Reply To: The Torah is Emes

charliehall, as far as I know the people in the Middle ages thought the world was round and there was even talk of falling off the world if people came to the edge.

What the scholars knew at that point does not mean that the uneducated serfs had any knowldge of a round world. In any case, the Middle Ages was full of uneducated, boorish masses who were very superstitious sand totaly believed in things that were fake.

I am completely unconvinced that any divine work or divine being can be proven by human logic or human collection of empirical evidence.

I am not trying to prove the Torah is divine, as I have written above. The truth is the truth even without my logical proofs. I’m just discussing logical proofs regarding the Torah’s divine origin.

How can anything that is amenable to human effort in such a way be considered to be divine?

That’s a very good argument, but since the Torah was given to humans to be lived by them, learnt by them and discussed by them, we can discuss as well, logical proofs of the Torah’s divine origin.

And if you consider the possibility that logic or empirical evidence can prove Torah, you have to also consider the possibility that it can disprove Torah, chas v’shalom, otherwise you have not really conducted an investigation. How can any Jew who accepts “with perfect faith” partake of such?

Did you read my entire first post? I have stated that the Torah’s is emes regardless of whether my “logical proofs” make sense or not.

We have perfect faith either way. But some people enjoy thinking and analyzing and coming to conclusions. Nothing wrong with that.

I’ve written “…Kol sheken we little people are nothing but little microscopic dots next to Dovid Hamelech can certainly not see the entire picture in life. We see our immediate surroundings, nothing more…Therefore even if we don’t understand the truth about life and the Torah, the truth still stays the truth.”

Do I have to spell it out after what I’ve written that although we as humans cannot understand the truth about life and the Torah, we still “accept with perfect faith” that the Torah is Emes?