Reply To: Hospital Horror Stories?

Home Forums Decaffeinated Coffee Hospital Horror Stories? Reply To: Hospital Horror Stories?



“If society puts value on materialism”

This isnt about materialsim. The money I refrence is not money that will be spent on a “halachic dinner” There is a certain amount of money dedicated to healthcare. That can be spent in limited number of ways.

Arguing that the money is better spent on young people, smart people, cancer research, or whatever as opposed to comatose people isnt materialistic. It may be wrong but it isnt inherently evil nor based on “Dark and evil places”

Keep in mind halacha does the same thing though we define “productive” veeeeeeeeery differntly than society at large. Many poskim hold, given limited resources Talmidei Chachamim go first. sadly this came up with visas to leave Europe in the late 30’s early 40’s. Other poskim have other ways of determining who goes first. But these decisions are very real. And that Society doesnt value talmidei Chachamim like we do, and instead gives preference to “productivity” in other ways, is not evil nor materialsitic.

“This nurse, many years ago, would have been regretful and pained to make such a decision.”

how do you know she wasnt pained? I dont know the specifics of your father’s condition and want to avoid specifics.

Also I’m sorry I didnt mention this earlier, but I’m sorry you had to go through that. Having loved ones in an ICU is never pleasant (and that nurse sounds like only made things worse.), and I hope he had a refuah sheleima, and if not may he be a meilitz yosher for you and your family. He is lucky to have had a caring son with him in the ICU, sadly many are not that lucky.

“Has money really altered the value of life as you say? Or has it just changed the need for the different decisions?”

the latter. Though it isnt just money. There is a staffing shortage a bed shortage. A comatose patient in an ICU is litteraly taking a bed that can go to somebody else. I am not saying “somebody else who needs it more” but without the Torah as a guide (and even in select cases with it) it is a bed that can better serve somebody else.

“It may be “right” in the medical world, but it is not “right” in Torah.”

Again, I have said that repeatedly. I am not saying giving blood to young instead of old is right,just that even if wrong it is not coming from a “dark evil” place.

“You say noone is killing anyone? Absolutely false. Nobody argues that people are being killed”

I didnt mean noone. Obviously there are exceptions, but those are exceptions and I am not referring to them.


Thank you for that. IT explains a lot and I feel much better.

I also apologize if my tone was too harsh earlier. While I do know that the ideas you express “are not only incorrect, but they are the opposite of the truth, highly repugnant, and dangerous” it is limited to your ideas and not you personally. Thank you for your understanding