Chometz Vs. Radiation

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  • #596460

    OK, which are you honestly more scared of?

    Chometz on Pesach, or radiation from a nuclear bomb?

    Which would you worry about more?

    #763212
    BasYisroel94
    Participant

    Uhh… Both are scary. Truthfully, I ate something on Pesach and only after looked at the hechsher- to see that I couldnt find ‘kosher l’Pesach’ anywhere! I was so worried, I can assure you I felt like I was about to faint. Luckily I turned over the package and saw that on the other side it said kosher l’Pesach. ATM, where is there radiation from a nuclear bomb?

    #763214

    BasYisrael94 – In Fukushima, one of the newspapers (Hamodia??) had an article about the Chabad Shliach to Tokyo, and I was wondering if I was in Tokyo, which would honestly be more worrying?

    #763215

    Wolf: but if exposed to radiation, one does not die immediately, while chometz immediately destroys a person’s neshama (kares)

    #763216

    “Chometz is only deadly when eaten b’mayzid. Radiation will kill you regardless.”

    Radiation does not kill regardless.

    In any event, spiritual destruction is worse than physical destruction.

    #763217
    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    Wolf: but if exposed to radiation, one does not die immediately, while chometz immediately destroys a person’s neshama (kares)

    A. Enough radiation can kill in a very short time.

    B. As I said above, chametz will only kill you if you eat it on purpose. If you eat it accidentally, you will NOT get kares. Radiation, on the other hand, won’t care what your intention was.

    C. You can do teshuva regarding kares. Radiation won’t care if you teshuva for being exposed.

    The Wolf

    #763218
    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    Radiation does not kill regardless.

    I invite you to tell that to Harry Daghilan and Louis Slotin, among others.

    The Wolf

    #763219

    There are lots of people still living in Chernobyl who haven’t suffered cancer. Just noting for all those who are sure that radiation kills no matter what. Some are quite old and refuse to move out because they do not believe in radiation, as they cannot see it.

    #763220

    Wolfish: You are ignoring the dosage.

    #763221

    The Wolf: Those were exceptional cases.

    #763222
    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    Those were exceptional cases.

    And the detonation of a nuclear bomb (which is the case you made in the OP) is not an exceptional case?????

    The Wolf

    #763223

    Wolfish: It is, but i guess I didn’t make it clear.

    I was thinking about radiation in the same amount as Chometz – ie not the initial blast (equivalent to finding a loaf of bread in the fridge on Pesach), but let’s say finding crumbs in a corner or something.

    A level 7 Chometz Accident would be a equivalent to a Major Accident, IE having crumbs in the air conditioner that goes off in a Pesach Hotel, while a level 1 would be thinking that there might have been kitniyos in the medicine you just took.

    #763224
    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    I was thinking about radiation in the same amount as Chometz

    Granted. I would be just as scared of 50 megatons of chometz as I would be of 50 megatons of radioactive material.

    The Wolf

    #763225

    A very small dosage of radiation is not only not fatal, it is not even considered unhealthy.

    #763226
    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    Fine, I’ll come out and say what you’re waiting for me to say anyway:

    Yes, if a nuclear bomb went off in New York City, I’d be running in the other direction as fast as I could. And if I found chometz in my house, I wouldn’t be running anywhere.

    Is that what you wanted to hear? Yes, I’d be more scared of the radiation… and if you think that’s shows a lack of sensitivity to what’s important in Yiddishkeit, then so be it… but I’d be willing to bet dollars to (pesachdik) donuts that 99.99% of people would react the exact same way.

    The Wolf

    #763227

    “but I’d be willing to bet dollars to (pesachdik) donuts that 99.99% of people would react the exact same way.”

    And does that make it right?

    #763228
    wanderingchana
    Participant

    It does no good to freak out if you find chometz, if you believed your declaration of it as dust of the earth before Pesach. Once we found some in a plastic bag (#10, which we knew was lurking somewhere), and our rav told us to carefully flush it, and throw the plastic bag out outside. Not our chometz…

    OTOH, I’m 50.1 miles from a nuclear power plant, and if something goes wrong, I’m grabbing the kids out of school and meeting my husband somewhere in the midwest.

    #763229
    WolfishMusings
    Participant

    And does that make it right?

    Fine so tell me… if *you* saw chometz on Chol HaMoed, would *you* get into your car and put as many miles as possible between you and it as quickly as possible?

    Yeah, I didn’t think so.

    The Wolf

    #763230

    Wolfish: Same here! Re-reading this thread, it does look like trying to get people to say something, but honestly I would do the same. Like wanderingchana mentioned, we did sell all the chometz and there’s no need to react to a missed La-Hit wrapper like a small atom bomb went off in the kitchen!*

    edit: story is from when my home had many young children and has not happened for over 10 years… don’t judge our cleaning ability.

    #763231
    ☕ DaasYochid ☕
    Participant

    Fine so tell me… if *you* saw chometz on Chol HaMoed, would *you* get into your car and put as many miles as possible between you and it as quickly as possible?

    Yeah, I didn’t think so.

    The Wolf

    Wolf, although I agree with your overall approach here (as I understand it, that if we’re honest with ourselves we’ll realize that we are more afraid of physical than spiritual danger), I’ll take slight issue with your analogy. There is no benefit to running away from chametz although there is benefit to distancing oneself from radiation.

    #763232
    zahavasdad
    Participant

    One can do Teshuva for Chometz

    There is no teshuva for Radiation

    #763233
    RSRH
    Member

    I’m probably debasing myself by even commenting on this semi-ridiculous scenario, but . . .

    Find a piece of chometz on pesach: Cover with a napkin, pick it up, flush it down the toilet, clean more carefully next year.

    I’m not sure what running out of your house would accomplish; you would still have chometz in your reshus (though not yours, obviously, since you hopefully were mevatel it prior to yom tov).

    Now radiation, I don’t think flushing it is the best option. Considering HOW it is damaging, a safe distance is probably your best bet.

    C’mon people, making yourselves crazy about errors in cleaning judgement that you cannot correct until next year is not what simchas yom tov is all about. If anything, the best tribute to your commitment to Torah would be to deal with the unwanted stray noodle the way the halacha instruct you to, and not go crazy because in your own mind you have just committed every yeharog v’al vaavor in the book and then some. Allowing your personal feelings about the terribleness of the chometz to override the Torah’s instruction about how to deal with it is not much better than chomping down on a bagel because you REALLY wanted it.

    #763234
    charliehall
    Participant

    “Radiation does not kill regardless.”

    This is a false statement. Many died as a result of radiation from both the atomic bombings in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and from the Chernobyl disaster.

    #763235

    Charlie: Small dosages of radiation does not necessarily kill. That was the only point of the quoted statement.

    #763236
    HaLeiVi
    Participant

    If you find a stray nuetron waiting to make a nucleous unstable, cover it with a Keli until Chol Hamoed, when you will burn it, releasing it to the atmosphere. On the other hand, if you hear of Chometz having excaped through some chimney, put on you haz-mat suit and find shelter, and don’t go outside until the Rabbonim announce, on Kol Mevaser that it is safe to venture outside, for ten minutes a day.

    #763237
    mosherose
    Member

    I would definitely be more scared of chametz on pesach. How can anyone NOT be afraid of chametz on pesach. Hashem will save me from radition, but not from teh aveira of having chametz on pesach. Anyone who sez differntly is showing his true values.

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