Reply To: Would you choose army or kollel?

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#887019
yichusdik
Participant

The notion that the farmers, masons, merchants, tradesmen, shepherds and all other Jews living in the times of Tanach and in the times of the second bais hamikdosh who put down their pitchforks and picked up a spear when necessary were all learning as their primary occupation is foolishness. We have an entire corpus of halocho l’maiseh based on the understanding that people worked, traded, ate, drank, traveled and got into disputes every day during the normal course of their lives. What need for the halochos of a shor tam or muad if there are no career shepherds? What need for the halochos of boundaries, of open pits, of orlah if there are no career farmers?

The notion is LUDICROUS.

If halocho doesn’t convince you, the archeological record does not sustain the notion either. Eretz Yisroel was a pastoral and agricultural society, with no evidence that it was filled with kollels rather than farmers and shepherds (of whom there is evidence).

If that doesn’t convince you, maybe think of this. Earlier this week I was in an antique coin shop and I bought an excellent example of a prutah from the time of the Chashmonai kings, Probably Yochanan Hyrcanus, about 180 years before the destruction of the bais hamikdosh. (lots of these around, not very expensive – about $20.) I wanted to own a physical manifestation of a Jewish sovereign entity from 2150 years ago. That coin says a lot. It says that there was an entire society – trade, taxes, military, craftsmen, healers, anyone who might need to be paid – who were not learning as a primary vocation, but who would value the authority of the Anshei Kneses Hagedolah because they gave rules for living a practical halachic life. If they were told by the anshei kneses hagedolah – don’t work, don’t serve, don’t build, just learn, then (a) we would have had no need for the laws of the time that crystallized in the mishna, and (b) the society at the time would have become completely dysfunctional. Without Jewish farmers working Jewish land, people would starve. Without skilled craftsmen there would be no buildings in Yerushalayim. and so on. The Anshei Kneses Hagedolah knew that a Jewish society needed people to work as a primary vocation, so it interpreted and created laws for them to do so.

If you believe in yeridas Hadoros, and even if you don’t, who can now argue with the Anshei kneses hagedolah? You, Hello99? You, Toi? You, DaasYochid? Jews need to work AND learn. Jews need to defend themselves AND learn. If strict conditions need to be emplaced, then do so. Create a Hesder +++. If new streams for national service will better fit Chareidi needs, then suggest some! The response from the chilonim will be vastly different if there is an acknowledgement that simply butting heads is not an answer.