Going on Vacation without a Minyan

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  • #1575733

    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Is that accurate?

    No “proof” has been given. People are giving their own boich sevaras.

    How many people do you know who really gain more in ruchniyus by going away to some place with no minyan?

    Hint: not too many.

    #1575789

    1
    Participant

    Daas yochid, thank you. Someone with common sense. Finish shas before going on vacation.

    #1575813

    GAON
    Participant

    Dovid,
    A thread doesn’t prove anything. You should ask your rabbi. Or, make a cheshbon hanefesh before deciding. What are the differences going to a place with minyan or not.

    There is definitely no absolute halacha forbidding to go. But as everything in life, you weight your options; do i need it or not.. Is it worth missing the benefits of minyan etc.

    Fact, in shulchan Aruch it says: ישתדל אדם להתפלל בבית הכנסת עם הצבור not חייב.
    And it says:
    ההולך בדרך והגיע לעיר ורוצה ללון בה אם לפניו עד ד’ מילין מקום שמתפללים בי’ צריך לילך שם ולאחריו צריך לחזור עד מיל כדי להתפלל בי’:

    None of the above indicate anything regarding the “travel purposes” are.

    The Aruch Hashulchan quotes the following:

    טוכתב הרמב”ם ריש פרק שמיני: תפילת הציבור נשמעת תמיד. ואפילו היו בהם חוטאים – אין הקדוש ברוך הוא מואס בתפלתן של רבים. לפיכך צריך אדם לשתף עצמו עם הציבור, ולא יתפלל ביחיד כל זמן שיכול להתפלל עם הציבור.

    Again it says Halachakly is only כל זמן שיכול..

    #1575846

    Git Meshige
    Participant

    The first Mishnah in Megillah discusses which days Megillah should be read and gives a reason why specific days Megillah should be read because the it would give time for the Villagers to come to the main City to hear the Megilah. If there is an obligation to be in a place where there is a Minyan, why are the Villagers living where they are without a Minyan? Furthermore, how could Rav Shimon Bar Yochai be ina cave without a Minyan? How did all the Gedolim in Europe who travelled from place to place do it without having a Minyan? The answer is , Halacha dictates that if you are in a town or within reasonable distance of a town that has a Minyan, one is obligated to attend. Otherwise there is no obligation.

    #1575859

    Neville ChaimBerlin
    Participant

    “No “proof” has been given. People are giving their own boich sevaras.

    How many people do you know who really gain more in ruchniyus by going away to some place with no minyan?

    Hint: not too many.”

    That’s not a proof either…

    #1575861

    zahavasdad
    Participant

    There is a difference between Halacha and Hashkafa

    #1575898

    Gadolhadorah
    Participant

    After reading 100 posts on this subject I come to the conclusion that there is a general sentiment that davening with a minyan is always preferable where circumstances allow but the same caveat applies to many other mitzvos and/or opportunities for hidur mitzvah where more is better than less but less is not itself forbidden. A yid who decides with his family to take a vacation where minyanim are unlikely because they wish to experience the benefits of travel may also make decisions in other areas of their lives which go beyond the norm for a particular mitzvah. I’m not suggesting you offset one with more of another since not all mitzvos are equivalent but in the real world, we do the best we can in terms of balancing competing priorities in our lives.

    #1575878

    DovidBT
    Participant

    There is a difference between Halacha and Hashkafa

    The OP appears to be asking about halachah (“Is it muttar?”).

    #1575932

    zahavasdad
    Participant

    It depends who you ask, there are opinions both ways, I personally have asked the shala and have been told it was ok , but I also know of plenty of opinions that forbid it

    #1575934

    1
    Participant

    Gadolhadorah and you should prioritize having an opportunity to say BARCHU ES HASHEM LEOLAM VAED and AMEN YEHEI SHMEI RABBAH MEVORACH LEOLAM LEULMEI ULMAYUH

    #1575979

    zahavasdad
    Participant

    Unless you are flying a direct flight to Israel, you most likely would miss a minyan (especially in the winter) even going on vacation to Israel, there are usually not enough religious jews on flights between the US and Europe on Normal Airlines (Like Air France or KLM)

    #1576035

    apushatayid
    Participant

    I would suggest traveling from place to place, and not having a shul/minyan during the trip itself is quite different than traveling to a place that has no shul/minyan and spending some time there. That’s my opinion, however, noone asked me……

    #1576032

    GAON
    Participant

    “you should prioritize having an opportunity to say BARCHU ES HASHEM LEOLAM VAED and AMEN YEHEI SHMEI RABBAH MEVORACH LEOLAM LEULMEI ULMAYUH'”

    Again and again: The question was if it was “Muttar” i.e. “Halacha”.
    The answer is Yes.

    “Prioritizing” is something each individual has to do, like everything else in life – e.g. will I waste my time in the CR here (this thread is about learning though:) or learn another mishnah, daf, posuk, the time I spend on X Y Z.

    And yes, not everything that is “mauttar” or not “assur” means you should indeed go ahead and do it.

    #1576313

    adocs
    Participant

    ZD

    Please show how it’s possible on a direct flight from the US to Israel to not miss a minyan (assuming no minyan on plane with it’s associated issues)

    #1576410

    zahavasdad
    Participant

    usually (and I said Usually) there are minyanim on direct flights between the US and Israel

    While there might be 10 men on other flights, its much rarer (maybe a flight to Uman or something like that)

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