Reply To: Bridging the Gap Between The Torah World and MO

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AviraDeArah
Participant

Dan… you’re totally misinformed. The only notable people in the agudah who voted to support a state run by halacha were the sadigerer and Boyaner rebbes, and maybe another, but honestly they weren’t on the same level as rav aharon and rav elchanan…they just weren’t. Not every prominent person is the same. Rav elchanan was the same as rav shimon, rav chaim ozer, rav boruch ber…all the litvishe roshei yeshiva and gedolim felt the same way about zionism, and rav chaim said it’s avodah zara, as did all of the others.

People quote a lot from rav isser zalman without ever providing a source; it’s a fairy tale, but even according to their reports, he felt that the state was a hatzolah, much like tue ponevezher rov – that isn’t nationalism or avodah zara. Nationalism, which MO is soaked in, is the idea that the jews are a nation by virtue of something other than just the Torah, and is inclusive of Hashem’s enemies as valid parts of the jewish nation. It’s an import from European nationalism, straight avodah zara.