asking someone to daven for you

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  • #617736

    square root of 2
    Participant

    Are those who are makpid not to say machnisei rachamim also makpid not to ask someone to daven for them?

    #1152690

    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    No. The two are not congruous.

    Machnisei Rachamim asks the angels to bring our tefillos before HKBH. The implication is that, without their help, our tefillos will either not be heard or otherwise have greater difficulty getting HKBH’s attention. This contradicts the idea that we do not believe that any intermediaries are necessary between us and HKBH. I can daven to Him and He will hear me – angels or other beings not required.

    Asking someone to daven for you is different than the above. I’m not asking the person to convey my tefillos to HKBH; I’m asking him to add his voice to mine in prayer to HKBH. In this scenario, the other person is not an intermediary. His prayers don’t make sure that mine are heard — they are simply added to mine. As such, it’s not the same scenario at all.

    The Wolf

    #1152691

    Little Froggie
    Participant

    HaShem actually condoned it. ?????? ???? ????. HaShem told Avimelech to give back Sarah, and that Avraham Avinu would daven for him and he would live.

    #1152692

    popa_bar_abba
    Participant

    It doesn’t work anyway. The other person gets it.

    #1152693

    Avi K
    Participant

    The Chatam Sofer did not say “Machnisei Rachamim” but did daven for others. He explained that being that all Jews are connected the person is really davening for himself. If he is a talmid chacham he has more merit and davens better. However, angels have no involvement with us (Responsa OC 1:166 -http://www.hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14663&st=&pgnum=130) .

    #1152694

    mik5
    Participant

    He who davens for his fellow will be answered first.

    If a person has a choleh in his house, he should go to a chacham and request that the chacham should daven for the choleh.

    Reason: When a chacham hears that a Jew is sick, the chacham is pained and is not able to learn so well. So Hashem will heal the choleh so that the chacham should not be pained.

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