Annoying Jewish Telemarketers

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  • #616470
    Y.W. Editor
    Keymaster

    THE FOLLOWING WAS RECEIVED VIA EMAIL TO YWN – IT HAS NOT BEEN EDITED IN ANY WAY.

    i am quite certain that my experiences are not unique, and that my reactions to them are also not unique. we all lead busy lives. we are pulled in many directions, have countless responsibilities to family, spouses, children, parents, jobs, etc. And then, as we are juggling our responsibilities, the phone rings. we rush to answer- i , personally, have an elderly mother with multiple health problems- i answer every call. so do many others. and who is the caller? a recording , be it from a yeshiva, a mossad, a sale from a heimishe business, a reminder to attend a function – the list goes on and on. these calls come at all hours, disturb dinner, homework- disturb life. they are unsolicited- and they call both my phone numbers. i believe they constitute onoas devorim, and can only wish they would stop.i dont know what rationale these people use to justify the mass calling and intrusion of countless people.

    #1215027
    Gottit
    Participant

    I totally agree with this. But what I find even more annoying, are the live telemarketers. You can’t just hang up the phone on them, because they keep nagging you to pledge a donation. And you gotta be ultra polite because it might be someone you know.

    #1215028
    DikDukDuck
    Participant

    The Mossad?

    #1215029
    Joseph
    Participant

    Non-profit mosdos making fundraising calls is legal both according to secular law and Jewish law.

    #1215030
    👑RebYidd23
    Participant

    With a live telemarketer you can politely explain that you don’t talk to telemarketers and hang up.

    #1215031
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Joseph, there’s no specific halachah against walking over to someone and tickling them either.

    #1215032
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Or against sockpuppeting, but it’s still very annoying.

    #1215033
    64bitsomething
    Participant

    nomorobo.com helps with some.

    #1215034
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Some of you may not believe this, but in real life, I’m a pretty nice guy. So it wasn’t easy, but I trained myself to simply say, “Sorry, but now is not a good time” and hang up even while the telemarketer starts to make his/her pitch.

    #1215035
    Joseph
    Participant

    If the issue is with the time of day the calls are being received, and not opposition to receiving the calls altogether, it is a legitimate discussion. But other than not making the calls at an unreasonably late hour, how is the fundraiser supposed to know when you are eating supper?

    Raising tzedaka is a very Jewish midda.

    #1215036

    I expected this thread to be about how to annoy telemarketers,

    and whether it’s allowed if they’re Jewish.

    #1215037
    lesschumras
    Participant

    Thank Hashem for caller ID. The worst are the ones who scream for several minutes that there are only two hours to buy a ticket. The second worst are the ones who lie and say you’ve donated before. With caller ID, I don’t have to deal with it anymore

    #1215038
    yehudayona
    Participant

    I’m not sure why the OP feels compelled to answer every call even if he has an elderly mother with many health problems. It’s highly unlikely that someone calling about his mother will have “Unavailable” as their caller ID.

    My complaint about some of the allegedly frum robocallers is that they’re breaking the law by not disconnecting when I hang up on them. If I pick up the phone again after hanging up, they’re droning on about the sale I don’t care about or the Chinese auction that I’m not interested in. G-d forbid that I should actually need the phone for an emergency.

    #1215039
    Yserbius123
    Participant

    Recently I was at my parents, who live in a very frum city. The house phone rings and my mother says, “Here, listen to what we have to put up with” and answers on speaker. It was a robo call in Yiddish about some sweepstakes or other. She barely even glanced at the caller ID. Apparently, every call that comes in that they don’t recognize the number is a teletzedakaer.

    I told my father that what they’re doing is illegal and can be reported. He said that there’s a possible maasrus shaaloh so he didn’t want to. I disagree, as there’s no mesirah if the person is actively committing a crime, there’s no shaaloh of medinas ra, and people are being bothered by it.

    #1215040
    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    Lesschumras

    I was thinking the same thing

    The worst are Chinese auctions they get so annoying!

    #1215041
    Ex-CTLawyer
    Participant

    Coffee Addict.

    The term Chinese auction is a very disgusting and derogatory term and should never be used. They are not auctioning off Chinese people as they did with blacks in pre-Civil War America.

    I have a Chinese daughter, my wife and I adopted her in China 18 years ago at a time when due to government one child per family policy, newborn girls were being killed.

    Any charity or organization that advertises a Chinese Auction will never get one cent from me, and I will publicly urge a boycott of the charity/organization until the term is banned and proper apologies made.

    We know dozens of other Jewish families that adopted infant girls in China and we are all offended by this racist term.

    BTW, we also have a white, American born adopted daughter who is 30. We did not start to adopt until we had 3 natural birth children, then for medical reasons could have no more.

    #1215042
    Joseph
    Participant

    Y123: It is legal for non-profit/religious organizations to make cold calls to numbers on the dnc list.

    #1215043
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    CT lawyer – I have never in my life heard anything about chinese auctions to indicate it is derogatory. I assumed this was a discreet way to have an auction, more typical of chinese culture than ours. And now that I have googled it, i have found that others echo that sentiment. No evidence anywhere of this being derogatory. Not even sure what it could mean if it was.

    #1215044
    yehudayona
    Participant

    Joseph, you’re correct that charities (and politicians and pollsters) are exempt from the DNC list. But I’ve had robocalls from furniture stores, which are clearly illegal. And not disconnecting when hung up on is also illegal.

    #1215045
    Joseph
    Participant

    CTLawyer, do you on principle not play Chinese Checkers or eat French Fries?

    #1215046
    👑RebYidd23
    Participant

    Japanese and Dutch auctions are not considered offensive.

    #1215047
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Yehudayona, Joseph was responding to Yserbius123′ “heter” to masser on a tzeddakah telemarketer.

    #1215048
    takahmamash
    Participant

    Gottit:

    I certainly had no problems hanging up on telemarketers. And we kept a list of telemarketer numbers, so if they popped up on the caller-id, we’d just let the phone ring.

    #1215049
    Little Froggie
    Participant

    Again, let me repeat what I wrote once before. If you get a call and suspect it’s a telemarketer etc. keep quiet, and wait for the other party to speak first. The way these robot-calling system work is that a machine dials your number, and if it detects a live human voice (as opposed to an answering machine), it will connect to a live “operator” on their end. Keeping quiet on your end will avoid that. Try it out. The line usually goes blank after ten seconds.

    #1215050
    Shopping613 🌠
    Participant

    That’s hard to do with a full family going through supper, pj’s, and bed.

    #1215051
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Yes, that would be time consuming. My method is quicker.

    #1215052
    mazal77
    Participant

    My beef is the organizations that sells donors names. I get bombarded by them. Like, I gave you a donation and did you a favor, now you sell my name?? And now i have to deal with shredding the papers that contain my address? oh and the ones that so “thoughtfully” include shamimos items!! Seriouisly, like I need more shamimos items to get rid of?? I did not ask to receive your “gift”. No I do not need a Birchas Chanukah, or Licht Bentching.

    #1215053
    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    This thread is a bit over the top.

    What is the origin of “chinese auction” anyway? Wikipedia doesn’t know. I doubt the origin is auctioning off african americans in the south, since then it would be called an african american auction. Also, people were auctioned as slaves throughout history–not just in the American south, so they may as well be called a paris auction, or an algerian auction, or, hey, a chinese auction.

    I think frum chinese auctions are racist because the prizes are never things that are only used in discrete racial markets except frum markets. For example, have you ever seen an Indian product that they only use in India being auctioned at a frum chinese auction? Racists. That is why I will never give a cent to any chinese auction, except the one that I like to go to because my friends go and there’s separate seating so I get credit for a date but sit with my friends.

    Also, if you call me during dinner, on my cell phone, I will either (a) not answer, or (b) answer. Those are the only two choices, and neither one leads to a contribution, except the chances are slightly higher if I answer.

    Also, if you call me during dinner to tell me about your dinner, I only assume that someone else will call me during YOUR dinner, and how will I enjoy it anyway?

    Also, once I went to a chinese auction, that served chinese food. But I’ve been told that in china they don’t eat what we call chinese food. They eat real chinese food (and mistama call it american food). So this was very confusing, and indicated to me that in china they also don’t have chinese auctions. They instead have regular auctions where you bid on stuff and the highest bidder wins and gives it to the rav, and they call it simchas torah auctions.

    #1215054
    Ex-CTLawyer
    Participant

    Coffee…read this 2002 post from wordoriginsorg…….it brings home the point I made:

    Joseph, it also answers your question about checkers

    CONFUSED ABOUT CHINESE AUCTION #21 [-]

    Mar 19 02 10:50 AM

    My children came home last night with an advertisement for a Chinese Auction that was going to be held at one of the local elementary schools. We are Chinese Americans.

    My 10 yr old son asked me if only Chinese people were allowed to go. I told him “no”. He then asked me what an auction was. I explained. He then asked me if they were planning to sell Chinese people.

    When I asked the schools about the term “Chinese Auction”, I was told that this is what it has always been called. (Not that this is justification…..). I then asked the obvious question, “WHY?” I was told then that the Chinese, a long time ago, were considered “tricky” and “deceptive” and that that was why the term “Tricky Tray” was synonymous for “Chinese auction”. I went from curious to offended very quickly.

    It seems to me that things should be named appropriately. I am not offended by “Chinese Food” or “Chinese Checkers” because those are appropriate names and accurately describe these things. I am offended by “Chinese Auction” because there is absolutely nothing Chinese about it. Call it a “Basket Raffle” or “Surprise Raffle” or even “Tricky Tray”. But for goodness sakes, let’s not call it “Chinese Auction” because that is not what it is.

    #1215055
    ☕️coffee addict
    Participant

    Ctlawyer

    Wiki Chinese auction it’s not offensive

    #1215056
    feivel
    Participant

    How dare you call yourself CT lawyer. . I have had many CT scans and very serious conditions had to be ruled out. And there are millions of other people who also were in similar situations. It’s life and death and you use those letters for some internet club!

    I find it disgusting and highly offensive. And since I have had a very personal connection to CTs I feel thoroughly justified in taking said offense. I have every right to and you better feel bad about it. And don’t give me any of your Connecticut stuff.

    That REALLY REALLY felt good. Now I understand the deluge of political correctness and the victim mentality. It’s just plain FUN! Almost as good as revenge.

    #1215057
    zahavasdad
    Participant

    CT has a point and its not funny, however most of us (including me) do not get that Chinese auction might be offensive. wherever that term came from sort of lost its meaning.

    I was once speaking to someone on the phone and she says to me that I should “Jew Down the Price”. The person had no Idea I was jewish and didnt even think that was offensive. I do sales and normally you are supposed to be composed over the phone (They called me , not a cold me from me) and I told them how offensive it was to say “Jew down the price”

    #1215058
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    What a hypocrite! How dare you come on and give sanctimonious mussar about the innocuous computerized tomography, using the offensive screen name you do.

    Do you know what horrors your screen name awakens in me? Can you imagine the torture I went through in a grade between fourth and sixth, with a rebbe whose last name started with a letter somewhere between K and M? Are you so callous and insensitive to use that offensive screen name, and so unembarrassingly falsely pious as to even use it in a post innocently written by a member of that most noble proffesion, legal council?

    For shame (how I shudder to even think it), 5L.

    #1215059
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    ZD, I disagree with that comparison. The term “Chinese Auction” has no obvious offensive meaning, while the term “Jew down the price” does.

    #1215060
    feivel
    Participant

    Are you kidding!

    Look at yourself!

    Do you have any idea how many millions of people have experienced untold severe anxiety and even loss of irreplaceable data by the “blue screen of death”? DOS Yochid.

    #1215061
    Sam2
    Participant

    DY: Eh. I don’t think “Jew” is any more offensive than “gyp/jip”, which I hear people say all the time.

    #1215062
    gavra_at_work
    Participant

    Agree with DY, just hang up.

    #1215063
    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    DY: Eh. I don’t think “Jew” is any more offensive than “gyp/jip”, which I hear people say all the time.

    I don’t say gyp. It’s highly offensive.

    #1215064
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    5L {shudder}, maskim. What do you suggest I change it to?

    Sam, if you don’t want to be offended, I have no problem. Its no mitzvah to be easily offended. I just think that even if someone finds that particular use of “Jew” to be offensive, they shouldn’t find “Chinese Auction” offensive.

    I agree that Jewish Israeli Princess is offensive.

    #1215065
    zahavasdad
    Participant

    Gyp comes from Gypsy because people thought the gypsies would trick them out of their money (Gyp them).

    Chinese auction is not offensive to us because we didnt know where the term came from

    Squaw Valley probably isnt offensive to most of us either, even though Squaw is an offensive term for female Native american

    #1215066
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    well none of those are as offensive as being called an oveid a”z. just saying

    #1215067
    feivel
    Participant

    DY. I don’t know. I can’t think of anything clever to say.

    #1215068
    feivel
    Participant

    Apple Yochid or Mac Yochid isn’t funny.

    #1215069
    feivel
    Participant

    But maybe the mods can change MY name to sixem or forkay.

    But that’s not funny either.

    #1215070
    feivel
    Participant

    Popaesque:

    I never say gyp, I only say jip

    #1215071
    Joseph
    Participant

    well none of those are as offensive as being called an oveid a”z.

    Being called a kidnapper is also highly offensive. But if someone is a kidnapper or oveid a”z, calling a spade a spade is only the truth.

    #1215072
    🍫Syag Lchochma
    Participant

    so than the bottom line is somewhere between “better to be right than a mentch” and “all bad behaviors can be rationalized”

    #1215073
    👑RebYidd23
    Participant

    I have never heard anyone take offense at “guinea pig”.

    #1215074
    YITZCHOK2
    Participant

    Most of the organizations use commissioned sales people to call for money and I have a problem with that.

    #1215075
    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    Most of the organizations use commissioned sales people to call for money and I have a problem with that.

    Why?

    They only do it because you’re too cheap to donate money otherwise.

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