Reply To: Avoiding Even The Appearance of Impropriety…

Why are we all playing into the attempt of someone who is far to the left side in hashkofo and in bein odom lemakoim to show off what a “tzaddik” he is in bein odom lechavyro? This is a total non-issue and just a way for someone to show off.

As others have already pointed out, there is no Bein Adam L’chavero side here. There is no doubt that I was allowed to take the soda. In taking the soda, I simply took what I was allowed to — in no way does that entail “showing off” in Bein Adam L’chaveiro.

Please illustrate how the episode, as I related it in the OP, portrays me as a tzaddik in Bein Adam L’Chaveiro.

I once double-paid for an item because I bought the kosher version (a special run with a simple sticker) in our community kosher store, slipped it into my coat pocket and unknowingly walked into the supermarket with it instead of checking it into the supermarket’s hall locker. When I saw treyf and kosher had the same UPC codes, I just took my kosher product out of my pocket and added it to my cart. (no chilul Hashem in having goods in my pocket here – people often use their shopping bags as carts and a pocket would just be seen as eccentric so long as I pay in the end). They rang it up because their system could not possibly know it was not their merchandise. Very easy to worry about appearances after the fact, and very different when you actually have to pay.

I fail to see the point of this story. Are you asserting that I acted dishonestly by taking the soda? If not, then what was the point of this?

And I would not have mentioned it had it not been for the shvitzer

Please define “shvitzer.”

(Yes, I know it means “one who sweats,” but that’s obviously not the meaning in context here.)

who started this thread. Unlike the shvitzer who is a salaried employee,

And if I am a salaried employee, so what? Does that somehow make me less honest? I fail to see how the conditions of my employment have any bearing on the discussion.

I have to hustle for every penny I earn

Is it your contention that, as a salaried employee, I don’t work hard for the money I earn?

and as I’ve been in retail I know what it is to deal with shoplifting. Therefore, I’d rather pay for my own stuff twice than even be suspected of shoplifting – and this in a place where it is well known that no Jew even thinks of shoplifting

I did not even think of shoplifting. Or is it your contention that I actually DID steal the soda?

because we don’t have OTD here B”H.

Where is this magical community where you have people who don’t commit sins? Or are you implying that I am OTD because I took the soda?

As for this situation, if you did not know to wave the can and smile at the cashier, or otherwise acknowledge what you were doing so she could respond, then you need to learn social skills.

Why? I told her as she was ringing up the purchase that I was going to take the soda. My problem isn’t with the cashier, it was with other customers at the site. The cashier knew what I was doing. As such, it was NOT obvious to me that I needed to “wave the can” at her. On the contrary, since she was busy with other customers, I did not want to bother or disturb her.

In other words, my social skills are fine, thank you very much.

I’ve had this happen to me at least 20 times in some way or another – exchanging goods because I took the wrong one, landing a bonus, having credit from an earlier purchase etc, etc, etc and that is just the common sense thing for you to do.

Again, as stated above, the issue wasn’t the cashier… she and I knew the story. The problem is that the other patrons of the deli weren’t privy to the conversation.

So, I ask you to answer the following questions:

Is it your contention that I stole a can of soda? If not, what exactly is the Bein Adam L’chaveiro issue here that you contend I am using to portray myself as a tzaddik*.

What, exactly, is a “shvitzer” in the context used by you?

Is it your contention that, as a salaried employee, I don’t work hard for my salary? If not, then what, exactly did you mean by your statement of Unlike the shvitzer who is a salaried employee, I have to hustle for every penny I earn?

What do the terms of my employment have to do with this situation at all that you even bring it up?

Is it your contention that I lack social skills because I didn’t want to interrupt someone who was busy?

Is it your contention that I was guilty of shoplifting a can of soda?

Is it your contention that I should have paid for the soda even though it was included in the price of my order? Why?

So, please, 600kilobear, answer me these questions. I await your answers.

The Wolf

* By the way, if you follow my posts closely enough, you will see that I just about never portray myself as a tzaddik on these boards. On the contrary, I usually portray myself in the other direction.