Reply To: can i date a girl without Shadchan????????/

I spoke to the Chassidishe Rabbi again.

First I want to apologise for misleading all of you!

I told everyone that every person in Tanach and Chazal used a Shadchan. I also said that in all cases a person needs a Shadchan.

In Tanach it is clear many people never used Shadchanim-but they had Heterim.

For example Yaakov Avinu was 84, and never used a Shadchan. So if you are 84 and have not sinned all your life like Yaakov then you can do it without a Shadchan.

Moshe Rabbeinu did use a Shadchan, this is clear, when Yisro said ‘I am giving you my daughter as a wife’.

Shimshon never used a Shadchan, but Talmud Sotah reproaches him for this (he went after his eyes so the philistines gorged his eyes), we can learn from this if you don’t use a Shadchan and follow your eyes you will end up marrying a goy (Samson married philistine Delilah).

Dovid Hamelech never used a Shadchan with Bat Sheva as Talmud Shabbos says she was destined to him from the Six Days of Creation.

Dovid Hamelech took Michal, because he killed Goliath and Shaul (her farther) said anyone who kills Goliath will get my daughter, therefore no Shadchan was needed.

Rabbi Akiva dated Rochel without a Shadchan (this was when he was a Am Haaretz).

There was a Tanna who acquired ‘wife’s for the day’ (to stop him having ‘hirhurim royim’) when he traveled), this was done through a Shadchan.

My Rov was telling the general law, people must have Shadchanim, in unique cases (like Rikki2 mentioned it may be a exception and no Shadchan is needed). In ‘Middle paths’ case his mashgiach gave him a Heter to not use a Shadchan, if this Masgiach is doing the right thing it depends if his case was ‘unique’ enough to give him a Heter.

To use a Shaddchan is a Minhag based on a Geder.

The Magen Avrohom mentioned in Sefer Matmonim (a Minhag Sefer we all use, a few hundread years old Sefer)that we should use a Shadchan as Avrohom (the first Yid in the world) used a Shadchan for his son Yitzcok.

This was before Maten Torah, but it says in the Talmud the Avos kept the whole Torah before it was given.

The Sfas Emes was asked by someone if he needs a Shadchan, he answered we learn that when Hashem gave the Yidden the Torah, he gave it through a Shadchan (Moshe Rabbeinu)-the relationship between Hashem and the Yidden is compared to a Chosson and Kallah as we say in the wedding ????? ?? ??? ????? ????? ???????.

To those who called me a ‘Baal Teshuva’ for misunderstanding Minhagim, here is my response. There are 2 types of Minhagim.

1) Some people keep, e.g. Belz keep certain Minhagim, Ger keep others.

2) all people keep, e.g. those who keep Mingahagim keep the ‘Shadchan’ Minhag.

The Reason the Rama does not mention it in the Shulchan Aruch, is because it is obvious, the ‘right’ thing to do is use a Shadchan.

I also want to apologies for saying there was a Shadchan used by those bochurim and dancing ‘Bnos Yerushalayim’ in the vineyards on Tubi Av. Most Meforshim there say the women said ????? ?? not a Shadchan, but one commentatator asks why the women can speak to the men (he can’t remember which one says that).

There is a commentator there called Meleches Shlomo who says ‘this thing was only for people who did not succeed in the normal way and without this they would be single till there hair turned white therefore they made this Minhag’ of allowing them to marry without a Shadchan.

In conclusion ‘be a Kosher Yid, use a Shadchan, ask your Rov, he may give you a heter not to use a Shadchan if you are a unique case.