jackk,
Thanks for responding, and I appreciate the tone of this discussion.
“My Merriam-webster’s definition of draconian is “cruel” or “severe.” It is usually used to describe harsh laws, rules, or regulations.”
Yes, and I think that definition is apropos to the Covid lockdowns and mandates. Many of the mandates were davka issued by local governments due to perceived “non-compliance” by the populace, which was ironic because the strictest mandates were typically made in places where compliance was already high (and politically safe to do so). The messaging on the mandates consistently had an air of punishment.
“For example, would you add the adjective ‘draconian’ to police shutting down a highway for an hour due to an accident ? Nobody likes it, but everyone understands the need for it.”
Yes there is no objective definition of draconian, so those opposed to a law are more likely to call it draconian than supporters. But I don’t think “draconian” and “necessary” are necessarily oxymoronic. So perhaps we can drop the word draconian and I can ask, do you feel that the Covid mandates were quite harsh?
“I believe that the crux of the issue is whether the people ordering the draconian measures had a good faith belief – at that time – that the measures were justified to save people’s health and lives.”
I disagree. As the expression goes, the road to gehennom is paved with good intentions. Human society is extremely complex, and we deserved more than a one-dimensional ham-handed authoritarian response dictated by an extremely small set of voices with a narrow vision and financial conflicts of interest.
“Just because there were other alternatives or mitigations in no way refutes, disputes, counters or proves that the reasoning behind the draconian measured was incorrect.”
Nope, the world does not work like that. We even expect our young children to consider alternatives and mitigations to their actions.
“The pikuach nefesh argument can be applied because the mesirah was done in order to protect lives not to harm the synagogue.”
No it wasn’t. As I wrote above, the result of the call was a fine and citation.
“I do not deny people being bullied. I was bullied myself and I know of many instances of the Mitzvah of “bein adam lachaveiro” that metaphorically was flushed down the toilet.
It was a very big nebach of the whole situation.”
It was not an unfortunate side-effect – bullying was actively encouraged by government officials at all levels. The Pharmaceutical companies provided wildly incorrect assessments of the effectiveness of their vaccines, and based on this information, the Biden Administration used the July 4th holiday in 2021 to declare “independence” from Covid. When the Delta wave subsequently rolled in, instead of dragging the Pharmaceutical executives into inquiries and investigating their claims, the Administration began a campaign of scapegoating those who declined vaccination or criticized any of the pandemic response orthodoxy.
“In order for us to get through Covid, we needed one plan of action.”
I think that holds true for traditional disaster response, e.g., after a hurricane or earthquake, when the response is straightforward and what is most important is proper coordination, efficiency, and speed. But we’re talking here about a global-scale situation lasting over a period of years when the parameters of the response and metrics of success are poorly understood.
“During the pandemic, the people responsible in the government had to decide a course of action.”
Or rather, provide the resources to facilitate those most directly responding to do their jobs well.
“I probably would want the advice of the person who has been at the head of infectious diseases in the US for the past 40 years.”
I’d want a multifaceted team that could devise 4-dimensional proposals to a 4-dimensional problem.
“The people who were not responsible could criticize all that they want. It was not their responsibility to safeguard the health and lives of the nation, and nobody would be blaming them for any deaths.”
I’ll let you fight this out with Always_Ask_Questions. He holds that it was indeed everyone’s responsibility, and those who disagree with him are to be blamed for the deaths.
“There was one man who shouldered the heavy responsibility and accepted all the criticisms. He did not shirk it although he knew that he would be castigated and made into the Republican’s party scapegoat.”
I really don’t understand the deification of Anthony Fauci. I think millions of people shouldered heavy responsibilities during the pandemic and made tremendous sacrifices. And nobody is immune to questions or critiques, whether their intentions were good or not.