
    So now you vote for Democrats so you can have benefits. Regardless of wether the candidate is a Palerstinian loving Goy

  87. Town Crier:

    Are you a shill for the Democrats? You seem to be parroting their talking points.

    Were you always against the Iraq war? Do you not rejoice that a truly evil person like Saddam Hussein was removed from power? Do you not realize that SCHIP is the first step on the path to nationalized health care? Maybe you don’t care as long as the government gives you another handout.

    nfgo, as bad a mess as the situation in the middle east is, and I dont’ think it is that bad, it would be much worse with a Democratic led government with an allergy to the use of force.

  88. To Papper:

    You’re exactly right about the Jewish Press.

    They must have access to politicians, and they are very careful to cater to them and not annoy them.

    It’s much easier for them to be Kanoim with politicians in Israel, far, far away!

  89. There is quote in Pirkei Avos that warns us of people in power — that they appear to ‘love’ a person when they need him, and they don’t stand by a person when that person needs them.

  90. Shochad ye’aveir pikchim
    Bribing the candidates will not make them love us. Support the candidate that is good for #1. the USA and for #2 the safety of our people. Have bitochon in Hashem that the right candidate wins. Giving them lots of money publicly is foolish.Rather give more money for Tzedokko,not for ulterior motves.

  91. #123: Thank you for a much-needed chuckle; there is great irony in someone who’s screen name is “Deep Thinker” off-handedly suggesting an absurdly naive and simplistic explanation to a profound and complex problem.
    The Parsha of “Children At Risk” is one that has brought untold suffering and Agmas Nefesh to countless families in the Olam HaTorah and has vexed the Einei Ha’Edah- our leading Gedolim and Mechanchim. And yet our “Deep Thinker” has identified the root of the problem with a hastily-typed comment on an internet blog! What an insult to the myriad, fine, upstanding fathers who spilled so many tears for their children as they waited up nights hoping they return! What an insult to the hundreds of Yiddishe Mamas whose Tefillos for their children to return wore out the pages of one Tehillim after another! Would you sit down across the table from one of these pillars of emotional strength and tell them “Don’t worry! I’m a Deep Thinker and I figured out your child’s problem- you use Treifeneh Gelt!” If not, why type it here?
    It’s something to think about.

  92. To all those comparing Rudy with Hillary unfairly let me explain how you are WRONG.

    There is a big difference between the two. Do not let anyone fool you

    Yes, socially they are both liberal but here is the main and most important Point.

    Rudy might personaly lean liberal, however he would appoint conservative Judges that interpret the constitution in a strict constructionist manner.

    The Judges that Rudy would appoint would not legislate from the bench that tohayvuh can get married r’l.

    Hillary loves toheyva. SHE MARRIED TOEYVAH.

  93. I live in lakewood and want to attend.Does anyone know what i have to do in order to go.Im willing to pay the price to meet such a distingiushed individual someone who might become the president.

  94. I checked the website that someone posted earlier and I’m shocked and apalled at the people/amounts that hillary has received and suggest everyone apologise to David because I now beleive he’s just a messenger

  95. #46 summed it up just right! Be happy that there are some well connected people that know a lot about politics and how it works and are working to help the yiden…instead of all of you yelling and screaming and accomplishing nothing at all…except a whole lot of lashon hara!!

  96. To 145:
    You are partially right.
    It is not just David.

    It is David and all of the others posted on “fund race” donating their hard earned money to the Hillary campaign.

    IMHO There is one mussar hasckel to be learned from this story:

    Always remember ayin roeh v’ozen shu’mas.
    Hakol besefer nich’tavim.

    Upstairs the computers are better than down here.
    In todays society everything is b’nigleh. In the open.
    We know who gave what to which campain and how much.
    You cannot say you did not. The whole world knows.

    How careful we must be about Chillul H-shem. While we are upset at others for possibly causing a chillul H-shem.

    All of us that feel that this Hillary fest is a gevaldieh chillul H-shem (va’ani b’sochum) must too watch our actions so that it does c”v lead to chillul H-shem.

  97. Borei Me’Orei Ha Government Grant

    and who do you think will get it? not you or me, but the yeshiva’s themselves (but they’ll still cry no$$$, dont worry)

  98. #144 toivish
    what is so great and ditinguish about being a president? hitl…, stalin, fernando and isabela yimach shemom were all kings or presidents.

  99. why all the complaints till now everyone was complaining about the wave of roberies in the area .well hillary flies in on her broom and lo and behold the police found our neighborhood thank you david lichtenstein you got the job done

  100. downtoearth:
    Contrary to what most people believe Hatzolah does not like playing politics. They are there because they were asked to be there. I guarantee you they will help who ever needs help (be it people at the fund raiser or “protesters”).

  101. #146 You are right. Thank goodness to all the Lakewood askanim who have brought the yungerleit of this once great city to their knees with higher taxes etc…with their “hakoras hatov” to incumbants. Such smart politicians they are indeed !! This year they “warned” the incumbants that they will not have hakoras hatov from now on. Very Very smart people indeed. Take it from stam a deya, STOP ENDORSING THESE CROOKS AND LET THEM FIGHT FOR OUR VOTES !!! You’ll see how fast the quality of life returns. They are not smart politicians, they are smart businessman as this evening’s chilul hashem proves.

  102. just checked fundrace 2008 .dont check it on a full stomach . hashem yirachaim the fruma are giving to the jew hater , the goyim are giving the republicans . pnei hador kipnei hakelev

  103. the fact is that is a business move, yes all of you are right that it is not right what he is doing, but let’s see you act different if you would be in his shoes, all of you complaining about him running after money you run after money yourselves, and u know i am right

  104. we recently visited lakewood and discussed how lakewood seems not too different than any other north american large frum community. It used to be otherwise- we felt that it was more saturated with emesdik torah VALUES. With todays visit by hillary being allowed to happen without public condemnation by leaders of the community and the amount of monetary support given by “respected” askonim in the community-as noted on fundrace2008-we realize that our impressions were not wrong. Sometimes convictions have to override the next big business deal. It’s a shanda that when looking at the website of contributors the dem. blue dominates the list of supporters from a Torahdik community such as lakewood. these pple should be taken to task for condoning such a mushcheses. Where are the gedolim from Lakewood?????

  105. Lets make sure not to take any drastic action i.e. particapating in any big “hafganos” and possibly causing tremendous chilul hashem without consulting daas torah.We all may have opinions BUT until we are told by the gedolim that our views are correct we have absolutely NO right to take matters into our own hands.

  106. There’s more to this story. I’m sure the “askonim” have a hidden reason for this visit.

    Just as long as she isn’t invited to say “Shiur Klali” in B”M!!

  107. Can someone please tell me if BMG REALLY gave permission, as Mr. Lichtenstein claims?
    By the way, if you don’t realize, federalized healthcare means that the government gets to decide if you get a doctor’s appointment. Hillary supports this. If she is voted into the Oval Office, she will be empowered to decide whether your sick, old mother gets that desperately needed appointment at the oncologist’s (rachmana litzlan) or the newly arrived Spanish speaking Hispanic from Mexico, welcomed with open arms by our favorite rashanta.
    Please do me a favor. Don’t vote for her. Make this world a slightly better place, and keep support for Eretz Yisroel coming- remember, we are Jews first and Americans second, as much as some of our coreligionists try to forget it.
    One last thing – do your hishtadlus: don’t vote for her; Have bitachon: Hashem does the rest!

    P.S. I hope no one burns any garbage cans!

  108. Now the EMES. Hillary came to taste Yussis Sushi and Dessert. She heard that Yussis is doing a Motzoei Shabbos menu. I called Yussi and begged him to charge her full price. She’ll probably order Sushi Gefilte. Shabbat Shalom All.

  109. it’s a shanda and a bizayon that they donate so much money to a mushchis when there is so much aniyim in klall yisrael and so many yeshivos that have no money, and don’t tell me it’s for business chazal already tell us the profit one makes from giving tzedoka, and all the brochos that one receives, do we not beleive in chazal r”l?

  110. #150 glatkait

    Why would you compare the president of a free country to a dictator.I also think that there are alot of frum jews in lakewood and the rest of the us that would also like to attend without necessarily voting for her.

  111. I am not a fan of Hillary Clinton and am definitely not voting for her. However, despite the fact that she might have been tolerant of Mrs. Arafat, she is not a rasha, just a politician (similar at times but not the same). Mrs Clinton is an important politician and deserves our respect even if we don’t support her!

  112. I am stunned by the statements and Svoros set forth in the prior 158 posts.

    Yes Halacha Byudua Esov Soneh Es Yakkov. That said no candidate will be a true Ohev Yisroel. I dont know what Dinim we need to call a Goyta a Rishanta but I would imagine under any guidepost used here that almost all of them would fit in that title.

    From a Torah perspective I dont know what makes her any worse than any other candidate. (I looked it up and was shocked to learn that kissing the wife of a Rotzeiach for political gain is not an Issur for a Goyta!)
    I do remember that her husband did do a Chesed for some Yidden before leaving office and suffered for it. If you agree with his actions or not we are Mchuyav in Hakoras Hatov.
    Many Gedolie Olam have supported and met with candidates and holders of high office who were not Shomer the Sheva Mitzvos and worse.
    If the Roshei Hayishiva were silent then they feel that this meeting is Mutar and they have plenty of precedents to rely on. You can discuss the matter with your chavrusa in the Beis Medrash but to Shraiy Kolos in public is a Chutzpah.

  113. May we can get her to stay over Shabbos, she can speat at the T/Auction Sunday night, (For Women Only) together w/Rebbitzen Rischel.

    I assume she will not be speaking publicly in front of men (askonim) tonight. Even in Skvere they woukld not allow that.

  114. Its Davids’house he can do as he pleases. There are no signs being hung up in the coffee room or in Satmar. What PUBLIC chillul hashem is there? Where I grew up in Brooklyn there were askonim who met regularly with politicians and I do not remeber any major outcry. Was there an outcry when the Skverrer Rebbe Shlit’a visited the Clintons at the white house? Could perhaps a parlor meeting in the campaingn for Clintons precluded that event?

    Do be straight – A question for David – you claim the yeshiva asked him to do this. Did the yeshiva ask him to also contribute to her campaign?

    Let him do as he pleases and people should relax a little. Maybe learn something…. its Lakewood.

  115. it seems that the “askonim” are not mavchin bein toiv lebish… it’s all the same… as long as they are seen every week with someone “important”, may it be “mesader” things for R’ Shteinman Shlita, driving the Skulener Rebbe Shlita, and then hillay… as long as it fits into the term of important, rachmana litzlan.compare this askonim which have had a full frum education to Mike Tress and Irving Bunim it makes one shivver from embarassment. as far as the list of donators, some are saying shiurim and giving over torah to our youunger generation, some involved in decisions of chinuch and BMG. PNEI HADOR KIPNEI HAKELEV. we should alwyays subordinate to the daas of the R”Y and Mashgichim which are true oivdei Hashem. Hey, just make sure the guy from LakewoodShopper gets in there… don’t take pictures of them shaking hands with her…


  117. update: Hillary showed up at about 750 – she barely waved to the 200 people standing outside, corzine left at 810 and gave every eye that he looked at a hello – hillary should be there until 9 – approximiatley 40 ‘frummer’ are in there

  118. …I am sure that by now that there is already 163 different votes regarding this story…..What is the public doing about this except talking …talking..and talking…Do somthing more constructive then just talk and hock!!!

  119. For all those bean counters out there (and you know who you are), I do believe this thread is by far the largest on YW, and even more remarkable is how quickly it got as so.

  120. You Lakewood guys are all nuts. No wonder Lakewood has so many meshugaim heizer. Lakewood should change it’s name to New Chelm.

    Rudy Guliani threw frum Yidden into jail when he was DA. Hillary got frum Yidden out of jail.

  121. There is absolutely no justification for any negative discusiion on this topic. As our senator, she has been representing us, and for this she deserves some marginal respect. As Jews, we are required to act with proper deeorum before the people who permit us to live in this free country. You are not obligated to admire, or even approve of specific individuals in the democratic government, but to engage in such blatant lashon hara about this woman is not only wrong, but, quite honestly, humiliating for the other Jews out there, who do not sit in omfortable homes and write deragatory comments about people who are out there, doing things for our freedom, and for our people. Not a day goes by without US debating and fighting for our people, only to find that there is no respect for the people who HAVE made something of themselves in this sick, SICK world! When all of you out there get out of your soft homes and DO SOMETHING for our people, you can come back and then, informed, you can go ahead and ‘bash’ anyone you please.

    Do NOT continue to embarrass the people who ARE out there helping YOU, or they may very well stop.

    On the subject of Clinton, she may not be someone we admire, as Jews, but she nevertheless has a part in allowing us to stay in this country, and this is not something that would, necesarily be continuing, if not for our senators and representatives defense of us. Do not forget that Germany was just as civilized as America, before they were seized with a desire to rid themselves of Jews. We will forever be a persecuted nation, and there are people, Clinton included, who are ensuring that America does not become the next Germany.

    Do NOT forget that other ‘frumma yidden’ are not the only people reading this website. Do not make others regret their kindness to Jews.

  122. how can 1 dispute her rishus. yes- politicians lie but how many are as shameless as clinton?how many have been involved in so many scandals and been allowed to get away with it.How can daas torah condone supporting her?.Does she not fit into the category of kot hashakronim that is not mekabel pnei hashechina

  123. is this over, is she gone yet? can we move on to more important matters – like the fact that the Wisconsin chapter of Chabad and their holiday Menorah decorations has only 10% of the # of posts that this thread has.

  124. Let’s all be dan l’chaf zechus a moment here. I don’t know Mr Lichtenstein, I don’t move in his circles but maybe, JUST MAYBE, we should just consider this a mincha l’eisav to a person who, chas v’shalom, may be our next president. I have no way of influencing a future president(G-d help us all) but if a g’vir can, kol hakovod. I think that we can be a little less laitzonisdik and give Mr Lichtenstein the benefit of the doubt. Just remember we all do our bit of hishtadlus in the ways we can. I’m sure that they can afford the $2400 bucks and I ain’t losin nuthin by her getting it. Relax.

  125. personally i will vote for rudy jewliani
    he is probably the closest we will get for a president to be a friend of yidden.
    i also think we should be dan likaf zchus for d.lichtenstien.i think that what is going through his mind is very simple:there is no doubt that this campaign is and will be very close to the end.onthe side rudy wins,there will be massive support anyways from most frum yidden.and in the event that hillary clinton wins,she will feel that there was support for her from the jews thru this event.he is hedging for the sake of klal yisroel!and oh are we gonna need jewish support especially with the current events.of course the rebono shel oilem will take care of us,but i think this was a very tactical and shrewd move and can probably be considered the hishtadlus factor!!!!!!!!!
    i think we should all apologize to him and thank him for what he has done.

  126. Amazing – there are more people taht donated to Hillary in 08701 than in 11219 or in 11230!

    Maybe, we can ask all those that donated huge sums to an Anosh Shen Lo Moshia to donate to Mosdos and Aniyim that hold the real yeshua for Yidden.

    But, I am suer that everone meant everything L’Shem Shomayim

  127. #3-Think Straight & #8-rebmoish- about her being Pro-Arabic:She said that she doesn’t understand Arabic.
    #5-TheEmes-, #17″How can any Jew vote Democrat”:Rudy Giulliani’s just as bad.

    #8-rebmoish-“is david a really frum yid”,#34″I hope not too many like him…”: be careful of what you say about (fellow) Jews.

    And to all of you: #1,4,5,7,12,13,17,30,34 etc…:Do you really think anyone else is any better? All polititions hate us and all other minorities. The trick is to get them to help us despite their hate.

  128. #178: Are you losing your mind? Giuliani is not the one who puts people in jail, it’s their own crooked actions. we want someone who stands up not for crooks and criminals (even “frum” ones) but for victims… one of the sheva mitzvos b’nei no’ach is dinim. kal vochomer to a tora yid.

  129. To fbi.gov (post 179): The fact that we have an opinion should not bother you. The fact that we have a forum to finally do so should please you. The fact that your backing the wrong horse should bother you.
    IkeshUphsaltol: You have way too much time on your hands, keep it up brother.
    Ah siz a gevald. There are few things as enjoyable as raitzing un a hypocritical liberal, even the frum ones.

  130. personally, i don’t think that hillary’s purported support for israel should be a reason to vote for her over issues of morality, values and principles. but for those of you who think the israel card trumps all, check out this article in the Jerusalem Post by martin kramer (senior fellow at Harvard University and senior fellow at the Shalem Center) called “Hillary: Triangulation on Israel?” which shows exactly how “pro-israel” hillary (or any other dem) will be:

  131. #185 what are doing are you trying to fix everyones opinions with your own general one that could take on everybody else’s. And Rudy is not just as bad
    keep reading.

  132. I heard that they wanted her to come here, bec. of the new clinic they are opening, since she came to New Square where they have the same kind of thing and supported them. That is why I believe that the yeshiva was involved in her coming to Lakewood.

  133. How sad that this forum for the free exchange of ideas has brought out the absolute worst in people from our community. What a CHILUL HASHEM you cause with the hate mongering and loshon hora. Imagine what an outsider reading these posts must be thinking about the yeshiva community. Lakewood, city of ten thousand Fiddlers on the Roof, shame on you!
    Dovid and Shiffy, looks like you pressed some buttons there. Great Job.

  134. All you kvetchers about Hillary she’s not so bad.
    Dont forget she made her husband issue a pardon for those unfortunate yidden from New Square who were sent to jail for allegedly taking money from the government. We traded pidyon shviim for votes.You will do the same in Lakewood.You will decide which candidate will give you the most. Then on the “advice” of you leadership you will all vote for him/her.Who he/she is doesn’t matter. What matters is what are we getting out of it.Our block voting gives advantages beyond our numbers,and and we know how to use it.All the above comments pro or con are “shtisim”. Results are what count.

  135. To Providence:

    If you spent a little time thinking about my comment instead of making an offhanded ad-hominem cynical remark, you would discover that many great gedolim in Klal Yisroel–the Agra Dekallah, Bnei Yisosschar–have warned of the effects of “Koach HaPoel BeNifal”–the power of treifa Gelt to destroy a person, especially a child. When we raise our children with money originating from ChaNuFa and selling our souls to Sodomites, we should not be surprised if the Bnei Yisosschar’s Koach haPoel BeNifal strikes us and brings tragedy into our community.

  136. To Straytthinker:
    Plagiarism isn’t nice! Can’t you come up with your own original name, instead of attempting to confuse the readers of this blog by imitating mine?

  137. Lets be honest here for a moment. You dont have to agree wit what Mr. Lichtenstein and crew did here. But that doesnt mean you can start a public bashing for individual(s) who help out the Lakewood Kehilla tremendously. You dont have to agree with what the vaad or any other group always does, but you cant belittle people who you have beniffited from. Mr Lichtenstein employs lots of Kollel wives, when he can hire other ppl for cheaper. Do you have any idea how much money Mr. Lichtenstein gave Tomchei Shabbos this year alone?? The numbers would astound you. In R’ Aaron’s zt”l times, they also made connections with politicians, whose views also werent the derech hatorah. R’ Aaron’s right hand man in these issues was Irving Bunim Z”L. It brought them great results, and helped them with their Hatzolas Nefashos in Europe. You sometimes have to think out of the box to do good for Klal Yisrael.

  138. To Pinnys’Angels:

    Your heart is in the right place, but the issue you raised needs clarification.

    There is a vast difference between “Askonus”–working with the people in power to help Jews–and political support–helping to put people in power through fundraising.

    Reb AhaRon, ZT”L, made the famous remark that he would even go to the Pope in Rome, if that would help save Jews during World War II. Irving M. Bunim and Rav Avrohom Kalmanovitch, ZT”L, were not BoDek any politician’s tzitzis when they went to them for help. They even worked with the Jabotinsky Merlin (Kook) group and Ben Hecht of Hollywood to save Jews.

    However, they were never involved with political campaigns and fundraising for politicians. When you put a politician in office, you are responsible for everything he does–he is a BoAy KoChaCho!–an extension of you–your ShaLiach.

    Moreover, when you publicly associate with a known promoter of Sodomy and a person who is a poster-child for the most degenerate forces in American society, this is a huge Chilul HaShem.

    Rav Avigdor Miller, ZT”L, spoke out many times against these Faustian bargains.

    It is inconceivable that such actions could bring positive results for our Tzibur.

  139. To Pinny’s angles #202.

    The difference between Mr. Bunim and here is that we can assume Mr. Bunim followed the Daas Torah of R’Aron ZT”L. The comments have asked numerous times was Daas Torah consulted.

    Those Askonim who represent the community may not have internet to see this request, but I’m sure there is someone who can ask them and get back to us, which will undoubetly put the entire matter to rest.

    I don’t know if you would put Daas Torah In the Box os as U say “Out of the Box” but I think as constituents of the Askonim we are entitled to this information.

  140. Tip O’Neill, the late Speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives, used to say that “money is the mother’s milk of politics.” Hats off to R’ Aaron Kotler and David Lichtenstein for organizing last night’s event. The new federal health clinic, money for special education, low income housing, land for yeshivot . . . All these and more resulted from access to the political powers that be. Who knows what these askanim could achieve for the Kehilla if they have direct access to the President of the United States?

  141. It is common knowledge in Washington DC that AIPAC is one of the top two or three most powerful lobbying groups in the country. AIPAC’s power arises out the fact that it works BOTH sides of the aisle in an impartial manner. The other key to AIPAC’s success is that they have developed a network of local volunteers that have developed PERSONAL RELATIONSHIPS with elected officials. Last night’s event adopted this wise strategy. While I do not plan to vote for Hillary, I am glad that if she is elected President, that she knows who David Lichtenstein is, will return his call, and at the very least give him a sympathetic hearing if an issue of importance confronts the Klal Yisroel. We must think “Lev melochim v’sorim b’yad Hashem” while at the same time making a reasonable hishtadlus with the rulers of Golus. Yasher Koach to David and the other askanim for making this histadlus on behalf of the Kehilla.

  142. r’ avigdor miller ztl, who had his fair share of corrupt politicians in his life, said when he grew up, g-d and hell were words in a candidates vocabulary. nowadays theres no mention of the former and the latter is where they all are going bimhairu. !!!!

  143. An old saying goes: When you lay down with dogs, you get up with fleas. Many people on this thread promote the false notion that the benefits of associating with Mrs. Clinton make it worth it. After all, we will get all kinds of government money. This is wrong and shows how much we are influenced by the ethical values of the corrupt culture we live in.

    I believe that any comparisons with past history are false. First, as others have pointed out, past generations had great leaders, true gedolim who applied daas Torah to everything they did. Second, the situation in the past was quite different. In many generations, great leaders had to associate with wicked people because Jewish lives were literally endangered. The support of a king or the friendship of a bishop could be the difference between life and death when the mobs ran wild.

    In a similar sense, even when these associations were made for financial reasons, it was often the virtual equivalent of a life and death matter, because the poverty was so great that the specter of starvation, homelessness and exile always loomed large.

    Today, thank G-d, we do not face the same kinds of threats. I don’t think we need Hillary Clinton in the White House to prevent pogroms. Likewise, the economic benefits of associating with this machsheifa are not so desperately needed as to suspend all Torah values and principles as in a pikuach nefesh situation. In fact, I would go so far as to say that the entire framework of always schnorring from the government has profoundly demoralized large segments of the frum world, making them pathetically dependent on handouts and unable to cope on their own. I don’t blame them for being poor or needy, just that they have been misguided into answering that need at the cost of a basic human value of self reliance.

    Of course, it’s all up to H-shem, but when we make hishtadlus, let’s look at what’s at stake
    Let our attitude be: the surrender of single Torah value is not worth all the money in the world or even in Washington.

    PS. Not to pick on anyone unfairly, but I was struck by ltoeles harabim’s (what a noble sounding name!) comment at #207. He apparently prefers Tip O’Neill to Pirkei Avos. The point of forming contacts is well taken, but one has to consider the price.

    Rebbe Yohanan Hasandler said: Any assembly which is not for the sake of Heaven, is not destined to endure. I pray that the organizers acted L’shem shamayim. But I dread the election of a truly wicked person.

  144. everyone should just keep their comments
    to themselves. we don’t know the reason for
    all this…maybe it’s a wake up call or something…
    but since everyone makes up their own story u can’t believe anyone! so think whatever you want
    cuz ull never know the real story!!
    we should be zocheh to moshiach now!!!
    a gutten shabbos!

  145. Let’s stop hokken & do some analysis: Which administrations were good for the Jews?

    FDR. Didn’t give a hoot about the Jews in Europe. The war got us out of the depression not the new deal

    Truman. Recognized the state of Israel but didn’t send any aid to help the Jews survive

    Eisenhauer. Pressured Israel during the Suez Campaign to give up her gains

    Kennedy. Too short of a term

    LBJ not much help in the 6 day war and creator of the welfare state (ultimately bad unless you believe in income transference) & the Viet Nam mess (he didn’t play to win).

    Nixon. Saved Israel during Yom Kipur war

    Ford. Too short

    Carter destroyed the economy with hyper-inflationnot seen since the Civil War (peace treaty with Egypt not the best thing especially with him turning out to be a rabid anti-semite)

    Reagan great on both international & domestic fronts

    Bush didn’t damage Israel(albeit he did pressure them on certain issues) but did damage Saddam Hussein

    Clinton. Utter fiasco on all fronts. Anything he did well was because the republican congress forced him too. His only accomplishment was NAFTA

    Bush great if not greater than Reagan (he didn’t bail out like Reagan did in Lebanon when 240 marines were killed)

    So if you want the republicans to take over congress vote Hillary. If you want a safe country and someone that wants to do the right thing, not just grab for power, vote Republican.

  146. I suggest (and its only a suggestion) that

    Jews do several things:

    1) Do more talmud Torah.

    2) Do more davvening.

    3) Perform more deeds of kindness.

    4) Paradoxicaly, be very careful of ALL goy
    including me.

    Doing the above will benefit you personally, your families, Jews everywhere, Israel and the world too.

    Toddah rabbah,
    A goy, shalom

    Gerry Mullen

  147. Hey not impressed, # 212, if everyone should keep their comments to themselves, please delete your message! Really, who are you to tell people not to comment? There have been some very thought-provoking comments and I was particularly heartened to see that many people feel the same strong misgivings that I do regarding pandering to this power crazed megalomaniac.

    No one on this thread doubts that H-ashem has reasons for everything. That doesn’t mean Jews shouldn’t think and comment on vital issues of the day, lest we end up making sadly uninformed remarks like yours.

  148. #203: Sorry, but you are dead wrong. In matters of principle and values Hashem expects us to act as if He can’t, k’vyochol. your business is to vote and stand up for Hashem’s principles and values. by the way, did you ever suffer a headache and not take painkiller because “if i have a headache, Hashem wants me to have it”? Hashem also wants you to tak aspirin. and to vote for the most conservative candidate you could.