Reply To: Refuting the Three Oaths [Gimel Shevuot]

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#2268576
HaKatan
Participant

Again, the oaths are settled halacha, as per all the poskim through the ages that brought them down and applied them, including the Rambam, and nobody can possibly claim otherwise.

Yankel Berel:
You’re wrong/misquoting, and this has been discussed earlier. He permitted only voting in Israeli elections since that doesn’t impact the State’s existence.

HaLeivi:
It is not “my” pshat. It is the Torah’s pshat. No Torah authority disagrees.

“And the fact that the state succeeded in being established, for quite a few decades now, is proof that this is not a violation of Olah Bechomah or Meridah Ba’umos. Because again, those Gezeiros meant that it can’t work.”

Your invented pshat in gezeira, however, is yours and nobody holds that way, unless you can find someone like a Satmar Rav or Brisker Rav or the like who says that. Speaking of them, by the way, the Brisker Rav agrees to the Satmar Rav and actually goes further and stated that the Zionist State violates the entire Torah.

If you think about it, though, you will realize that your pshat makes no sense. Hashem warned that if they violate the oaths, then he will make their flesh free as one would hunt game (“Ani mattir es…”). That inherently means that you could actually violate the gezeira if you want to do that – but that it’s not going to be pretty if you do. So the fact the State exists after all these years does not at all indicate anything regarding it being a violation of the oaths (which it most certainly is in multiple ways).

On a related note, and this will offend the hard-core Zionist idolaters but I believe it is Torah: the fact that the Zionist paradise requires sealed rooms in all homes, and looking over one’s shoulder to ensure there are no savages waiting to attack R”L L”A, seems pretty obviously a continued “Ani mattir es bisar…”.

Again, your pshat makes no sense and is totally baseless.

Regarding your question about the reason it is so egregious to violate the oaths, that would be because it is kefirah in bias haMashiach and, regarding specifically the Zionist State as per the Brisker Rav, kefirah in the entire Torah. Please don’t bring in Tzlafchad here who had noble intentions to show how serious is Shabbos and not CH”V to rebel in any way, unlike liHavdil the Zionist paradise which is a total and utter rebellion including replacing Judaism with godless Zionism.