HaKatan:
The choice of words, calling “mainstream” anti-Zionism (i.e. the Torah’s view) an A”Z, is poor and also offensive to the Torah…
I did not do any such thing, as I specifically excluded the Brisker Mehalech (which I believe is your’s as well). What I did include are those who have protests against the Gedolim (such as Rav Shteinman) and those who partner with Muslim businesssmen who want to destroy the Yidden in Eretz Yisroel (Zionist or not). Once again, the reason why I call it “Avoda Zara” is because any Mitzva can become Avoda Zara, when it becomes the Ikar over all other Mizvos, which get pushed out of the way for it.
The way I see it, this is where we are:
Brisker – OK
Neturei Karta – Not OK
Satmar – depends.
DY: We’ve had this argument before, I see no need to rehash the sides. You won’t know until you try, and Rav Shteinman has made the Daas Torah decision not to try.
Naftush: Huh?
ZD: I don’t believe you are correct. Even without the army, the Charaidim would still maintain their isolation from Israeli society (and Kol Hakavod). They would still not be “employable” in many areas due to the socialist type economy (as others have posted here), and lack of basic education (which is the real Shanda). Allowing for more free enterprise would enable Charaidim who want to open small businesses to do so. The problem with basic education is that the government want them to also teach “history AKA Zionism”. If they would agree on math, basic science & basic English (language) (so that the typical Charaidi boy in Israel has a similar limudei Mitzva education as a typical KJ boy or Riverdale Bochur), that would be a step forward.