I just read Rav Kook’s hesped speech for the first time.
1. It seems that he is saying towards the end that the zionist movement is anti Torah, and halevai would not be against the torah if they would work with the torah…. I think is what he said…
2. Avi k- he did not say that the state or herzl is mashiach ben yosef…..why do you need to continuously put words into people’s mouths?? he said very clearly that herzl was the ikvisa demishicha. THAT DOES NOT MEAN MESHICA!!! I know that you will ignore this point, as you have only done just that in the past.
3. But either way, good news! it seems clear from what he writes, that this dichotomy between the two different sides is above all pratim and specifics when it comes to proving your position! you can come up with whatever svaras, or proofs that you want, but it doesn’t matter.
It is all about the chiluk between the bechina of mashiach ben yosef and mashiach ben dovid. since the two sides are vastly different, although they both work towards the geula, they cannot get along.
Im not being sarcastic at all. Please do not think that I am.
manitou, avi k, anonymous, etc,- i can understand that maybe joseph will not consider rav kook to be a valid source. That is Joseph’s issue.
but If YOU DO hold rav kook to be a valid source, it should give you an understanding as to why some may be so vehemently opposed to the state of israel, as those feelings are coming, validly, from the bechina of mashiach ben dovid.
We can now understand how there are two different sides, with both strong and important opinions, and they do not contradict each other, because they are both working towards mashiach.
Do you not agree with this? nobody should be attacking people when they say things against the state of israel, because we should know that it is only coming from bechinas mashiach ben dovid.
perhaps you will continue to argue, saying nope, they are just reshaim, and then you will have missed the point completely. You will not be hearing the words of your own rebbe, Rav kook Ztz”l.
We want Mashiach now, and along with Mashiach, Shalom
.