Sheidim

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  • #591929

    I am very interested in knowing about Sheidim. DOes any one have stories or insights?

  • #808145

    missme
    Member

    Never met any.

  • #808146

    myfriend
    Member

    The only insight I have, is stay away from them.

  • #808147

    emoticon613
    Member

    if you’re female, don’t go to the public garbages at night; they hang around there (although i’m not quite sure what being female has to do with it…)

  • #808148

    myfriend
    Member

    “(although i’m not quite sure what being female has to do with it…)”

    Its an excuse to get the men to take the garbage out.

  • #808149

    emoticon613
    Member

    lol!

    but it’s really not.

  • #808150

    d a
    Member

    Tam Mahu Omer, if I meet any in the near future, after I recuperate I’ll try to post the story!

  • #808151

    cantoresq
    Member

    According my father z”l I’m a mazik, if that helps.

  • #808152

    coffee addict
    Participant

    missme how do you know maybe it was dressed up and you couldn’t see it’s feet

  • #808153

    missme
    Member

    you’re not trying to say you’re a sheid, are you…

  • #808154

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    it should be noted that if a woman has braids in her hair, they are made by sheidim and it is dangerous to undo them. She is allowed to go to the mikva without undoing it. the source is YD 198. I’ll look it up tomorrow for exact reference

  • #808155

    WIY
    Member

    Popa yes please look that up something sounds off about that. I learned in Kitzur that it should be undone.

  • #808156

    missme
    Member

    whats the difference between a sheid and a dybbuk?

    and which one did the Chofetz Chaim expel from somebody’s body?

  • #808157

    Firstly, it is dangerous to discuss these creatures. I don’t believe anyone today knows their nature exactly, but they are known to be more spiritual than man, but less than Melachim who are pure spirit. They have a physical component as well.

    As far as the dybbuk, this is some sort of spiritual remnant or gilgul or something of a person who once lived. This is what regards the story of the Chofetz Chaim

  • #808158

    WIY
    Member

    It is said in Zohar and other sifrei Kabalah that our Aveiros create Shin Daleds and these are called mazikim. These mazikim are our own mazikim and they are the ones that cause us problems. Peopl ethink “Hashem did x to me” no, your own mazikim that you created did it to you!

    This is a deep concept and an important one to know and understand. We punish ourselves with the averos we do.

  • #808159

    WIF: that is one form of mazik

    There are others.

  • #808160

    WIY
    Member

    Mod 80

    Hey Im no expert but I learned that most mazikim are from Aveiros.

  • #808161

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    its YD 198:6 in the Rema.

    says it need not be undone. (We are only speaking of the braids made by sheidim. I have been informed that today sometimes the braids are not made by sheidim but by the woman herself. This is an absurd practice. I imagine it may need to be undone to go into mikva in that case.)

  • #808162

    see the famous Medresh telling the story of how Shlomo HaMelech captured the king of the Sd, other Medrashim about the world of Sd.

    See Mesechta Pesachim ( i think in the 9th perek)a few blatt on the subject.

    I’m just saying it’s not so simple the all sd are mazikim created by aveiras. I have no idea what the percentages are.

  • #808163

    popa bar abba

    YD 198:6 says its dangerous to undo them. The Pischei Teshuvah has a long piece over there about it. Still it says braids that are attached to each other. I wonder if they actually look like normally braided hair.

    Also woman braiding hair is relatively common among Yerushalmis and some Chassidim based on kabballah similar to the concept of tefillin shel yad and akeidas Yitzchok. Although that is only among girls and not married woman.

  • #808164

    emoticon613
    Member

    some married women braid their hair so that it won’t by mistake slip out from under her hair covering – it’s more secure than a ponytail.

  • #808165

    WIY
    Member

    Derech HaMelech:

    What do braids, and Kabbalah, the akaida and tefillin shel yad have to do with each other?

  • #808166

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    I just can’t imagine anyone deliberately doing what sheidim are known to do. This speaks volumes about our society.

  • #808167

    WIY:

    Haven’t you heard- v’ameych kulam tzaddikim, nothing we do is just stam. Those three things have to do with binding ‘din’ in the world in order to subjugate it. Hair, Yitzchak Avinu and the left arm all represent din.

    p_b_p:

    The lashon of the RaMA is that they make “a type of braid that is connected to each other”. It sounds to me like it is not a regular braid.

    I don’t understand why we can’t do a similar action to a sheid with holy kavanah while they do their action with destructive kavanah. That would be like saying tzaddikim shouldn’t eat food since I eat food.

  • #808168

    000646
    Participant

    poppa bar abba

    Your funny!

  • #808169

    pbp

    Would have been better if you went with something like

    abbaM(-ari)_bar_poppa

  • #808170

    noitallmr
    Member

    This IS a shady thread!!! (Sorry folks couldn’t resist!!!)

  • #808171

    Coffee klutz
    Member

    I’ve been taught that blowing out matches or candles can call sheidim and therefore we wave the match instead of blowing it; and we press the candle wick with 2 fingers to extinguish it. We also do not whistle with the lips for the same reason.

  • #808172

    myfriend
    Member

    I also learnt you shouldn’t blow out a fire, but I had forgotten the reason.

  • #808173

    charliehall
    Member

    Rambam says they don’t exist, so you don’t have to worry.

  • #808174

    charliehll:

    What you mean to say is that the Rambam HELD that they didn’t exist, so maybe if you are Yemenite there is some protection for you.

    Other Rishonim held differently though as we can see from the plethora of minhagim we have today involving sheidim.

    The Rambam is not the only Rishon in Jewish history nor is he the only posek with an opinion on this.

  • #808175

    charliehall
    Member

    Derech HaMelech,

    The existence of Shedim is not a halachic matter for poskim. They either exist, or they do not.

  • #808176

    myfriend
    Member

    charliehall,

    The existence of sheidim, whether a halachic matter or not, are a matter of discussion amongst the Gedolim. The Gedolim zt”l weren’t limited to discussing, and stating the facts, to strictly halachic matters.

  • #808177

    charliehall
    Member

    And Rambam was the greatest gedol of the last thousand years. (We don’t follow all his halachic positions, though.)

  • #808178

    Kasha
    Member

    charliehall, that’s a unique opinion you have, though you are entitled to it. I though would certainly put Rashi ahead. Do you follow Rambam’s admonitions to working men to work 3 hours a day and learn 8? Or do only select and choose the Rambam’s you like?

  • #808179

    “The existence of sheidim is not a matter of halachic opinion, they either exist or they do not.”

    I would say you got that backwards. If the gedolim -especially rishonim- decide that something exists, even if it hadn’t before, it will from then on exist. It’s the Torah that decides reality not reality that decides the Torah.

    “And Rambam was the greatest gedol of the last thousand years.”

    I’m not even sure what that means. Standing on the streets on Manhattan are you able to see whether the Empire State building or the World Trade Center (z”l) is bigger? How are you able to determine that the Rambam was the greatest gadol?

    In addition the sefer Shomrei Emunim HaKadmon (a Rishon) says that the Rambam was chozer on his more “esoteric” ideas near the end of his life, since he hadn’t learned kabballah until after he had written his sefarim.

    The mekubalim do many things to keep sheidim and mazikim away such as shaking their tzitzis after looking at the moon during kiddush levanah. Its likely then, that the Rambam did this as well.

    In addition if you are Ashkenaz like me, you don’t pasken like the Rambam but rather the ReMa which clearly state that there are sheidim.

    This is similar to the story with man who came to the Chazon Ish for a beracha for a surgery in chutz la’aretz he was going to get for some ailment. The Chazon Ish told him that he sholdn’t go to chutz la’aretz and as long as he stays in E”Y he will be fine. When questioned about it the Chazon Ish said that the Beis Yosef was the posek in E”Y and he held that that particular ailment was not a mum in an animal which means that the animal wouldn’t die from it while the ReMa -who was the posek of chutz la’aretz- held that it was. So by staying in E”Y he kept himself under the auspices of the B”Y and was able to live for many more years.

  • #808182

    “100% wrong. Empirical reality simply is. It doesn’t change the Torah, and the Torah doesn’t change reality.”

    This doesn’t seem correct. We knot that HB”H was mistakel boraiso ubara olma. The reality of the world is based entirely and completely on the Torah.

    The Torah is whatever the gedolim of our generation says it is. If all the gedolim get together and pasken that the sky is really green than I am obligated to know that the sky is green.

    We learn this from the posuk in Devarim 17:11 “…do not turn from the thing which they tell you right or left”.

    Rashi there says even if they tell you your left is your right and your right is your left.

    The Kli Yakar brings a gemarah in Sanhedrin 17a that says “we don’t appoint someone to sin on the Sanhedrin until he knows how to make a sheretz tahor according to the Torah.”

    So as you say:

    “Even if every gedol in the world paskened that a non-kosher animal had the kosher signs, you’d still be over an aveirah if you ate it.”

    This would be wrong. If every godol in the world paskened that a non-kosher animal was kosher it would be mutar 100% to eat it and it would probably even me a mitzvah to eat it in order to encourage other people in their emunas chachamim.

  • #808183

    charliehall:

    You bring up a very interesting point B’Nogayah a Ketana, Dam Besulos, and a leap year (V’Hamavin Yovin).

    I wonder if when the Rambam Paskened there are no Shaidim, they stopped existing, even if they did exist prior to the Psak?

  • #808188

    After all this about the Rambam, can anyone point me to where the Rambam actually says this? I’d like to see what he actually says.

  • #808189

    000646
    Participant

    I dont know about Sheidim, but below is what the Rambam says about Kishuf (Madda Hilchos A”Z 11:16)

    ?????? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ?? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ???????? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? ??????. ???? ???? ?????? ??? ????? ??????? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ?? ?? ??? ????? ???. ????? ?? ?? ??? ????? ??? ??? ??????. ????? ?? ????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ?? ??????? ??? ?????? ????? ???? ?? ?? ???’.

    ?? ?????? ?????? ???? ?????? ??? ????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ???? ??? ????? ????? ???? ??? ?? ?????? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ??????? ???? ???? ?????. ??? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ?????? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ????? ???? ???? ???? ???? ??? ??? ???? ?????? ??? ???? ???? ????? ?? ???? ???? ?????. ????? ?? ???? ???? ???????? ?? ?? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ?? ?’ ?????

    So it is apparent that he didnt beleive that there was ever such a thing as Kishuf.

  • #808190

    Max Well
    Member

    “So it is apparent that he didnt beleive that there was ever such a thing as Kishuf.”

    That interpretation of Rambam doesn’t seem right. The Torah says kishuf existed in Eretz Mitzrayim, when Paroh’s kishuf-machers replicated some of the early maacos Moshe Rabbeinu performed.

  • #808193

    Charlie, just because a phenomenon cannot be detected empirically does not necessarily mean that it does not exist, dark matter for instance. The real issue re sheidim to my mind is, if they cannot be detected and cannot be definitively shown to have an effect in real world, who cares if they exist or not.

    Also re whistling. Both the Mechaber and the Mishna Berurah hold that whistling is not only muttar, but muttar on shabbos.

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