March 29, 2018 12:52 am at 12:52 am #1501124
I’ve tried to figure this out, but the references I’ve checked don’t provide a clear answer.
I have a non-adjustable hotplate (TechYid Shabbos Safe Hotplate).
It’s supposedly ok to place cold, fully cooked food on the hotplate on Shabbos for reheating.
But heating liquids is apparently considered to be “cooking” them.
1. Can I place a kettle of cold water on the hotplate during Shabbos?
2. Can I place a kettle of cold water on the hotplate five minutes before the onset of Shabbos?March 29, 2018 7:59 am at 7:59 am #1501147MRS PLONYParticipant
Can’t you ask a Rov?March 29, 2018 8:03 am at 8:03 am #1501158
1. Can I place a kettle of cold water on the hotplate during Shabbos? NO it it reaches a temperature of 110 degrees F (or 43 degrees C yad sokedes bo) according to R’ Moshe. That is considered cooking. Others are even more stringent and consider a lower temperature as “Yad soledes bo.
2. Can I place a kettle of cold water on the hotplate five minutes before the onset of Shabbos? This is an “it depends”. Five minutes before candle lighting means that it will warm up for 23 minutes before sundown (shkia). If it reaches 110 degrees F during that time it may be ok. However, you would not be allowed to pour off any water during these 23 minutes. Better to put it on with enough time to reach 110 degrees (or higher) before candle lighting. Or boil it on the stove before this time and put it on the hotplate 5 minutes before candle lighting so it will remain hot.March 29, 2018 8:05 am at 8:05 am #1501162ubiquitinParticipant
2. No (See Ig”M OC 4:74 #23 where he discusses a hot water urn which like your hot plate doesnt have any adjustable knobs, nonetheless the water has to be “hot” prior to Shabbos He defines “hot” earlier in that teshuva as 160 degrees It wont get to 160 degrees on a hotplate in the 5 minutes before shabbos )March 29, 2018 10:41 am at 10:41 am #1501229
See Shulchan Aruch O”CH 318:14 and 254:9 MB sk 51March 29, 2018 11:01 am at 11:01 am #1501265
You might need some siman for a היכר not to change the setting.March 29, 2018 12:13 pm at 12:13 pm #1501307MenoParticipant
I’m confused. Why are you allowed to put cold food on it?March 29, 2018 12:13 pm at 12:13 pm #1501314
Thanks for the replies. That was my guess, but I wanted to confirm it.March 29, 2018 12:26 pm at 12:26 pm #1501321
laskern: I looked up Rabbi Ribiat’s sefer after posting this morning and found what you wrote in Rabbi Ribiat’s sefer (Vol 2 Page 558). He writes: “Although heating liquid to 110 degrees Fahrenheit (43.3 degrees Celsius) is Bishul this does not mean the bishul process was completed in the liquid. Heating the liquid further may still constitute the Melocho of Bishul. To be permitted to heat (or reheat) a liquid, it must have reached a minimum temperature of 160 degrees F / 71.1 degrees C while in a kli rishon.” I know that a poseik in my neighborhood does allow one to heat water on the blech late on erev shabbos as long as it reaches 160 by shkia.March 29, 2018 1:22 pm at 1:22 pm #1501338
I’m confused. Why are you allowed to put cold food on it?
אין בישול אחר בישול בדבר יבשMarch 29, 2018 1:24 pm at 1:24 pm #1501339
The second issue would be מיחזי כמבשל, but some poskim are meikil when there’s no way of adjusting the heat level.March 29, 2018 1:26 pm at 1:26 pm #1501345
(which would presumably also take care of שמא יחתה בגחלים).March 29, 2018 1:33 pm at 1:33 pm #1501351
Not all poskim agree to allow it, though.March 29, 2018 1:33 pm at 1:33 pm #1501352
DY, What about unplugging?March 29, 2018 1:38 pm at 1:38 pm #1501356
Unplugging what?March 29, 2018 2:01 pm at 2:01 pm #1501372
The hotplate.March 29, 2018 2:19 pm at 2:19 pm #1501385
I thought of a couple of related questions.
3. A kettle of hot water is placed on the same, non-adjustable hotplate prior to Shabbos. Early Shabbos morning, the electrical power goes off, and stays off for several hours, causing the water to cool to room temperature. The electrical power comes back on Shabbos afternoon, and reheats the water. Can the reheated hot water be used during Shabbos?
4. If a container includes both cold dry food and cold liquid (fully cooked prior to Shabbos), is it subject to the restriction against reheating liquids? Does it depend on the relative percentage of dry food vs. liquid?March 29, 2018 3:02 pm at 3:02 pm #1501395
DovidBT, I think 3) since you didn’t contribute to the extinguishing of the fire, it is ok and you can eat it on Shabbos.
4) Shulchan Aruch 318:4 says if soup is in it , there is cooking after cooking.March 29, 2018 3:03 pm at 3:03 pm #1501398ubiquitinParticipant
Are chazal concerned with “shema yechabeh” or is tat your own concern?March 29, 2018 3:50 pm at 3:50 pm #1501402yitzchokmParticipant
3, same answer as above. The water can’t be used if it was recooked on Shabbos.
4, only something that’s completely dry can be reheated on Shabbos. Once liquid is involved, you can’t reheat it on Shabbos.
The concept that “it’s impossible to cook something that’s already cooked” (which allows for reheating completely dry cooked Foods) only applies to something that’s completely dry.
As always, confirm with a LORMarch 29, 2018 3:50 pm at 3:50 pm #1501404
ubi, The hot plate is dangerous leaving it on. It needs to be put on a shabbos clock.March 29, 2018 3:51 pm at 3:51 pm #1501425
laskern: I am not sure that the answer to the electrical outage question is that simple. Although the person didn’t do anything, the water itself (if it totally cooled) is still being cooked on shabbos. I am not sure if it will be then considered like the Chamei Teveryah.March 29, 2018 4:02 pm at 4:02 pm #1501721
The reason you cannot eat is a knas, penalty but if he didn’t do anything wrong, why should he be penalized?March 29, 2018 4:59 pm at 4:59 pm #1501768
ubi, The hot plate is dangerous leaving it on. It needs to be put on a shabbos clock.
The TechYid hotplate is specifically designed to be safe when left on for extended periods. (Obviously it needs to be in a location clear of flammable items, or where it might be touched by children or pets.)March 29, 2018 5:05 pm at 5:05 pm #1501777
No, you are not allowed to unplug a hotplate on Shabbos.
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