Reply To: Different Tracks of Modern Orthodoxy

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#2162727
n0mesorah
Participant

Dear Avira,

My point is that your mixing up today’s branches of Orthodox Judaism with a hundred years ago. Mixed swimming was an issue in many parts of Europe. It is hard to discern any country that was free of it. Even by those that were otherwise observant and had great torah leaders. It spread in America just like every other leniency did. As recently as the 1950s this was an issue even by chassidim! Teaching girls gemara came about in Europe from several different sources. Scholastic pursuit is an old discussion. The Modern Orthodox have not contributed much to this discussion besides for the claim that it is more of a necessity in our day. Etc. Etc. It happens to be that there is a relationship between these issues to the and the Modern/Yeshivish/Chassidish divisions of Orthodoxy. But it is a casual one. (מצה מין את מינו). Not an historical one.

Therefore, when you use the teachings of your revered Rebbe to claim the superiority of the YV over MO, your making a mistake. These teachings did not create the difference in the level of strengths between the communities. Rather they are a reaction to those very differences. In sum, the yeshivishe shittos of a hundred years ago could be used in support of MO much more than to oppose it. Like you say, אכשורי דרא.

My proof of it is, that to any insider the YV currently reflects very little of it’s Litvish roots. It is more and more a reflection of taking yiddishkeit very seriously. And with it, it is constantly borrowing and upholding other cultures that are about being very, very. frum in a visible manner…. Which makes MO even less appealing and so on and so on.

If you believe that this is the way of the Torah, than go ahead and work on it’s enactment. I’ll cheer for you with a full heart. But like much of Chassidus and almost every Jewish group, you totally fail when you try saying that this was always a historical truth. It’s simply not true. It does not mean your worldview is wrong. You can say, that now that modernity has given us such stark choices between right and wrong, of course we must fully commit to what is right and not associate with what is wrong. Even though we may forfeit all that worthwhile in the eyes of modern man OOPS! person.

But as soon as you claim this is what the Torah always was, your wrong. Even if you think your Rebbe told you so. It could still be true. Just not historically true.