August 17, 2017 12:01 pm at 12:01 pm #1340946
– quote attributed to the UK Labour shadow minister Sarah Champion. Censored to leave out the me’anes bit.
She also wrote: “These people are predators, and the common denominator is their ethnic heritage.”
And now she’s had to resign.
Let the comments begin…August 17, 2017 6:28 pm at 6:28 pm #1341220
Britain has a problem with black haired people exploiting white children. Let’s face the facts, its true!! Most of the convicted abusers have had black hair, not brown, blonde or any other color. This is an issue, and we must deal with it. What? It doesn’t make any sense that a hair color can play a role in defining abusers? Well, those are the facts.
I said it.
[#CRDSYAG]August 17, 2017 6:39 pm at 6:39 pm #1341377JosephParticipant
if most terrorists are Muslim, is their being Muslim irrelevant to the issue of terrorism (i.e. in regards to prevention)?
If most crime is committed by men, is that fact irrelevant to the issue of crime (i.e. in regards to prevention)?August 17, 2017 8:25 pm at 8:25 pm #1341433
If the motive for the crime is religious based, then the crime is connected to the religion; the religion calls for them to commit this crime. And if the motive for the crime is because of biological differences between man and woman, then obviously this is relevant to prevention.
A basic common denominator does not show causality. And if there is no reason to say that people of one ethnic minority should have more taivah, less control, more opportunity or more motive to commit the crime, then the observation means nothing.August 17, 2017 10:29 pm at 10:29 pm #1341494
“if there is no reason to say that people of one ethnic minority should have more taivah”
See Rambam Teshuva 8:6:
הלכות תשובה – פרק שמיני
ו שמא תקל בעיניך טובה זו ותדמה שאין שכר המצות והיות האדם שלם בדרכי האמת אלא להיותו אוכל ושותה מאכלות טובות ובועל צורות נאות ולובש בגדי שש ורקמה ושוכן באהלי שן ומשתמש בכלי כסף וזהב ודברים הדומים לאלו כמו שמדמין אלו הערביים הטפשים האוילים השטופים בזמה.August 18, 2017 6:58 am at 6:58 am #1341670
Gavriel613 – For that price, you could have quoted Kiddushin 49b.August 18, 2017 12:08 pm at 12:08 pm #1341810
yes but one must never underestimate the Rambam cloutAugust 18, 2017 6:31 pm at 6:31 pm #1342679
The Rambam can be interpreted as referring to their actual state at that time, not to an innate tendency.
(And I assume no one’s going to argue that they’re all tipshim.)August 18, 2017 6:34 pm at 6:34 pm #1342687
Similarly, an existing criminal behavior among people of a certain ethnicity is not a racist idea.
(Also my opinion about the hotel sign, by the way – yes, it shouldn’t have said “Jewish,” but
if the problem was in fact only with Jews, it doesn’t mean the sign-poster is an anti-Semite.)August 20, 2017 5:49 pm at 5:49 pm #1343158
I live in England, and personally have Pakistani friends that told me that the accusations against the Pakistani community is unfounded, and that it was made up by the rascist English Defense League to demonize the Pakstani community.August 20, 2017 5:49 pm at 5:49 pm #1343159JosephParticipant
Didn’t we learn the ingrained habits of each nationality when they rejected the Torah? Edom (descending from Eisev) murders; the nations from Yishmael steal, etcetera.August 20, 2017 6:37 pm at 6:37 pm #1343166
We’ve got our own.August 20, 2017 7:22 pm at 7:22 pm #1343181
Accusations from the English Defence League? Perhaps take a look at the news. Take a look at the mugshots of the convicted abusers, and see if you can come up with your own conclusion.August 20, 2017 7:22 pm at 7:22 pm #1343182
I was taught by my rebbe z’l, that a Jew has no right to judge another person’s belief system.August 20, 2017 8:18 pm at 8:18 pm #1343192
I was taught by my rebbe z’l, that a Jew has no right to judge another person’s belief system.
The Rambam seems to have disagreed – see the quote above.August 20, 2017 8:18 pm at 8:18 pm #1343193
(Also, what did that have to do with anything?)August 20, 2017 9:55 pm at 9:55 pm #1343190YisroelbtachbashemParticipant
There are two basic issues here:
(1) a huge amount of Muslims were allowed into continental Europe. According to reports, 75% were young males.
(2) Islam looks at a non Islamic woman as “permissible.” V’dai la’maivin. This is based on the original “perfect” man, Mohammed, who took advantage of 9 year old old Aisha, a Jewish girl whose father, etc. was beheaded.
As I’ve said before, even if an earlier generation will become part of the dominant culture, a later generation may become “super religious.”
In Jusaism, a ba’al Teshuva may become super-religious by following Moshe Rabbeinu’s Derech and sitting and learning all day. He may not have parnassah and may need to collect Tzedakah.
A born again Xtian may follow J’s Derech and turn the other cheek. He may end up in the hospital!
A jihadi who becomes super religious may follow Mohammed’s example and become a terrorist and ravage and savage any non-islamic person, etc.August 21, 2017 7:25 am at 7:25 am #1343274
Stop having hate in your heart for Pakistanis and start loving your fellow neighbor as yourself and that’s the whole Torah and the rest is commentary- Rabbi Hillel
Also all religions have bad apples, if you went back in time to medieval Christian Europe they were slaghtering Jews practically every single day and you’d for sure think that Christianity is a blood thirsty religion based on your eyewitness experience of the day.August 21, 2017 7:25 am at 7:25 am #1343275
@KnPanel: I was taught by my rebbe z’l, that a Jew has no right to judge another person’s belief system.
(a) If you mean “judge” in terms of blame, or holding accountable, you are correct. But as far as tolerance and acceptance is concerned, “live and let live” is by no means a Jewish policy.
(b) Supposedly, the correlation of Pakistani men involved in this crime is nothing to do with their belief system, but more of a cultural issue. Terrorism can be rooted to religion, and then you could [incorrectly] say that we have no right to judge their belief system. Abusing children has no source in religion [other than the fact that Muslim religious leaders from day one were pedophiles].August 21, 2017 7:33 am at 7:33 am #1343304on the ballParticipant
To Gavriel613 who quoted the Rambam in Hilchos Teshuva:
Pakistanis are not ArabsAugust 21, 2017 9:48 am at 9:48 am #1343431
Pakistanis are not a religion.August 21, 2017 11:03 am at 11:03 am #1343514
What if it was Yemenite Jews accused of abusing white British girls would your tone suddenly change or would you still be just as critical if not more so with the Yemenites accused as you are with the Pakistanis accused?August 21, 2017 12:06 pm at 12:06 pm #1343553
There is nothing wrong with being loyal to one’s own people.
If a stranger was accused of stealing people’s cats and barbecuing them alive, how would you react? Would you react differently if the person accused was your mother?August 21, 2017 9:03 pm at 9:03 pm #1343684NeutiquamErroParticipant
It’s not chiefly an issue of race, it’s an issue of culture. Men from certain cultures, in particular particular south Asian communities, feel that young white females are inferior, and as such they can treat them awfully despite what scruples they may feel as human beings. It isn’t really a matter for debate. That’s not to say don’t debate it, it’s just there’s pretty conclusive evidence. It’s a clear pattern across different towns and cities in the UK, that organised groups of men from particular cultures carry out a pattern of abuse against vulnerable white girls. The reluctance to accept that the culture these men originate from plays a part led to a failure to track down and prosecute these gangs.August 22, 2017 1:04 pm at 1:04 pm #1344462
What your saying against all South Asians is out and out bigotry against an entire group of people and is entirely unjust and baseless. It would be like if I said all white people everywhere are affiliated with the Ku Klux Klan and are also affiliated Skinheads and neo-Nazis and White Supremacists period.August 22, 2017 4:48 pm at 4:48 pm #1345343
Whites are not a nationality.August 23, 2017 10:25 am at 10:25 am #1345616
It has been proven by a British nationally survey company that South Asians are me highly educated then their native white British conterpart also it has been proven by a British nationally survey company that South Asians have better on average paying jobs (i.e. doctor, lawyer, etc) and in general make more money compared to their native white British counterpart.August 23, 2017 1:15 pm at 1:15 pm #1345725
That is not helpful.August 23, 2017 2:12 pm at 2:12 pm #1346070
“It has been proven by a British nationally survey company that South Asians are me highly educated then their native white British conterpart ”
Those surveys include Chinese and Indian who are very educated. BUT Pakis are less educated than whites.August 23, 2017 3:56 pm at 3:56 pm #1346408yehudayonaParticipant
If abuse of young white women by Pakistani men is a cultural thing, then why haven’t I heard of incidents like this in Brooklyn, which has a large Pakistani community? It seems that in the U.S., in violence involving South Asians and whites, the whites are almost always the perpetrators.
MDG, Chinese are not South Asians. And abuse (even to the point of murder) of young Indian women by Indian men in India is a significant problem. I don’t know whether the perpetrators are highly educated.August 23, 2017 6:17 pm at 6:17 pm #1346511
I got my info from. The Telegraph and The Guardian. They seemed to limp them together. Maybe It’s a Brit thing. Maybe I misunderstood. In any event, the pakis are less educated.August 23, 2017 7:19 pm at 7:19 pm #1346554
The Indian men who hurt Indian women hurt Indian women more than other women because Indian women are in India.August 23, 2017 7:49 pm at 7:49 pm #1346576
And Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo.August 24, 2017 12:18 pm at 12:18 pm #1346824
My boss is a Pakstani and he is the nicest person you will ever meet. The problem in the UK stems from the far right UKIP leader Nigel Farage who loves bashing all immigrants in the UK but especially Pakistanis in particular then you have Tommy Robinson of The English Defense League who also hates Pakistanis too then you have any Anne Marie Waters, Tom Holland, and Katie Hopkins who have a deep seated hatred of all immigrants but especially of Pakistanis in particular as well period.August 24, 2017 12:29 pm at 12:29 pm #1346840
So your token Pakistani boss means cultural differences don’t exist?August 24, 2017 3:37 pm at 3:37 pm #1346886HealthParticipant
YY -“If abuse of young white women by Pakistani men is a cultural thing, then why haven’t I heard of incidents like this in Brooklyn, which has a large Pakistani community”
it’s a Muslim thing! That’s why ISIS does what it does, to women & children that aren’t Sunnis!
In the US, it would be a crime, that would be prosecuted.August 24, 2017 5:06 pm at 5:06 pm #1346911
Britain also has laws.August 27, 2017 11:13 pm at 11:13 pm #1348085
My Pakistani friend and the Pakistani community in Britian donates more money to charity overall then the whole entire native white British population does as a whole period.August 28, 2017 12:47 pm at 12:47 pm #1348538yehudayonaParticipant
KnPanel, I find that hard to believe. Pakistanis are less than 2% of the population of the UK. While Muslims are required to give charity (2.5% of assets annually according to one web page I found), the relatively small number of Pakistanis in the UK makes the veracity of your claim suspect. I found an estimate of the total charitable giving of the British to be close to 10 billion pounds. If every Pakistani man, woman, and child gave 1,000 pounds, that would only be slightly over 1 billion pounds. Also, I suspect that Muslims donate almost entirely to Muslim causes (just as frum Jews donate almost entirely to Jewish causes), so the impact of their giving on non-Muslims is minimal.August 28, 2017 1:01 pm at 1:01 pm #1348555
Did KnPanel deny the original claim? Because otherwise it seems like he’s suggesting that it’s okay to assault people if you earn a high income and give a lot to charity.August 28, 2017 4:18 pm at 4:18 pm #1349186
The Pakistani community in Britian has established more soup kitchens to feed the poor and the needy in Britain then all the white native British population and all the other whites in all of Britain combined.August 28, 2017 4:38 pm at 4:38 pm #1349194
You’re still doing it. You’re sounding really misogynistic right now.August 28, 2017 8:50 pm at 8:50 pm #1349720
The Pakistani community is the most accepting and open and embracing community in all of Britian period.August 28, 2017 9:06 pm at 9:06 pm #1349722
The Pakistani community is the most open and tolerant and embracing and welcoming in all of Britian.August 28, 2017 9:21 pm at 9:21 pm #1349733
If you were defending someone in an assault trial, would you rely on evidence that shows that the defendant is highly educated, earns a high income, gives a lot to charity, and established a larger than average number of soup kitchens, or would you actually address the accusation?August 29, 2017 1:22 pm at 1:22 pm #1350215
My Pakistani friend and his family and the whole entire Pakistani as a whole is more patriotic of being British then the whole entire white native British population is and the whole entire Pakistani community is more patriotic of being British then the whole entire foreign white population in Britian is period.August 29, 2017 1:22 pm at 1:22 pm #1350216
“What your saying against all South Asians is out and out bigotry against an entire group of people and is entirely unjust and baseless.”
Actually, their behavior is based on their belief system, Islam.
They are being judged based on their actions and belief system that justifies the rape of nonmoslem females.
Yes they can be nice, but can you really trust them?
Their religion tells them to lie and backstab.
Taqiyya – lying to non-believers to advance the cause of Islam – in some cases by gaining the trust of non-believers in order to draw out their vulnerability and defeat them. Quran (3:28) is one source for that treachery.August 29, 2017 1:58 pm at 1:58 pm #1350262
You just got your bigoted information from a xenophobic website run by probably David Wood or Robert Spencer or Pamela Geller, etc, who’s whole aim is to hate on and smear an entire community based on ungrounded and libelous charges period.August 29, 2017 2:23 pm at 2:23 pm #1350395
KnPanel, Pakistan and its neighboring countries have a problem in this area. Women in those countries are harmed by men all the time. Why expect those men to change their behavior when they leave to a different country?August 29, 2017 2:24 pm at 2:24 pm #1350362
Believing that it British Pakistani men are more likely to commit certain crimes is not the same as hating South Asians.
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