Poshut,
Hakattan’s post was more like a masterpiece, with such obvious truth, that i urge you to read it again with an open heart and mind
A rebutal to your rebuttal, (cuz you seem to be a sincere guy, though you were nebach force fed false information over the years.)
1. You state that by the medina not supporting yechivos it is like you not giving a meshulach. False comparison, because the “government” is not supposed to be biased. You have no onligation to any particular yeshiva. But If the US govt would privide money to all private schools except for yeshivas you would see that they are being unfair? The govt. is sinking alot of money into other “more worthy” secular pursuits, without giving the fair share to the yeshivos. In that way they are subtly trying to shutter them up. It has gotten worse in recent years as they cut more and more of their funding. Is it any wonder that you see pehaps ten times more meshulachim from EY in the last decade than you ever have?
2. Regarding yahadus: Just one point. It has recently been reported that the majority (dont remember exact percentage) of secular israeli youth does not recognise the name “Moshe Rabbeinu”. Lehavdil, which american child does not know George Washington? Is that not a churban?! To deny these kids our own history??? The fact that many fast on Yom Kippur is one of the last few vestiges of “culture” that has stayed with them. May it be the mitzvah that will ultimately bring them back.
3. I hear your point about it having been a waste to send money to the nazis. Its hard to debate a point in history when you dont really know for sure what would have been. There definitly were cases of bribes to the nazis that worked. But the question is, at what cost the risk?? Let me put it to you this way: Imagine chas vesholam a child of yours was kidnapped for a ransom. The kidnappers demand one million dollars. Would you take the risk and send it to them? After all, they have no chezkas kashrus at all, and might just take the money and c”v! “elimiante the evidence.” Of course you would take any chance, whatever the cost to save your child and not save the money!!! We are talking about yiddish lives over here that weren’t worth 100 bucks to these people. Additionally, there is ample evidence of them not only not trying their best but even aiding and collaberating with th nazis y”s. That makes them partners in the murder machine which was Germany.
You say the zionists had no control over the killings?? I am not a history buff, but I have heard of stories where they would send back boatloads of jews as they reached the port of Palestine, knowing full well that it would lead them to their doom.
But you know, though the Zionists were definitely guilty of shedding innocent Jewish blood in the name of “zionism”, the main charge we have against them is their trying to destroy yiddishkeit, the way it has been practiced over the ages. As is well known, to destroy our guf is not as bad as to destroy our neshamas. There are countless examples in the Torah for that. And therefor, even one who SUPPORTS zionism with money is guilty of the evils they perpetrate. (see midrash says, footnote in parshas Pinchas about this, where he makes this point regarding why we treat the midianim much harsher than the mitzrim)
4. i do feel it is a tremendous matanah to be able to live and visit eretz yisroel. But Do you think if it would have stayed in british hands we would not have been able to? Modern planes and such have given us this availability. Not the medina
5. No One denies that a non-frum has a pintele yid. The problem is that the zionists try to extinguish it while the chareidim try to fan it into a glowing flame.
6. I can not comment on what Rav Teichtal says, but the fact that you say that since the land has not vomited the sinners it shows that they sre not sinners is so off! Are you trying to say there are no sinners?