March 14, 2018 9:00 pm at 9:00 pm #1490657The little I knowParticipant
1. The existence of G-d is not a scientific question. It is not a mathematical question either. It is a question about fact. There is an old rule – לא ראינו אינו ראיה. Not having found something does not mean it does not exist. It just means you have not found it. There is the old joke about the fellow looking at night frantically on a street corner for something. His friend sees him searching the ground there for something and offers to help. He stated he lost a 20 dollar bill. The friend asked him where he was when he lost it. He responded that he was across the street. So he asked why he doesn’t look there. He responded that there is a street light here, not there. Not finding does not indicate fact. Science can find a lot. But it does not know everything.
2. There are other factors in the “success” of a society other than the perception of morality. We can easily get into existential morality, which refers to the absolute, or the relative morality meaning that we consider it to be. The latter allows Islam to lay claim to morality. My protest to that is that it has no real deity or higher power as a source for anything. It is an ideology, not a religion. So it is a purely animal instinct based religion, and its form of “morality” is only a borrowed word. Furthermore, true success of society is its ability to remain intact for long times. There have been empires throughout history that lasted a good many years. But they imploded, died out, or were conquered. We can look with a narrow scope at what science tells us. It did not tell us that the WTC would be downed in a single day.
3. Mostly in agreement. I doubt that he was busy with opinions about Judaism or Jews.
4. I am not an apologist for Einstein. He was severely undereducated about certain things, hence his opinions about them do not impress me. I did not see any quotes from him that were offensive, just ignorant. Not worse than I would expect to hear from someone who never learned anything about true Yiddishkeit. It is reported that he did spend bits of time in his youth learning Chumash and Talmud. I do not know what experience he had with that learning. It was during the part of his life when he was known as “slow”. In today’s yeshivos, he would have been remanded to a class where little teaching of much substance occurs, or things would be simplified to where no thinking was expected or demanded. For someone capable of far more deep thinking, this might well have been a painful experience, and his finding these studies uncomfortable makes sense. It is speculative, but we do not know much more about that.March 14, 2018 9:00 pm at 9:00 pm #1490659
Let’s note that given three opportunities to give even one single example of what “GAON” thinks Hawking ym’s bestowed upon mankind that “Gaon” considers to be an emesdike חכמה, Gaon could not find even one example to share.
This is because Hawking’s life work in pseudo-science is strongly focused on pure kefira such as black holes, big bangs, the supposed “origin of the universe” and junk science like that. Certainly nothing regarding the יש חכמה בגוים – תאמן that Gaon is misapplying to Hawking ym’s.March 14, 2018 9:30 pm at 9:30 pm #1490676
“Einstein as a Jew has obligations, whereas Hawkins as a Non-Jew has non…he is not worse than all Ovdei A”Z or Greeks…”
Incorrect. Goyim are obligated to believe in Hashem, per the Sheva Mitzvos.March 14, 2018 10:03 pm at 10:03 pm #1490678
We say almost every morning אלה ברכב ואלה בסוסים ואנחנו בשם ה אלקינו נזכיר what makes us Jews exist is the belief in Hashem our G-d but המה כרעו ונפלו the great empires fell but we stay strong because the more we exist the stronger we get in our beliefs. The proof that Hashem exists is in our existence. My Rebbe said this is the meaning of השתא הכא if after all the afflictions we are still here is proof לשנה הבאה בארעא דישראל for the redemption.March 14, 2018 10:04 pm at 10:04 pm #1490679
Joseph, according to the Ramban and Droshes Haran there were two forms created one for the earth and another for the heaven. The other days these could have exploded by a big bang to create everything else such that only the first day the creation was something from nothing.March 14, 2018 11:21 pm at 11:21 pm #1490692
Big bang has sources in many great meforshim including Rishonim, as Las has pointed out, the Rambam in his comments and his sefer Toras Hashem Temimah, more in Sefer מעשי ה and אברבנאל, they strongly support that shitah, that there was only one major creation of יש מאין…see מעשי ה how he explains it a couple of times in Parshas Breshis .March 14, 2018 11:21 pm at 11:21 pm #1490694
The other days were only a creation of the same matter i.e.ד יסודות according to the above mentioned. I will post the sources later.March 15, 2018 12:06 am at 12:06 am #1490700
The Malbim in the beginning of Bereshis says that what was created on the first day is an argument in the Midrash among tanoim Rabbi Yehudah holds that the light was created whereas Rabbi Nachemiah holds that the whole world was created. The same argument as Rashi and Ramban.March 15, 2018 12:23 am at 12:23 am #1490705HealthParticipant
Joe – Gaon -“Hawkins is NOT a Jew and that is what I was referring to. Einstein as a Jew has obligations, whereas Hawkins as a Non-Jew has non…he is not worse than all Ovdei A”Z or Greeks”
Actually he’s much better than Einstein. Einstein was a Mechallel Shabbos.
Joe – “Incorrect. Goyim are obligated to believe in Hashem, per the Sheva Mitzvos”
Your Am Harazos is showing again!
Because of the posters, I looked up the Rambam again. Goyim are Mechuav in Avodah Zora, Not Kefira! Although there is a Machlokis on other Mitzvos, that aren’t from the 7 Mitzvos.March 15, 2018 7:59 am at 7:59 am #1490708
1. According to his chassidim Hawking is not dead.
2. Einstein did not have a set system of belief or non-belief. At various times he expressed various opinions. See the Wikipedia article “Religious and philosophical views of Albert Einstein”.March 15, 2018 8:03 am at 8:03 am #1490765ohreli1Participant
Hawkings was an outspoken supporter of Palestinian “causes”…. Real smart guy, eh? 😉March 15, 2018 8:06 am at 8:06 am #1490714Yserbius123Participant
Whoah whoah WHOAH stop.
Black holes are kefira? Howzzat? They have been scientifically proven to be possible by Einstein and Hawking was actually the one to theorize a way to see them, which was eventually proven when telescopes picked up on Hawking radiation located in regions of space where the gravitational movement of planets predicted there to be black holes.
What else is kefira just because you didn’t see it with your own two eyes? Amoeba? Pluto? Otto Von Bismark?
As for those questioning his contribution to “practical science”, Einstein’s theories of relativity were purely theoretical until decades after his death when it became crucial to designing the satellites that give us GPS. Number Theory was one of the oldest studies in mathematics and for thousands of years people tried to find use for it, until three Israelis named Rivest, Shamir, and Adleman along with two Brits named Diffie and Hellman simultaneously came up with cryptographical mechanisms that can be used to transmit data securely.
Sure we may not have a device that can utilize Hawkings studies in quantum entanglement, nor do our computers need to understand how information is lost across an event horizon. But maybe one day… Or do you just prefer that scientific progress stop right here and now because Yankele Schmendrick with his BA who can’t tell a quark from a quasar doesn’t think it’s worth it?March 15, 2018 10:29 am at 10:29 am #1490804👑RebYidd23Participant
Einstein was not a good person, but he was undeniably a scientist.March 15, 2018 10:30 am at 10:30 am #1490814
“Joe – “Incorrect. Goyim are obligated to believe in Hashem, per the Sheva Mitzvos””
“Relatively” speaking he is certainly worse…so no need to go any further.March 15, 2018 11:17 am at 11:17 am #1490912
“because Yankele Schmendrick with his BA who can’t tell a quark from a quasar doesn’t think it’s worth it?”
Exactly why it is not even worth the time arguing with one that has no inkling….His accomplishments and his works are there for all to see, i.e. anyone that has the minimum knowledge …
Perhaps the below Big Bang theorists are also ‘KOFRIM!:
תורת ה’ תמימה – Ramban
Continue the next three pages.
(the last paragraph)
Note – I am sure if you search you will find more. These are just a few that I remember for now…March 15, 2018 11:17 am at 11:17 am #1490900
Health, you’re factually incorrect. Goyim are obligated to believe Hashem is G-d.
Gaon, relatively speaking Hawking is a lot worse than Einstein. Hawking was a bad goy whereas Einstein, for all his many faults was still a Yid – albeit a Yid gone wrong.March 15, 2018 11:29 am at 11:29 am #1490944
Rambam’s opinion is not the only one though. See “גר תושב, חסיד אומות העולם וחכם אומות העולם” by Rav Ohad Fixler online.March 15, 2018 11:29 am at 11:29 am #1490943
“Plato was educated by Yermiah Hanovi.”
Thanks for the M”M. See what the Nishmas Chaim in says (2:10) regarding that and Aristotle.March 15, 2018 11:29 am at 11:29 am #1490930PhilParticipant
“This is because Hawking’s life work in pseudo-science is strongly focused on pure kefira such as black holes, big bangs, the supposed “origin of the universe” and junk science like that.”
Black holes are a reality and have been photographed by the Hubble Space Telescope. R. Aryeh Kaplan, zt”l, wrote, based on numerous sources, that the Torah’s account of creation is compatible with having originated from a Big Bang. Hawking may have spouted a great deal of theoretical nonsense and been a heretic but black holes and the Big Bang aren’t in and of themselves heresy.March 15, 2018 11:29 am at 11:29 am #1490925
G, that is not one of the sheva mitzvot. it is only the difference between a chassid and a chacham (Rambam (Hilchot Melachim 8:11). It gets him into Olam haBa (ibid).
Regarding Hawking, we can also learn positive things from him, especially perseverance in the face of adversity.March 15, 2018 11:44 am at 11:44 am #1490955
Speaking about “Black Holes” I am sure you can apply it in Kabalah as well…
Being that ___ has no clue what it is (thinks it is a Kfira term), nor is he familiar in any of these subjects so lets leave it at that: Everything is Kefira…unless proven otherwise.
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