- This topic has 20 replies, 13 voices, and was last updated 2 weeks ago by .
-
Posts
-
Why is it that the Chofetz Chaim and thousands of jews in Lita and Poland were able to wear a simple hat that costs around $15 max, while we all 1000’s of people must buy expensive hats that cost a couple of hundred? And what about families with many boys? We can save our community millions if we’d all agree together to wear simple caps, at least for the weekdays. Dont even ask about those who wear biber hats! They go for like $400 or so! Why must everyone copy everyone else? And if we must, then let’s all stand up together and say: enough! We are going to save much money and much headache!
The cheap hats they sell Purim time that look similar for the real ones can actually pass for a real one.
So your question is “Why must everyone copy everyone else?” and your solution is “Let’s all agree to copy everyone else but copy something different than we are copying now”? You don’t have to copy everyone else. go buy whatever hat you would like.
In Belz the Rebbe made such a Takkanah [at least in Israel] for Bochurim to wear much cheaper and simpler hats, similar to the old European style. Married Belzers wear ‘beaver hats’. But now they only need to buy one per household. Last time I bought one it cost about $350. [I’m not Belz, but many other Chassidim also wear these hats.] In general Takkanos nowadays can only seriously gain traction in a Chassidish community. Aside from the fact that אם כבר, there are MUCH bigger and less necessary expenditures to cut first.
Because we choose to conform. Lol.
Why is the pasuk “ma rabbu maasecha” omitted from the Shabbos morning “yotzair or”?
I bought my winter Black hat from Macy’s for $70 in 2023. My summer black hat came from Bloomingdale’s on sale for $54.
No way I would spend many hundred of dollars on a hat despite being able to afford it.
I do not need a Borsalino to cover my bald head
Radin students saw a reference to a sefer in Mishna Berurah but could not find a sefer in the yeshiva, so they thought Chofetz Chaim kept it at home and went to him to ask to read it. He answered hat he did not own the book, but knows someone in another town, an hour away on a train, where they can find the sefer. When students were surprised that Chofetz Chaim had to borrow the sefer he obviously learned, he explained: sefer costs gelt, and gelt is tzait (of working for it), and tzait is Toirah …
So, presumably people who spend on unnecessary things either do not value their Toirah or learned how to live at someone else’s gelt, so they think they are better of than Chofetz Chaim who did not figure it out.
@Richmond-Braun
We do not need to wear hats that are expensive. For non-Chassidic Jews, there are inexpensive Fedoras available from retailers that look similar to those sold by the hat stores that cater to the Jewish community. There are also Jewish alternatives, like the Yeshivish Hats .COM website, which were, at last check, far less expensive than the regular hat stores.Regarding wearing caps during the week, it would seem to be more expressive of love of G-d to wear a fedora or the like, rather than a cap, so there is that benefit that should not be overlooked.
Better yet, let’s do away with the whole black hat culture.
A student of R’ Ahron Kotler, R’ Aaron Rakeffet-Rothkoff once said in an interview that in those days, it was considered chutzpah for a guy learning in BMG to wear a black hat – that was only for the Rosh Yeshiva! The rest of them wouldn’t have dared to wear one!
Here are the exact words he said:
“Today we all wear uniforms. What is the concept of wearing a uniform? What is chassidus all about? It’s beautiful. You have a social order, you build a wall around yourself . It’s a way of protecting yourself from outside influence. My generation didn’t need it. When we made a commitment, we made a commitment. That’s what I meant.But if a black hat will keep you frum in America, you should wear two black hats, not just one. To me, being a Torah Jew is the most important thing in the world .
But when all is said and done, the chassidim conquered America. The Litvakim lost. In the Litvishe yeshivas no one dressed the same. When I learned in Lakewood, the only one who wore a black hat was Reb Aharon Kotler.
Even the old mashgiach, Reb Nosson Wachtfogel, wouldn’t dare wear a black hat. No one wore black pants and white shirts. It was unheard of. Everyone dressed different and stylish. In YU, not so much. Lakewood was more stylish because it’s part of Slabodka mussar [to dress in a dignified manner].”
Richmond – HaKatan is right that the Litvish have cheaper alternatives anyway, so it isn’t as big a deal by them. Wearing an old Shtetl style cap while clean-shaven with a modern suit would make the bochurim look ridiculous and be a ביזיון התורה. Kosher food costs more. More mehudar Matzah, Lulav, Esrog, etc. cost more. Not everything is about saving money.
I just find it interesting that all cost saving ideas seem to target the “frum” lifestyle, I.E. weddings, hats, daled minim at sukkos time, hand shmurah matzah pesach time. How about suggesting buying used cars on ebay (yes, you can do that) used furniture, fancy houses etc. Yes, it is true that occasionally these topics do comew up, but they generate much less interest. Also, housing focuses on moving to areas that do not provide the same level of frum conviniences such as a more “frum/yeshivish” Minyan. That is not to say that it is not a valid option for some, just that it seems to be making light of those tha want to live a more sheltered lifestyle. I would think that there are other, more secular, changes that could be made.
Please don’t start with the arguement that these things aren’t religious in reality. I know that. Please wake up and look at the reality of the way things are, not the way we think things should be. You will find that it is more productive.DaMoshe, right, this was not just Lakewood, but European attitude the same. Sheitels are at least fashioned as a hiddur mitzva, but black hat and levush is beyond that.
That people are attracted to that is a little weird, but understandable as in your quote “if it keeps you frum”. But, then it becomes the “norm” and is declared the essence of Torah. So, we gained hats, but lost Torah.
PS I believe R Wachtfogel walked casually in a hat in his later years, if my memory is not mistaken. (I was listening to him talking, not looking at his hat, but he was not turned off by my lack of a hat).
You asking for a major communal shift for something that relatively involves a minor expense. The extra money spent on stupidities at one simcha can pay for a lifetime of black hats for an entire family. Do you have any idea what it takes to change a communal norm once it becomes accepted?
Here are just a few subjects that will be much easier to change and much more cost effective. And yes, I am quite the confident that the Choeftz Chaim would agree
Inviting all extended family for sheva brachos and aufruf
gifts for choson and kallah
Buying an apartment in Israel for newlywed couples
supporting children in Kollel who don’t need the money for day-to-day expenses (they are putting it away for the next generation)
Luxuries at summer camps
etc.Maybe y’all can call it the curse of conformity
Why do we need another thread about yidden admonishing other yidden about how to spend their money. Even in Lakewood, social norms aside, there are no laws requiring that you to wear a black hat, much less prescribing how much you need to spend on that hat. As others have stated in several different ways, if the point here is that a $1,000+ shtreimel or a $400 black fedora is neither m’D’Oraisa or m’ D’Rabbanan and a black velvet yarmulke, a white kippah sigurah or a red MAGA baseball hat would likely satisfy what an erliche yid is obligated to wear. And yes, everyone is entitled to spend what they earn in a manner they see appropriate w/o getting online musar about their gashmiyus
You are entitled to spend what you earn but there are also social consenquences like eventually the standards get raised, you lose touch with reality. A lot of things can happen from choices you make that prob should be thought about
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.