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Liran Tamari:
7 firefighters from the Judea and Samaria district who lead a religious lifestyle were not placed on operational shifts at their station after refusing to shave their beards.
(Dec 14 ’21)
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Comment, if it had only been this particular case, one might be arguing the treatment is against beards not against religious people as a whole…
from UK FAQ: you need to be clean shaven around the jawline area for the breathing apparatus to make an effective seal.
NY court apparently overrruled that, so maybe there are devices that allow beards. Maybe someone should sponsor those.
I was wrong, court decision was overturn in June 2021
The Second Circuit Court of Appeals has overturned a lower court decision that concluded that FDNY must allow firefighters with a skin condition an accommodation to have beards. In doing so the court concluded in clear and unambiguous terms… and I quote: “An accommodation is not reasonable within the meaning of the ADA if it is specifically prohibited by a binding safety regulation promulgated by a federal agency.”
Last I checked, Israel doesn’t have to comply with the ADA. It’s a different country.
And we’re probably only hearing half of the story, like usual.There are plenty of jobs to do at a fire, some are interior FFs, some man the pumps etc. All the VFD in Rockland in the frum areas plus the KJVFD and Bloomingburg all have members with beards and to the fire departments in the Amish areas. This is a non issue,
@shalom what the heck does this last response have anything to do with firefighting
common > all have members with beards
So, do they tuck beards into the masks or have special masks? We have here a question of fact, not opinion. You can also call up Afghani Taliban to see how they are doing it now.
@AAQ, They do everything short entering the building, for example venting, pump operation etc
common > They do everything short entering the building
Oh, so it is a real issue. How does it work in those remote Israeli locations? Do they have the luxury of having supporting personnel that can not fulfil the core mission?
Many great rabbis have been clean shaven. Electric razors have been around since 1933.
Being a firefighter is almost the perfect career for someone who wants a Torah lifestsyle. Most of the time you sit and wait for a call, which in NYC might only come once a week. Get paid to learn! And it would be halachically required to stop the learning for a fire call as it is pikuach nefesh!!! Pay and benefits are good, with generous early retirement.
(FWIW I have had a beard since early 1986, which is the last time I have shaved. I keep it very short, though.)
1986? I was so sure you were a decade younger than you probably are.
@charliehall, there are around 1000 frum FFs, almost all are volunteers, frankly on a fireground there is not a drop of difference if your paid or volunteer. majority of the FFs in Monsey, Lawrence and Woodmere are frum and quite a few have beards.
If you are saving people, would it be an issue to shave your beard, even if it gives you an easier fit into the mask? Will then community look down at him or, otherwise, here goes Shmerel who had a beard for 40 years and now had strength to shave it off in order to save those of us who are not careful with lighting candles and using unsafe platas for heilike shabbos?
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