Reply To: Who Should be Giving Tochecho to Whom?

Home Forums Controversial Topics Who Should be Giving Tochecho to Whom? Reply To: Who Should be Giving Tochecho to Whom?

#908158
vochindik
Member

Sam2: How about you define this “MO” that you think is so problematic?

The questions will remain, after you determine “the range of beliefs held by people who describe themselves MO”, aren’t these beliefs shared by those who do not describe themselves as MO? And isn’t it true that what one group considers MO, another group who also consider themselves MO will call “beyond the pale” (such as Edah)? And why is it that these beliefs generate a new substrata of orthodoxy? If I hold that one may daven Minchah after Shkiyah, for instance, does it make sense for me to call myself a “different type of Orthodoxy”? Modern Orthodoxy is nothing but a label. It is used by different people at will to describe so large a range of beliefs and actions that there are MO who consider beyond the pale the beliefs and actions of others who are called MO.

The reason for this confusion is because, unlike Chasidim, Conservatives, Maskilim, Briskers, and other “movements” stemming from Judaism (some legitimate and some not), MO was never officially created. Rather, it began as simply people violating accepted standards of Orthodoxy, and then, when these low standards became the norm within certain communities, they decided to self-proclaim themselves MO, giving the illusion that their indiscretions are instead some kind of set of beliefs. There were no rabbis that decided “OK, we are creating Modern Orthodoxy. These are our teachings…” the way all the other movements were created. Just the opposite. After certain behaviors became excepted in certain communities, those communities said “Well, I guess we’re just Modern Orthodox!”. And anyone can do that to justify any type of behavior, we have so many diff groups and definitions and people claiming the title for themselves.

The only coherent explanation of Modern Orthodoxy comes form Rav Soloveitchik in his Five Addresses, which is, in a nutshell, we must compromise our standards in America because traditional Torah standards will not survive here. Only Yeshiva University type Judaism will survive and all else will die out. Which means the integration into secularity must be done to the extent that we must in order to survive. Obviously, the whole idea was a mistake.

I will grant you that a “Modern Orthodox bungalow colony” that has established mixed swimming (should such a thing exist; which I actually doubt) is not really Orthodox.

It is prevalent and well-known this is what it means. Read the ads in the Jewish Press classifieds around April – June and call the ones advertised as a MO bungalow colony. It almost virtually always is a code-word for mixed swimming (and other bad things, but mixed swimming is a common denominator.) I could name names of popular colonies, but will refrain. Why do they call themselves a “MO bungalow colony” and not a Chareidi bungalow colony?