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The President’s just announced a ban on ANY travel to and from Europe until mid-April. That will obviously affect many who planned to travel to the U.S. from Europe to spend Yom Tov here in the U.S. along with any with flight plans transiting European airports. Likewise, many state and local governments have imposed various bans on public gatherings. Wouldn’t it be wise NOW to cancel the many Pesach programs at hotels where Yidden from all over the country are pushed together for a week to 10 days with a substantially enhanced risk of exposure/spread of the virus. Now that we know that someone may think they are 100% healthy and not have any obvious links to areas of exposure can still carry the virus, it would seem beyond stupid to allow these programs to go forward. Making Pesach at home will be a much lesser burden than C’V having to deal with illness of family, especially elderly, that could have been avoided.
As with any other business it should be up to the “owners” of these programs to make the decision based upon the directives of the local board of health. If individual families want to cancel out of their reservation they have the right but will probably have some portion of their deposit be forfeited as per their contract,
Gadolhadorah you are so right that all Pesach hotels should cancel their programs. However, many programs will not cancel because they don’t want to lose all that money. Instead they are now advertising that they will disinfect all the rooms kitchens, and common areas where lots of people gather, give out hand sanitizers to all guest, put out hand sanitizers throughout the hotel.
Some people literally don’t know how to make Pesach themselves.
I personally would not go to a hotel right now. The challenge is that this is literally people’s parnassah. It’s very difficult to go bankrupt for a safety measure. There is no easy answer to this one.
Actually the ban is for foreign nationals coming to the U.S. Citizens can come to the U.S., and I believe anyone can leave. Of course, this will cause havoc in flight schedules.
@Yehudayona.
NOT Foreign Nationals………………………………
US residents, not just citizens can come to the US from the EU under the ban.To add to joe
I know someone who goes away every year for the past 5-10 years and since he can’t go away it’s causing Shalom bayis problems because he’s not used to it
The Pesach Program at the CTL will go on as scheduled (I”H), BUT we are enforcing a 75 person limit. SO>>>none of the pregnant family members should give birth until after Pesach.
We will hold all davening here and not walk to shul, as it would make the Yuntif services at shul exceed the 100 person suggested limit (soon to be mandatory) on public gatherings,
Canceling flights from Europe has nothing to do with American Pesach programs. Europe is way worse the US right now. Everyone needs to relax.
Some people cannot make Pesach themselves, due to various limitations, and going to hotels is their only option. This covers many elderly couples. Easy for all the commenters here to blame those in the hotel business. These generalizations are offensive and ignorant. The midoh of rushing to blame is childish, and suggests stupidity. Calm down. Everyone needs to make educated decisions that are best for them. I happen to dislike the very thought of going away for Pesach. But that may be what is best for me. Maybe not for someone else.
GH – You cannot call making Pesach an inconvenience. For some young families who have previously gone to parents it is not about kvetching that they have work to do this year. It will cost THOUSANDS of dollars to make Pesach. Especially if you don’t have a kosher eruv available and will be home for many meals. Even if you are willing to use fancy disposable instead of purchasing brand new sets of dishes the “stuff” is as huge an expense as the food.
GH: Once again, it is up to the indivdual to cancel his/her plans. You may think it is ” mamash crazy”, but unless the local Board of Health advises the hotel and or the pesach program to shut down, they have every right to continue their business operations. As I said to others this morning this becomes an “ein ldavar sof”. Are you going to shut down the MTA in NYC? all the supermarkets? You want to place yourself in a hazmat suit before walking out your front door? When the local Board of Health as we see in Bergen County NJ that issues a call for things like this, I agree. But to just start issuing your own edicts or suggestions may not be proper under the circumstances.
Your habit of battuling things by using extremes is both dishonest and sometimes dangerous.
I wasn’t talking about hotel programs. I said that it costs thousands to make pesach if you do not have any pesach items in your house. Your fantasy of take out food and disposables does not exist everywhere, and you don’t get to eat matza with jelly on a 9 cent paper plate for a yom tov meal.
Perhaps you haven’t made pesach, haven’t foot the bill for pesach, or just don’t consider the chashivus of being mikabed the yamim tovim. I have no idea what your story is. But making pesach for a young tho not small family is minimally $2000.GH:
You continue with irresponsible generalizations. Not all hotels cramp elderly into a confined area. In fact, there are many who have areas for families to be together, but secluded from others. The implication of you last comment is that “people have their freedom to choose, but are stupid for going to hotels”. That attitude does not speak highly of either intellect, knowledge of the subject matter of hotels on Pesach, the subject of the pandemic. You seem intent on pushing your agenda on others, and that anyone who exercises their right to disagree is wrong.
I don’t like hotels any more than you, and maybe even less. But my preferences relate to me, not to you, not to others.
Beware, health depts may have to shut hotel programs een on eerev pesach or on yom. Tov itself, how can one take a chance?
It may bbbe hard to make pesach at home, what are the options?
Noach and family lived with all of the animals for a year enclosed, what was the alternative?GH: Pesach at home, if one has never made pesach before will cost thousands to set up. Pots, pans, sets of flatware, dishes, etc cost money. Also, they dont a have a list from last year to see what they used to figure out what to buy this year. While my wife looks at her list that she used 8 bags of sugar and 7 cans of potato starch, 22 dozen eggs and 24 lbs of matza, those staying home for the first time has to guess what they will need.
I have often helped my wife make Pesach in a rented apartment in Miami. This involved no cooking and purchasing all food items ready cooked. The total food and food related expense was under $2,000 per small family. This is substantially lower than anybody would guess and much loser than Hotel Programs.
ShloimieB: Please define “small family” including ages of children. I know a small family of 5 but 3 of them are male teenagers.
ShloimeB – that’s impressive. But what about the rental fee and the flights?
In my case small family was defined as Mother, Father and two children aged between 5 and 12. eating children sized portions of adult food.
To Syag…The calculation of costs was for food and disposables only. The purposes of this post was to discuss direct costs and not to include airfare or rental costs.
special note to LOwer our tuition, The food you listed was likely used for cakes. even if miscalculated and doubled it does not add up to a lot and that is for lots of cakes. I purchased cakes which are likely really bad for your health but more filling than homemade. I have to admit that the options for purchased Pesach food in Miami are possibly more available and lower cost than in NYC.Making Pesach at home for the first time for a family of 4 or 5 can easily cost a minimum of $1000. This includes, round shmura matza, some pots, cooking utensils such as mixing bowls, spoons, heaters, peelers, food processor etc. Pesach food is very expensive as well, especially take out food. Then you need paper goods as well. Additionally most people will spend quite a bit of money on cleaning help. This is why it’s very hard for people if they have to cancel their hotel program and start making Pesach now, since they have to start from scratch.
ShloimieB – I hear that, so you were agreeing with my claim? Pesach can’t be made for less then $2000 if everything is included. And if you Don’t include everything, then it doesn’t make much sense. I don’t even think there are take out options here. So unless I fly somewhere else and pay rent, I have to go according to local prices.
A few participants are making the point that making pesach at home will involve the one time cost of buying new pots, pans etc. Unless someone was planning to go to a hotel as a single person I highly doubt that the total expenses would be more than the cost of a hotel. If its a large family it is nearly impossible (unless you cook in solid gold pots and plan to install a special new top of the line pesach kitchen in your home).
Even so, would it be such a bad thing if this would be the impetus to get a few more people to stay home for pesach? I think anyone over age 40 or so can attest that this mishgas of we NEED to go away for pesach is a relatively new phenomenon and perhaps it is time for everyone to rethink priorities? Just bec. it became the thing to do doesn’t mean we can start to use our brains and question if it is the wisest thing to do
Some brought up the point of elderly folks who have no where else to go. I understand that there are some elderly Jews who really do not have family that they can go to. But if more of the 30-60 year olds would stay home and make their own pesach maybe we could have more opportunities to bring back the way things should be and have Bubby and Zaidy at the seder. My gut tells me that no matter how learned Grandfather is, it is much more important to have him tell over sipur yitzias mitzrayim at a seder than to have a 24 hour tea room and chol hamoed with a concert, moonbounce and fire juggler.
@ Syag
No, I am not agreeing with you.
We are not comparing to a Hotel we are discussing costs to be at home. Airfare and rental do not enter that equation.
I will concede that South Florida has always had more options for prepared food and therefor more competitive pricing. Add an extra $200-500 and that will cover anyplace in the USA.shloimeb: Cakes, gefiltevfish, hard boiled eggs, matza brei, chicken breaded with mixture ofpotato starch and other ingredients, various kugels, pesach chulent, baked potats,cole slaw, salad dressings, just to name a few things off the top of my head.
ShloimieB- so are you saying you live in a rented apartment in south florida? Because if not, im not really sure how you can make a cheshbon for food in a tourist location and compare it to food everywhere else.
TLIK brings up the situation of older people who go to hotels because it’s difficult for them to make Pesach at home. They’re precisely the demographic who’s most at risk from this virus.
GH, I get it. You don’t like hotel programs and you’re seizing on the virus as a reason to persuade people to stay home.
Why does it bother you so much if people still plan on going?
They are adults capable of coming to their own decisions without your input. So I respectfully suggest that you
MYOBWe have never spent thousands on Pesach at home. And we eat well.
That US citizens and residents can return from Europe defeats the purpose of a travel ban. Viruses do not care about your nationality.
GH, but nobody asked for you to play nanny. As i stated before, the only opinions that counted were those of the rabbonim, physicians and health officials, not yours. Believe it or not, adults can , and did, make their own cheshbonim and didn’t need your repeated opinion.
GH: While that may have been your intent, I certainly didn’t read it that way.
@Charlie Hall
We have spent thousands on Pesach at home, but have hosted the entire extended family including in-laws at the CTL Compound.
This year we now have to abide by the 50 person limit on gatherings and social distancing and possibly travel restrictions and an 8 PM curfew.
So CHL Pesach will be limited to those who live in the compound, are within walking distance (a couple of siblings) and those who can stay here. Already we have 8 grandchildren moved in since schools/colleges have closed so they can be taught as a small group.
Shopping may be the hardest part of making Pesach. But we have a separate Pesach kitchen and the freezers are full of meat and poultry and the pantry stocked with sealed canned, boxed and jarred food, It is fresh dairy and perishables that may be an issue, We don’t buy any prepared foods (ready to eat cooked food),I remember my great grandfather talking about Pesach: On the first day we had potatoes and eggs, on the second day we had eggs and potatoes.
NYC expects us to leave home to move cars, while they close our kids schools, and ask us to work from home. Alternate Side Parking needs to be suspended for the next few weeks. #COVID19 Link removed
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