Celebrate Thanksgiving?

The Agudah used to have their convention this weekend and they used to serve Turkey

As a side note I have never heard anyone until now claim thanksgiving was a Greco-Roman holiday. and it has nothing to do with the Catholics

The first thanksgiving involved Pilgrims who were far from Catholic and the Native Americans

Avram

I dont know about the Fried Onions, but I heard they served Pumpkin Pie for Dessert

“Also I’m not here to write a book about Thanksgiving origins I just wrote briefly so.”

Yes obviously

” no I did not mean lincoln. ”
Thats a pity, since if you meant Lincoln at least there would be one sort of correct statement in your post.

It was Lincoln, not Kennedy who in 1863 not 1963 established a national holiday of thanksgiving. (The date was later changed by FDR) Neither Lincoln nor Kennedy “instituted it” after it was “forgotten” Many states had celebrated it for decades before Lincoln proclaimed it a national holiday. New York did so in 1817.
You’re facts are simply wrong, it is very hard to research facts that you made up.

Rav Miller zt’l

Q:
What would the Rav say that our attitude should be towards the holiday of Thanksgiving?

A:
Our attitude is the same as it is towards any other gentile religious festival. Because that’s what Thanksgiving is. Even though Thanksgiving is accepted by the government authorities as a legal holiday, nevertheless, it is a religious holiday. If you would bother to look into the encyclopedias, where the kosher gentiles are speaking, you would become aware of this. In the encyclopedias the kosher gentiles are speaking and you can accept their testimony. The gentiles themselves say that Thanksgiving is a religious holiday. And therefore it is אסור, it’s forbidden, for a Jew to do anything that would distinguish this day from any other day.

And to eat turkey, in my humble opinion, would be אביזרייהו דעבודה זרה, an ancillary transgression of actual idol worship, and is included in the דין of יהרג ואל יעבור. And that would mean that you must be willing to give up your life before celebrating Thanksgiving with a turkey dinner. A person should do anything rather than participate in celebrating Thanksgiving because it’s like celebrating any other gentile religious day.

TAPE #38 (November 1973)

It’s amazing to what lengths people will go to avoid Thanksgiving. It is and has never been a religious holiday. In fact , the first official Thanksgiving had Jewish origins. President Washington wanted Congress to declare a national day of thanksgiving to thank G-d for the new U.S. Constitution. Southern Congressmen objected as they said such declarations were the actions of kings. They had just rebelled against a king and did not want Washington acting like one.
Roger Sherman , a Congressman from Connecticut arose and gave a different reason in support of the declaration. He said they were emulating King Solomon, not European kings . Just as Solomon thanked G-d for allowing him to build the Temple, they were thanking G-d for the Constitution. The southerners accepted his reasoning and voted for it.

Litvisherchossid
Wait, why is that opening “against” him?

I assume you have some encyclopedia that has an alternate history of Thanksgiving, And Rabbi Miller must have had the same encyclopedia.

Unless of course you have no such encyclopedia….

Slonimer, im not sure if it was addressed to me.

“If he used Encyclopedia Brittanica”
who is he?

“he correctly related what it says”
Unless the “he” is me you are mistaken.

I do not have a print copy.
The online version states
“…The New England colonists were accustomed to regularly celebrating “Thanksgivings,” days of prayer thanking God for blessings such as military victory or the end of a drought. The U.S. Continental Congress proclaimed a national Thanksgiving upon the enactment of the Constitution, for example. …Thanksgiving Day did not become an official holiday until Northerners dominated the federal government. …won the support of President Abraham Lincoln. On October 3, 1863, during the Civil War, Lincoln proclaimed a national day of thanksgiving to be celebrated on Thursday, November 26. The holiday was annually proclaimed by every president thereafter, and the date chosen, with few exceptions, was the last Thursday in November. President Franklin D. Roosevelt, however, attempted to extend the Christmas shopping season, which generally begins with the Thanksgiving holiday, and to boost the economy by moving the date back a week, to the third week in November. But not all states complied, and, after a joint resolution of Congress in 1941, Roosevelt issued a proclamation in 1942 designating the fourth Thursday in November (which is not always the last Thursday) as Thanksgiving Day.”
(shortened for brevity)

“Do you dispute the EB?”

Me? No it says exactly what I said.

ubiquitous – Apologies for my lack of clarity. Rabbi Miller’s reference to the encyclopedia on this topic correctly coincides with Brittanica’s description of Thanksgiving (in a 20 year old edition of EB that I saw – though I’m sure nothing changed in the last few years.) The free online edition of EB, I believe, is abridged. The full version may be available by subscription.

CTLawyer – Despite it’s name, Brittanica is a fully American owned, headquarted and published encyclopedia. Its first edition 150+ years ago was in Britain, hence its name, but its been all American for well over 100 years. And by well earned reputation it is considered the most authoritative American encyclopedia.

If you disagree you can edit Wikipedia to say whatever you want it to say. 😉

I belive Rav Moshe Permitted the celebrating of Thanksgiving and he THE Posek

Litvish, where in the Torah does it talk about Medicaid, Section 8 , food stamps , aid to yeshivas etc? When it comes to them, we jump up and down screaming ” give me give me , I’m an American!!”. However when it comes to Thanksgiving and the 4th of July, I’m Jewish and they are the ways of the Americans

Generally Rav Moshe attempted to issue a lenient ruling where so doing would prevent Yidden from transgressing. But that doesn’t mean the Rav holds leniency to be the best course as a rule…

There is no denying that Christians instituted the holiday of Thanksgiving to give thanks to their god (who they believe “choose” them in a new covenant and “unchoose” us yidden by the way). Regardless of which bird they ate, which King from the Tanach they based their celebrations on, who was or wasn’t invited to the first Thanksgiving feast and which President declared it a national holiday -the fact remains that Thanksgiving is a Gentile holiday made to honor a non-Jewish ‘god.’

Many Gentiles celebrate X-mas as a purely secular holiday; for them, X-mas has zero religious significance. Obviously X-mas is a holiday with Christian origins made to honor a non-Jewish ‘god.’ No frum Yid would say X-mas is lahavdil kosher because “For me it’s a secular national holiday without any religious meaning.”

Halloween is a purely pagan holiday. In fact some branches of Christianity are against celebrating Halloween. Yet it’s obviously not proper (and according to the most Rabbonim forbidden) to celebrate Halloween.

As Yidden our Mesorah is and always has been to refrain from partaking in Gentile holiday celebrations. There are a few reasons for that. One is that doing so blurs the lines of separation between Yidden and Gentiles. Another is because Hashem our G-d and the G-d of the universe gave us Yidden all the days for celebration He saw fit to give, and these are all the Yomim Tovim/Chagim we need. We should not appear to take on the holidays of the Gentiles, as if our own mesorah Chas V’shalom lacks something.

slonimer: and that is why many people do not use Wikipedia as a valid source reference. It can be edited by anybody…..even if he or she does not not know anything about the subject.

@slominer
I don’t care who owns EB at this time. It is not the authority on most anything.
Encyclopedias have outlived their usefulness with the advent of the internet

@Joseph
I did NOT use the word reliable. I talked about outliving usefulness. Most articles in encyclopedias are years old. New research, discoveries and theories are brought out every day on the internet.

Lol. What new information about the origins of Thanksgiving have been discovered since the “advent of the internet”?

I celebrate Thanksgiving, but not in the way you think.

We don’t have a feast or turkey or anything on Thursday night (I don’t like turkey anyway). However, since I have off from work that day and the next and I enjoy cooking, I spend two days cooking and making big meals for family and guests to come for the seudos of Shabbos.

So, if you view Thanksgiving positively, you could say that I’m putting the day off to good use. If you view Thanksgiving negatively, you can say that I’m polluting my Shabbos Kodesh with it. I’ll let you decide which one is appropriate.

The Wolf

Thanksgiving was the last chance for a family gathering before January 1.

I have no problems with people who celebrate Thanksgiving. The fact that we don’t do anything special “bo bayom” should not be construed as an objection to other people celebrating.

The Wolf

litvisher
you say religion or not.
You ave already demonstrated that you dont know much about thanksiving, you are comin g dan gerously close to showin g tat you dont know muc about halacha either.
See Rema in YD hilchos chukas akum, religion or not. is what determines if it is assur or not