November 14, 2022 9:02 pm at 9:02 pm #2138236RebYid613Participant
It was amazing from Rav Yitzchok and Rav Moshe Fingerer, Rav Gav Friedman, Rav Lieff, and Yehuda Green. Thousands of people taking part in it. Ashriechem!November 14, 2022 9:09 pm at 9:09 pm #2138244ujmParticipant
How many irreligious people became religious as a result?November 14, 2022 10:26 pm at 10:26 pm #2138250☕️coffee addictParticipant
Are things that instantaneous to you?November 14, 2022 10:27 pm at 10:27 pm #2138253
There’s merit in exposure; sometimes the seeds of a genuine shabbos experience remain in a person and have an influence so some point in their life even if they don’t become frum.
Any improvement is worthwhile. The chofetz chaim supported thw kosher kitchen in an army base, even when he heard that Jewish soldiers were eating treif and then getting a second helping at the kosher kitchen. He said that at least they’ll eat a little less treif – that was enough to justify large investments of time and resources, in an era where food was very valuable.
I’m not a lubavitcher; they take this idea to an extreme, where a person putting on what they believe to be random leather boxes from someone who looks Amish is worthwhile – i disagree. I believe that exposure to yiddishkeit needs to be on a level that a frei person can relate to, such as seeing a shabbos table.November 14, 2022 10:28 pm at 10:28 pm #2138257commonsaychelParticipant
did they give the Regents there? and what was the favorite pasga sheet there?November 14, 2022 11:32 pm at 11:32 pm #2138273
we have about 4 mln Jews in America without any connection to anything genuine and on the verge of disappearing. Why question any attempt to save these people!?November 15, 2022 12:15 am at 12:15 am #2138283BaltimoreMavenParticipant
Avira – not that I disagree but do you know about the Chazal that say a person who puts on Tefillin just once in their life its a huge zechus?November 15, 2022 12:40 am at 12:40 am #2138285
Baltimore, this refers to someone who puts on tefillin and believes in the mitzvah – if someone doesn’t believe – and isn’t even aware – of the mitzvah, it’s a maysoh kof b’alma, a meaningless act. It’s true that if a renegade Jew puts on tefillin once, while shirking his obligation every other day, he has a zchus, but that’s only if he did it with a minimum awareness – I’m not referring to the machlokes if mitzvos require kavanah or not; everyone agrees that you need to accept the reality of a mitzvah for it to count, because if there’s no metzaveh, commander, how can there be a commandment?November 15, 2022 2:23 am at 2:23 am #2138295philosopherParticipant
Avirah, well said.November 15, 2022 7:15 am at 7:15 am #2138296HaLeiViParticipant
… putting on what they believe to be random leather boxes from someone who looks Amish
This utterly bazaar description of a Mitzva would never come from your mouth had it not been for trying to bash Chabad. גדולה מחלוקת שמגיעה עד כסא הכבוד .November 15, 2022 9:32 am at 9:32 am #2138377lakewhutParticipant
UJM BJX has helped many people become frum. For many, it starts at seeing what a shabbos table looks like.November 15, 2022 9:33 am at 9:33 am #2138379lakewhutParticipant
Avirah a Jew who never puts on tefilin in his life is a karkafta. While he might not have the right daas or do the mitzvah properly it’s better than no tefilin ever. How many people do the the Lakewood establishment yeshivas reach from the outside and make them religious?November 15, 2022 1:09 pm at 1:09 pm #2138411
Lakewhut – quite a lot, actually. Lakewood itself established kolelim in small communities which function as outreach centers, and they have a huge influence.
Haleivi, the emphasis was on “what they believe to be” – tefilin are the holiest objects that we can own, save for a sefer Torah. Chas veshalom to say otherwise.November 15, 2022 1:09 pm at 1:09 pm #2138412
Also lakewhut, there can’t be a mitzvah without a metzaveh – it’s not my torah, this is rishonim who say that a kofer’s mitzvos aren’t mitzvos, we don’t answer amen to his bracha, etc..November 15, 2022 1:12 pm at 1:12 pm #2138417
Aaq, because Torah isn’t hefker. When people do things in the name of my religion that are misguided, I feel a need to speak out. When frei people think that yiddishkeit is leather boxes and shabbos candles(I’ve heard this before) there is a problem.November 15, 2022 1:24 pm at 1:24 pm #2138430HaLeiViParticipant
@lakewhut, karkafta means a head. You mean, קרקפתא דלא מנח תפילין
Also, I believe that the Lakewood Yeshuva actually does outreach, in the sense of setting up Torah centers around America.
As for your main sentiment, I agree. Someone who felt one-upped by the Tefillin campaign came up with a Lomdus to justify not doing it, rather than just saying it’s not for me. This is completely contrary to our general Hashkafa on every other Mitzva and their effect.November 15, 2022 2:08 pm at 2:08 pm #2138480
My sentiments about tefillin were taken straight from letters sent by rav hutner to the lubavitcher rebbe; wasn’t my own Torah, nor is it very lomdishNovember 15, 2022 9:51 pm at 9:51 pm #2138614
Avira, you love finding the worst in everyone (Briskers excepted). It is an easy-to-verify fact that there are shuls full of people who learned by Chabad shluchim, and even in other places there are people who learned by them. If Lakewood kollelim have a similar effect, then great. Now, if some of them are not doing things right, you are free to direct them to better understanding and mekarev them into Brisk.
Again, we are confronted with 4 mln drowning Jews and we are barely saving 1% of them.November 16, 2022 9:57 am at 9:57 am #2138685lamud vov tzadikParticipant
Anything to support Shabbos is a humongous Zechus!November 16, 2022 10:04 pm at 10:04 pm #21388891Participant
On average how many people do Lakewood Kollelim connect with people who aren’t frum and help make them frum? The numbers aren’t nearly as successful as those of Kiruv organizations and Chabad.November 16, 2022 10:04 pm at 10:04 pm #21388901Participant
There’s a way other than the Lakewood Bubble.November 16, 2022 11:29 pm at 11:29 pm #2138922philosopherParticipant
AAQ, it’s ironic that you say on someone else that they love finding the worst in everyone…November 16, 2022 11:35 pm at 11:35 pm #2138937
Kollelim help baalei batim to learn and provide affordable teachers to local schools. Thus, these baalei batim stay in the town and feel more attached to learning, and also give to Chabad houses who connect to non-observant. Thus, Kollelim indirectly contribute to the Chabad activities.
R Salanter saw such connections in spiritual world: when something is not learning well in vilno, a professor in Paris becomes an apikoires or something like that.
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