May 1, 2020 3:27 pm at 3:27 pm #1855969akupermaParticipant
They caught him dead to rights. First degree political incorrectness. Not supporting the media line that Trump is the root of all evil.May 1, 2020 7:07 pm at 7:07 pm #1856008
The basis of what they’re investigating is a joke.May 1, 2020 7:45 pm at 7:45 pm #1856018
AKUPERMA -“They caught him dead to rights. First degree political incorrectness. Not supporting the media line that Trump is the root of all evil.”
It’s Not funny. Because his Triple Tx. has probably killled people.
I recommend Zinc + HCQ. BOTH Very safe drugs for a short period of Time!May 1, 2020 7:45 pm at 7:45 pm #1856016mattisyahuParticipant
The details are not clear but the investigation seems to be based on the following series of events:
1. Jerome Corsi who is a “commentor” (e.g. on twitter or other places) sent an e-mail to Zelenko and it said something about Zelenko claiming he had a FDA approved study for his treatment plan.
2. Instead of sending the e-mail to Zelenko it was sent by accident to Zelinsky a federal prosecutor.
3. Zelinsky, looked up on a FDA site for a list of FDA approved studies and did not see any such study approved.
— It should be apparent that the government is tasked with investigating people making false claims regarding medicine. A statement that someone is doing a FDA approved study, when they are not is problematic.
4. Accordingly, Zelinsky the prosecutor, reached out to Corsi’s attorney and requested copies of all communications with Zelenko.
5. Corsi said that Zelenko said he had a FDA approved study to another physician at a training event.
6. Coris said he asked Zelenko about it and he thinks Zelenko meant it was a hospital-panel approved study and did not understand what it meant to have a FDA approved study.
7. Corsi said he is cooperating with the Feds (Zelenko says he has not been contacted by the Feds).
— I don’t think anyone should make a big deal about this investigation. It seems warranted based on the inadvertent e-mail the prosecutor received and assuming Zelenko was not trying to promote a false claim that he had a FDA approved study, little reason to assume that anything will come of this. To say this is about politics is to say that apparently false claims made by people with politics you disagree with should not be investigated ever. If the other communications support that there was no intent here to promote a false claim, this like many other inquiries will be filed away with nothing happening.May 1, 2020 7:45 pm at 7:45 pm #1856013☕️coffee addictParticipant
And for being a religious Jew to bootMay 3, 2020 7:43 am at 7:43 am #1856168
I wonder if the reporter did it on purpose.May 3, 2020 7:47 am at 7:47 am #1856191commonsaychelParticipant
@ coffee addict nothing to do with religion, everything to do this a quack medicationMay 3, 2020 9:03 am at 9:03 am #1856221Old Crown HeightsParticipant
Is the Zelenko Protocol quack medication? He’s not selling anything. Quacks usually push an unproven/ disproven “alternative” remedy. I can find no other studies combining hydroxychloroquine with ZINC. Is he trying to sell copies of his book? Is he insane? Is he lying about his numbers? Does he pre-screen for people who likely would recover anyway? He just combined treatments used in other countries and started people on them earlier. What was the outcome of his 1,200 patients whom he didn’t treat with the three-drug cocktail?May 3, 2020 1:26 pm at 1:26 pm #1856257☕️coffee addictParticipant
Hydrochloquine and azithromycin are FDA approved medication to treat other sicknessesMay 3, 2020 1:26 pm at 1:26 pm #1856275yehudayonaParticipant
Health, AFAIK you’ve never revealed your credentials in the CR. You’ve said you work in the health field, but that could be anything from an HCA on up.May 3, 2020 1:27 pm at 1:27 pm #1856267Avi KParticipant
Zelenko has not published anything. He is simply making unsubstantiated claims.
EditedMay 3, 2020 3:04 pm at 3:04 pm #1856334
“Is the Zelenko Protocol quack medication? ”
“Hydrochloquine and azithromycin are FDA approved medication to treat other sicknesses ”
But not together. There is a specific warning about using them together in the physicians desk reference.May 3, 2020 3:04 pm at 3:04 pm #1856335
If a reporter sends you an e-mail and you do not investigate, you will end up in the news and lose your job.May 3, 2020 3:05 pm at 3:05 pm #1856336
” I can find no other studies combining hydroxychloroquine with ZINC. ”
There is one about to get underway at St. Francis Hospital in Roslyn, Long Island. Go to clinicaltrials dot gov to find the information. It is study NCH04370782.May 3, 2020 3:06 pm at 3:06 pm #1856354Old Crown HeightsParticipant
Adam Rogers has a great article on Wired that gives some clarity into what’s going on.
– There has NOT yet been a clinical trial of Dr. Zelenko’s protocol.
– Dr. Zelenko is to the best of his medical ability treating his patients. He’s not studying a medication.
– The heart trouble came from Brazil where they (recklessly) used MASSIVE DOSES of hydroxychloroquine.
– Waiting until patients are critical to start giving hydroxychloroquine is foolish because obviously it can’t reverse organ failure.
– Taken EARLY zinc has been effectively used to shorten the duration of other coronaviruses such as the common cold.
– The “media” turned on hydroxychloroquine they way they ran stories against masks because of shortages of the meds needed for people with Lupus and rheumatoid arthritis.
– Much of the media wants to stick it to Trump.
– Much of the media finds it in their interests to confuse people (my opinion).
– If the Zelenko Protocol works Corporate Pharma leaves billions on the table (my opinion).May 3, 2020 3:42 pm at 3:42 pm #1856378
Additionally hundreds of hospitals across the United States as well as hundreds of hospitals across the world are now using Dr. Zelenko’s protocol.May 3, 2020 3:43 pm at 3:43 pm #1856377
Charlie: You just contradicted yourself. You called Dr. Zelenko’s protocol “quack medication”. Yet immediately afterwards you admitted that St. Francis Hospital in Roslyn, New York is now conducting a clinical trial of Dr. Zelenko’s protocol.
I’m sure you’ll agree that a major hospital such as St. Francis Hospital would not be testing quack medication.May 3, 2020 5:49 pm at 5:49 pm #1856394
Can you list a source for that? Or just tell us any random five hospitals.May 3, 2020 5:54 pm at 5:54 pm #1856427
Now I’ll talk about why I recommend Zinc!
From my previous post:
“Zn2+ Inhibits Coronavirus and Arterivirus RNA Polymerase Activity In Vitro and Zinc Ionophores Block the Replication of These Viruses in Cell Culture
Aartjan J. W. te Velthuis, Sjoerd H. E. van den Worm, […], and Martijn J. van Heme
… In this study we demonstrate that the combination of Zn2+ and PT at low concentrations (2 µM Zn2+ and 2 µM PT) inhibits the replication of SARS-coronavirus (SARS-CoV) and equine arteritis virus (EAV) in cell culture. The RNA synthesis of these two distantly related nidoviruses is catalyzed by an RNA-dependent RNA polymerase (RdRp), which is the core enzyme of their multiprotein replication and transcription complex (RTC). Using an activity assay for RTCs isolated from cells infected with SARS-CoV or EAV—thus eliminating the need for PT to transport Zn2+ across the plasma membrane—we show that Zn2+ efficiently inhibits the RNA-synthesizing activity of the RTCs of both viruses. Enzymatic studies using recombinant RdRps (SARS-CoV nsp12 and EAV nsp9) purified from E. coli subsequently revealed that Zn2+ directly inhibited the in vitro activity of both nidovirus polymerases. More specifically, Zn2+ was found to block the initiation step of EAV RNA synthesis, whereas in the case of the SARS-CoV RdRp elongation was inhibited and template binding reduced.”May 3, 2020 5:57 pm at 5:57 pm #1856424
From my previous post:
“I recommend Zinc + HCQ. BOTH Very safe drugs for a short period of Time!”
From Science Based Medicine:
Proof that HCQ Works against Covid19.
“One minor side effect of the pandemic is that perhaps more people will learn about what drug research and clinical trials can really be like. Today’s example: we have a clinical trial of hydroxychloroquine from Wuhan that has just published on a preprint server. What’s good is that this one is blinded, randomized, and controlled (like the earlier hydroxychloroquine which one I blogged about here from Zhejiang University, so we can actually talk about it rather than just spend all our time wondering what the heck is going on.
This time there were 31 patients in the treatment group and 31 in the control group. Median age was 44.7 years, male-female ratio almost even. Both groups got standard-of-care (oxygen therapy, antiviral drugs, antibiotics – presumably against suspected bacterial pneumonia – and immunoglobulin, with or without corticosteroids). In addition, the treatment group got 5 days of hydroxychloroquine, 200 mg b.i.d. All were diagnosed with (relatively) mild illness, but all had pneumonia by CT scan. More patients in the treatment group presented with fever and cough as compared to the control group.
After five days of treatment, the treatment group showed significant improvements in comparison to the controls in fever, in cough, and in pneumonia (by CT scan). This is actually the first controlled study to show any benefit for chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine therapy against the coronavirus – it may sound odd to say that, but all the positive reports we have had up to now are anecdotal reports and open-label studies without control groups. The one controlled study we have seen, as mentioned, showed no effect.”May 3, 2020 5:58 pm at 5:58 pm #1856432catch yourselfParticipant
I’m not a physician, and I know nothing about the physicians desk reference.
I do know that when I was hospitalized with covid19, they treated me with hcq and azithromycin. This was in a very well respected hospital outside of the new York area.May 3, 2020 7:57 pm at 7:57 pm #1856476
catch yourself -“I’m not a physician, and I know nothing about the physicians desk reference.”
Don’t Worry – Neither is Charlie!May 3, 2020 8:19 pm at 8:19 pm #1856478
Y.Y. -“Health, AFAIK you’ve never revealed your credentials in the CR. You’ve said you work in the health field, but that could be anything from an HCA on up.”
And I responded to you many times.
I won’t give any more info about myself, unless you’re a paying Customer!May 3, 2020 10:32 pm at 10:32 pm #1856513
To coffee addled: You seem to have an extremely narrow definition of “quack medicine.” Yes, hydroxchloroquine is FDA approved for treatment of malaria, and azithromycin is FDA approved as an anti-biotic, but prescribing them to grow hair or cure COVID-19 is quack medicine, or should I say, just Daffy.May 3, 2020 11:34 pm at 11:34 pm #1856540
huju: Are you implying that St. Francis Hospital’s clinical trial is therefore quack? And that the hospitals across the US prescribing this for COVID patients are utilizing quack medication?May 4, 2020 11:21 am at 11:21 am #1856679
This so-called “investigation” is a complete fraud and scandal, just like the Mueller “investigation” of the Russia hoax that this guy was involved in. The “investigator” is far more likely to face criminal charges than Dr Z is. Now that we have solid proof that the Flynn charges were knowingly false, the whole scandal is going to unravel and there will be FBI agents in prison.
The bottom line is that even if Dr Z had knowingly and deliberately claimed to be running an FDA-approved study, it would not be illegal because it was in a private communication. The government cannot regulate what individuals say to each other in a non-commercial setting. Thus there is no basis for any investigation. Now if he’d advertised such a claim, in some form that could be considered commercial speech, then there would be something to talk about, but that’s not what happened.May 4, 2020 11:24 am at 11:24 am #1856704
To Joseph: A proper, scientific study is not quackery. I don’t know how many hospitals in the US are prescribing and using hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID-19, but the ones who are, and are not part of a study, are Daffy.May 5, 2020 8:40 am at 8:40 am #1857094
The doctor seems okay. The investigator seems straightforward. This journalist is full of bunk. He is the subject of the inquiry.May 6, 2020 9:34 am at 9:34 am #1857608
Promoting unproven therapies and refusing to subject them to rigorous research is quackery.May 6, 2020 9:56 am at 9:56 am #1857633
Zelenko’s only mistake was getting involved with a flake like Corsi. I assume he had not previously heard of him, and didn’t know his reputation. I have known his name for over 30 years, and not in a complimentary context.May 6, 2020 2:54 pm at 2:54 pm #1857794
To Joseph: Where did you get the information that “hundreds” of US and world hospitals are using Dr. Zelenko’s protocol? Did you count them yourself? Did Fox News report it? NewsMax? American Journal of Epidemiology? Belarus Journal of Mishigoss?May 6, 2020 3:52 pm at 3:52 pm #1857826
Huju: The New York Times reported it multiple times. It didn’t call it Dr. Z’s protocol but rather it identified the medication cocktail the large number of hospitals across the US and world were using and stated it was what President Trump was promoting that didn’t yet have medical science proving its effectiveness.May 13, 2020 3:08 pm at 3:08 pm #1860288PekakParticipant
He brought it upon himself by being a social media influencer instead of a doctor. He should stick to practicing medicine and advising his own patients.May 13, 2020 5:39 pm at 5:39 pm #1860338
He rightfully took it public in order to share the life saving measures he’s using so the public could be aware of its availability.May 13, 2020 7:37 pm at 7:37 pm #1860452
You make it sound like he posted to the coffee room.May 14, 2020 1:14 am at 1:14 am #1860566Doing my bestParticipant
This is funny. He’s not being investigated for using the treatment. Just for claiming it was tested in an FDA approved study, which it wasn’t. So you don’t have to cry anti-trumpism. And the investigation didn’t even start because he was in the news, just because of a wrong email address accident.
And it doesn’t seem like a serious investigation, so you don’t have to panic.May 14, 2020 11:28 am at 11:28 am #1860669GadolhadorahParticipant
Perhaps the best contrarian indicator of the likely efficacy of the Zelenko Cocktail is that the Fox News evening lineup of Trumpkopf sycophants have dropped their nightly drumbeat for this drug and shifted to a combination of anti-Fauci rhetoric and “ObamaGate”. But not to worry for our tin foil kippa types. The Fox News Wannabe Network (aka One America News) still has their nightly infomercials for hydroxychloroquine with doctors they find in yennavelt who also claim 100 percent cure rates. Some promote 800 numbers, website hyping their special formulation of the drug and if you are among the first 100 callers, you will get “FREE ZINC” with your order.May 14, 2020 2:09 pm at 2:09 pm #1860724
GH -“Fox News evening lineup …. shifted to a combination of anti-Fauci rhetoric and “ObamaGate.”
That’s fine. The main thing us Conservatives should Focus on is Biden’s Abuse of Tara Reade!
The Demoncrats Hypocrisy is Extremely Scary.
They believe a DRUNK Woman when it comes to a Conservative US Supreme Court nominee, but Not a
Sober Young Woman that worked in Biden’s Senate Office!May 14, 2020 7:27 pm at 7:27 pm #1860849
From a conservative viewpoint, why would one care about someone else’s personal life?
P. S. It is an interesting read how this thread went upside down.May 15, 2020 8:24 am at 8:24 am #1860964
n0mesorah -“Dear Health,
From a conservative viewpoint, why would one care about someone else’s personal life?”
So tell me – why did the Demoncrats decide that a Supreme Court Justice has to be on the Up & Up?
And then a Senator from Delaware can do what he wants – whenever he feels like it?!?May 15, 2020 1:08 pm at 1:08 pm #1860999
Who cares what they do? Welcome to genuine conservatism.
OOOPS! There is no one left to invite you. All the conservatives have joined the liberals, in assessing viewpoints of other people’s outlook. A true conservative sticks his own view to his own outlook. And he sticks it to himself.May 15, 2020 1:46 pm at 1:46 pm #1861047
nOmesorah -“true conservative sticks his own view to his own outlook. And he sticks it to himself.”
So what? Did you ever hear – you fight Fire with Fire?!?
The libs will do anything & everything to make Republicans look Bad.
This is why we Conservatives have to point out the Liberal HYPOCRISES!May 15, 2020 2:28 pm at 2:28 pm #1861057
Please tell me where this comes from. Very few conservative thinkers write about these topics. (Why? Maybe because they are true conservatives? It is a vexing question!) If you are a liberal, than universalism is at or near the center of your worldview. Therefore, liberals are always getting caught up in what others are practicing or preaching. Hence, The common hypocrisy. For a conservative, universalism is peripheral or non-existent. There is no automatic reason to fight anyone else’s worldview. I do not mean to call you a liberal, but why is any of this important to you.May 17, 2020 12:29 am at 12:29 am #1861307
From a conservative viewpoint, why would one care about someone else’s personal life?
Nobody cares about Biden’s personal life. Ms Reade’s accusations are not about his personal life.
Nor is the fact that right up until he was the accused, he took the position that all accusers must be believed without question, and anyone accused must be ruined. He supported the kangaroo courts with which colleges destroy the lives of so many male students. He supported the utterly baseless accusations against Justice Thomas, and then years later against Justice Kavanaugh. So it’s not a matter of his personal life that when his turn has come around he and the entire Democrat Party have changed their standards. The innocent blood he has spilled in the name of believing all accusers is now crying out for justice.May 17, 2020 10:20 am at 10:20 am #1861376
That is an extremely liberal interpretation of justice.May 17, 2020 11:13 am at 11:13 am #1861447
No, it is not. It is called holding him to his own standards. Having enthusiastically supported the ruin of many people based on those standards he is morally estopped from mounting a defense that is contrary to them. He has made his bed, and now he must lie in it.
It’s also one of Saul Alinksy’s better rules: Hold them to their own rules.May 17, 2020 11:14 am at 11:14 am #1861451
Perhaps the best contrarian indicator of the likely efficacy of the Zelenko Cocktail is that the Fox News evening lineup of Trumpkopf sycophants have dropped their nightly drumbeat for this drug
Um, no. They’ve stopped talking about it only because it’s no longer news. It’s now commonly accepted wisdom so there’s not much to talk about.May 17, 2020 11:47 am at 11:47 am #1861470
nOmesorah -“There is no automatic reason to fight anyone else’s worldview.”
This is Not philosophy class. We must stand up to these Libs, otherwise, which is already done, they Force their ways upon us with Laws!
What exactly that you don’t understand?May 17, 2020 9:30 pm at 9:30 pm #1861660
I have no idea what you could be referencing. You seem to be a liberal, just not like those liberals. You can stand up to whomever you like, I am just drinking coffee.May 17, 2020 10:00 pm at 10:00 pm #1861671
My mistake. Make that poetic justice. If I had the genius of our President, that first comment would be sarcasm. Alas, forgive my grotesque blunder. But, I still have no reason to hold him to any standard. He could hold himself to his own standard.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.