Reply To: Tznius Standards

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#651136
mariner
Member

joseph,. you need to stop drinking whatever it is you drink. the pasuk says women are like royalty. teh gemnora asks what does that mean, the gemora answers, that they stay in the home. royalty stays home, they have servants do their bidding. a husband back then, was to treat his wife accordingly, and provide for her. nowadays that is not possible in most homes, as the market has fluctuated to the point that 2 incomes are needed to stay afloat, as in a market like ours, based on free market science, supply and demand would demand that a household income from the 1920’s with inflation, will be devided now, yes, post feminist society, between man and his wife. because of this FACT, the idea of treating your wife as royalty HAS to change, otherwise you must say the torah is wrong. i will not say that, so i choose to say that teh rabbonim never meant for this to be a set in stone definition of what royalty is. today, it must have a differant meaning, as royalty and its definitions change.

now of course since today royalty is garbage, you have to go to the highest common denominator. tha between other halachos that we have set in stone, as in what bones to cover, etc, and the social norms. this is not reform or conservative, but what the orthodox believed up until recently. using insults to argue against my points is childish, and shows how wrong you are. i am in no way sayig that short sleeve shirts, and go-go skirts are muttar. that would be against halacha.

and ny the way, technically you are the one saying that teh deifinaition of tznius changes, as you and your chevra feel open toes shoes are assur, yet, women wore sandals anb went barefoot up until way after the churban bayis sheini. they also didnt wear sheitels. they wore coverings more like burqas. so everyone allows change it seems, except when the change isnt to YOUR liking. well sorry, judaism isnt a monopoly. it has a basic set of laws, and then minhagim that must fit into those laws. and has barriers setup by rabbonim, for their communities to make sure daily activities dont in any way minimize the basic rules. hence, in yekke communities, rav hirsch got rid of all traces of kabbala from davening due to shabbsai tzvi. the satmar shave womens hear off completely for mikvah and other reasons. sfardish chachamim were always makpid to pass over taharas hamishpacha and kibud harav to their misspallilim, so that when the time came, and they were able to again strengthen their kehillos, the families would be pure, and they would have the respect needed to make changes, as they are doing today. probelm is, here in american ashkenazick communities, they are predominately chassidic in nature, as the litvish communities were all but wiped out. (this is fact,, as most real genuine litvaks came before the war, including the families of most of the litvish gedolim today). chassidic communities are controlled heavily by rebbes, and the mentatilty of my way or the highway has taken effect throughout teh communities, irregardless of the fact that it is keneged all that judaism is. judaism is the sole religion that has no one right way to behave, save for the basics.

{brought to you by a orthodox jew who hasnt gotten drunk on the kool aid}