Becoming More Wealthy, Becoming More Frum

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  • #1488140

    Yserbius123
    Participant

    I’ve noticed over the years an interesting correlation that people who less well off financially, they are also less frum. Now I must stress that this is not a hard and fast rule. Certainly there are people who lack financial stability and do not become less frum, and even some who might become frummer. But I’ve found a notable tendency among a lot of those less well off that they lose some of their frumkeit.

    Now I know that the usual suspects here are going to jump all over me for saying all this. But think about it. Many times those who grew up in the upper financial class or the middle class and lose out or even find some harsh facts of life after marriage, you’ll find them having far less time to learn Torah and shiurim than before and struggle to send their kids to proper Yeshivos. Limudei Kodesh often falls to the wayside, as the parents hold two jobs and constantly struggle to make it home and learn with their children. Cheaper food is sought and Cholov Stam is relied on sometimes or always despite having grown up in a Cholov Yisroel only home. Disillusioned and ignored children may even start going to or watching movies even though their parents never allowed that and they’ll be less careful with tznius for their wife and daughters than their parents were and many other similar inyanim.

    I want to stress that they’re still frum; they keep Shabbos (though they might no longer wait for Rabbeinu Tam’s zman), kashrus (though they’ll be looser on hechsheirim) and taharas hamishpacha. But certainly a lot of the ehrlechkeit they once possessed they no longer have.

    #1488260

    laskern
    Participant

    עולם הפך ראיתי The world is topsy-turvy, according to the Torah there is a danger that the rich forget Hashem from where their wealth comes from and say it is their own doing.

    #1488286

    laskern
    Participant

    It says עשה שבתך חול ואל תצטרך לבריות make you shabbos weekly and don’t rely on others. What the poor do according to their abilities is much more appreciated. If they get cholov stam so be it. The yeshivas tend to help out with tuition so they will not send their children to public school. What does tzinus and watching movies having to do with being poor. They can’t afford a TV, they will not have one. The parents have a responsibility to teach their children proper behavior when they are young as king Solomon says חנוך לנער לפי דרכו גם כי יזקין לא יסור ממנו if you teach your children according to their understanding even when the become old will not sway from it.

    #1489212

    Yserbius123
    Participant

    laskern that’s hogwash. Jews have mostly gone OTD due to poverty, not wealth. The Jews in Russia who dropped their Yiddishkeit rather than flee during the expulsion were mostly the ones who didn’t have much to begin with and were attracted to the wealth their non-frum countrymen enjoyed.Similarly when the Reform got going in Eastern Europe it was mostly attracted poverty stricken and less well off Jews who left frumkeit and Orthodoxy to join the fledging Reform movement.

    #1489282

    laskern
    Participant

    Yerbius213, I will repeat what I wrote before:

    There are two tests poverty and affluence. Each has its own ordeal. The poor feels he has been forgotten and not being helped, whereas the affluent forgets who made him so. According to the Ksav Sofer, the cure is to remember that your current status comes from Hashem. He can make you poor or rich. Constantly keep in front of you the opposite. When you are poor, keep in mind that Hashem can make you rich, whereas when you are rich, remember, Hashem can change your fortune. The Chasan Sofer interprets the haggadah בשעה שיש מצה ומרור מונחים לפניך keep the good and the bad constantly in front of you. The word פרנסה might remind us of this. It has in it נס and נסה. For the poor, it is נסה a test, but for the rich, it should be a נס a miracle because he should always feel that he doesn’t deserve it.

    #1491650

    MRS PLONY
    Participant

    Yserbius, I don’t think everybody gets your point.

    #1492010

    Its obvious if U can be frum while being wealthy good for U but in my opinion the nisayon is tremendous

    #1492018

    Joseph
    Participant

    Whose great grandchildren intermarried and had Christian einekelech in high society? Der Vaser Truger whose lineage today is seeing nachas in Shamayim from his einekelech learning in Brisk — or the Rothschild banking family?

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