April 22, 2011 5:15 pm at 5:15 pm #596426shlishiMember
So, all you engaged and married folks… you went through the parsha and…? Did you get your dream Chosson or Kallah… or did you settle?April 22, 2011 5:39 pm at 5:39 pm #761988Pashuteh YidMember
Sometimes you get your dream chosson or kallah that you had set your hopes on for a long time, but the bigger question is does the marriage turn out to be such a dream, as well?April 22, 2011 5:55 pm at 5:55 pm #761989bptParticipant
I really had my heart set on someone of so-so looks, but try as I might, could not find one, so I had no choice but to settle for the very best. Till this day, I wonder if I made the right choice.
(Shlishi – this is parody, right? ’cause if you’re serious, you have a huge issue to deal with, and I pity you / your spouse)April 22, 2011 6:00 pm at 6:00 pm #761990WolfishMusingsParticipant
FWIW, I got my dream Kallah… and she still is to this day.
The WolfApril 22, 2011 6:44 pm at 6:44 pm #761991
Great point Pashuteh Yid. Sometimes people can get so caught up in the hype that they forget that a successful marriage takes work. Hard work.
Just read an article about a kallah who got engaged after many years, due to a rabbi revealing the name of her (then future) chosson and the shadchan. The way it was written got me scared that the kallah was forgetting that after she’ll be married, she must still remember to work on her marriage and not rely on the magic that produced brought the shidduch about, at that stage.April 22, 2011 7:15 pm at 7:15 pm #761992popa_bar_abbaParticipant
I just set my standards really high, so that I could “settle” for my dream.April 22, 2011 7:52 pm at 7:52 pm #761993RABBAIMParticipant
I waited for 4 years looking for the dream person, but then woke up and realized the dream person would be a nightmare. I took out some time,introspecion…. reflection…….. questioning…… counseling with friends and my Rebbi and reevaluated to determine what do I NEED instead of what do I WANT and the n i met the right one BIG TIME!! The relationship surpasses anything I ever cold have dreamt. Align self with Ratzon Hashem and escalating meaningful happiness will ensue.
Hatzlacha!April 22, 2011 8:12 pm at 8:12 pm #761994GumBallMember
one Thing I coild say is that my engaged Brother really got his dream kallah and my furure sister in law also got her dream chosson!! 🙂April 22, 2011 8:45 pm at 8:45 pm #761995shlishiMember
So far it appears all respondents did not settle until they got their dream spouse. Perhaps this should be a lesson to all in shidduchim to never settle, as we see none of the married people did.April 24, 2011 2:38 am at 2:38 am #761996thecommissionerParticipant
In response to “Shlishi”,
The “dream girl” does not exist. The whole idea of a “dream girl” is one put out by Hollywood to make movies sell. Take the concept of a dream girl. Basically in your head, you decide exactly how the girl is going to look, talk, walk, and eat. This is what we in the medical field call hallucination. It is impossible, except for a prophet (the ones on the Q train don’t count) to know what type of girl your going to find.
I find it very sad and unfortunate, that so many older boys and girls are still looking for their “fantasy girl/boy”. If only they would open their eyes and realize that this phenomenon doesn’t exist, we may all see more simchas.
P.S. When I was dating I also had a dream girl in mind, when my wife came around, all ideas of a dream girl went out the window. My wife surpassed any dream I could possibly have had of a girl. I just hope that all those singles reading this won’t miss the opportunity of a life time, and push off a “dream guy/girl” for their “fantasy” one.April 24, 2011 2:52 am at 2:52 am #761997ShrekMember
I dated for 4 years and didn’t settle. but even marriage to the “perfect match” has been difficult at times, with ups and downs.April 24, 2011 4:10 am at 4:10 am #761998
For all of the ladies that have settled. Please, please do not complain to me about your husbands. I do not care. You chose him. Not I. You knew when you married him HE was not THE one. The peer, family, ticking clock pressures got to you. I don’t want to hear your complaints. Again, I do not care.
If your husband isn’t capable of watching your kids when you are not home — hire a sitter or if possible have one of the grandparents come help.
If he treats you like a rag…. Your fault. You didn’t set boundaries from day one.
If he doesn’t lift a finger to help in the house….. Your fault. You didn’t set boundaries from day one.
If he talks to you in a disrespectful way…. Your fault. You didn’t set boundaries from the day one.
You got what you wanted. Now deal with it!!!April 24, 2011 4:18 am at 4:18 am #761999chayav inish livisumayParticipant
bpt dont let ur wife see that post!!!!!
i think everyone shud be realistic although u cud set ur goals higher but in reality ur goals arent usually gonna be met in every expectationApril 24, 2011 4:41 am at 4:41 am #762000boredinofficeParticipant
The dating system and real life do not equal each other. The dream spouse does not exist because life is not a dream and you dont choose the battles that are thrown your way. Dating does not test what to do when a spouse is ill, has trouble having kids, financial issues, and the myriads of other REAL life problems that people have. The dream spouse should be someone that shares your ideals and valuesApril 24, 2011 2:02 pm at 2:02 pm #762001
157, I could hardly believe what I was reading.
One of the J signs is rachmanim bnei rachmanim, so your constant refrain when encountering Yiddishe nishamos in pain is “I do not care” is disturbing. Perhaps you are really from the Waltons and not the Goldbergs.
Secondly, you seem to put no blame on the person who is acting improperly. Why is that?
Thirdly, a person who mistreats a spouse to such an extent is most unlikely to adhere to boundaries being set.
Fourthly, the “gentleman” in question was unlikely to behave in such a manner during dating. No doubt he was probably charming. SO the lady chose him as he presented himself, not as he actually was…so no, she didn’t get what she wanted. NO ONE wants that, no matter how desperate you seem to think a woman would be…
Sorry to see you have had unhealthy experiences in life.
I sincerely hope it gets better.April 24, 2011 8:58 pm at 8:58 pm #762002
@am yisrael chai: Thank you so much for responding to my post.
I understand your concern when I wrote “I do not care”. What I really mean is: I can’t help these woman who settled. If they are not happy, they should seek counseling and I really don’t care. If they are not happy, let them get out of their situations.
Funny you should mention the Goldbergs, since like most Jewish families I have relatives with the surname Goldberg. Actually, I grew up on a street with the name Walton, hence Walton157.
You are right. It seems as if I don’t put the blame on the person who is acting improperly. But I have seen my friends in terrible situations and they THEMSELVES said that they didn’t put a stop to that kind of behavior from the beginning. So, it’s not as if I don’t know what I’m talking about.
Also, some of my married friends have said to me: “I thought when we got married he would change”. No. Doesn’t happen like this.
Sorry to see you have had unhealthy experiences in life. I sincerely hope it gets better.
What in my original post suggests that I have had unhealthy experiences in life? You are assuming things that aren’t true. These women who settled have had unhealthy experiences in their lives. Not me. Please explain how you came to this conclusion.April 24, 2011 9:17 pm at 9:17 pm #762003Dovid HaMelechMember
Walton: If a guy “settled” (whatever that means) on a woman, and he is now unhappy, getting out more times than not will make him (and her) happier. Study after study has so indicated. For example, a study by University of Chicago sociologist Linda Waite found no evidence that unhappily married adults who divorced were typically any happier than unhappily married people who stayed married. Even more dramatically, the researchers also found that two-thirds of unhappily married spouses who stayed married reported that their marriages were happy five years later. In addition, the most unhappy marriages reported the most dramatic turnarounds: among those who rated their marriages as very unhappy, almost eight out of 10 who avoided divorce were happily married five years later. Children were far unhappier after divorce.April 24, 2011 9:56 pm at 9:56 pm #762004
Dovid HaMelach: You are right about the children of divorce. Terrible.They are truly the innocent victims.
The couples that work on their marriages are mature enough to work things out for themselves and their children. That is fantastic.
If I may suggest, how about the man/woman who gets married but have that “gut” feeling it’s not the right choice but go a head because of all the pressures from family, friends and community?
I look forward to reading your response (if the mods allow my post).April 24, 2011 10:09 pm at 10:09 pm #762005Dovid HaMelechMember
The children were almost a side point, in my above post. I was talking about the happiness of the couple.April 27, 2011 5:12 am at 5:12 am #762006pascha bchochmaParticipant
While I don’t have a “dream Chosson”, I don’t plan to ‘settle’ either – that’s not a formula to admiring your husband and being a happy wife. BH, I know what is really important to me and am sure that, IYH, the rest will settle itself.April 27, 2011 3:57 pm at 3:57 pm #762007PeerimsameachParticipant
bh got engaged right before pesach nd its nt abt dream girl but its abt compatibility nd love comes after marrige so no worries!!April 27, 2011 7:24 pm at 7:24 pm #762008
-1. There’s a HUGE difference between “I really don’t care” and “I can’t help these women who settled.” I’m wondering how one can so easily interchange the two.
(Have you ever asked Hashem to help when seeing a Hatzala ambulance racing by with wailing sirens? Or is it “I really don’t care.”)
-2. Once again there is the refrain of “..these women who settled” as if this issue has not been addressed. So I’ll repeat:
“…the “gentleman” in question was unlikely to behave in such a manner during dating. No doubt he was probably charming. SO the lady chose him as he presented himself, not as he actually was…so no, she didn’t get what she wanted. NO ONE wants that, no matter how desperate you seem to think a woman would be…”
The woman did NOT settle. As one typically gets to know a partner more fully only after marriage, that is when she realizes she got more than she bargained for. BTW, this scenario can happen the other way around, too.
-3. The blame for abusive treatment of a spouse lies squarely on the one doing the mistreatment. It’s as simple as that. Such poor behavior can rarely be stopped unless there’s serious intervention. So tell your friends they can stop blaming themselves.
-4. As you know, one cannot get married under the assumption that the partner will change. Assume the partner will not.April 27, 2011 7:38 pm at 7:38 pm #762009
@am yisrael chai: As I wrote in a previous post, SOME of my friends KNEW what they were getting into and chose to marry their husbands anyway. I’m not talking when the guy is Prince Charming BEFORE the wedding and after he turns out to be a real piece of work.
That said, Knowing what you are getting yourself into and C’V having to call Hatzalah are 2 different issues. Noone wants to get sick or have a medical emergency. The medical emergency is NOT the person’s fault. If the woman knows what she is getting into and makes the decision to marry her husband, then she has to step up to the plate and figure something out. Complaining to me is not going to help. I have no control over the situation and like I wrote previously, how many years can you keep hearing the same complaints about your friend’s (s’) husbands before losing your patience.
If he was verbally abusive before the marriage, he will continue after. That is what I’m saying. You are right, the abused are NOT to be blamed. But, if going into the marriage and the woman sees that the man is abusive, usually just verbally, because he can’t hit her yet, because they aren’t married (negiah) then it it most likely he will NOT change and continue in his ways.
Oh, I have an idea. Next time they complain about the same thing, I will send them to you!!!!
I think we agree/are on the same page, but coming from different directions? Do you agree?April 27, 2011 9:31 pm at 9:31 pm #762010bptParticipant
“…never settle, as we see none of the married people did. “
No, Shlishi. What we did was get 85% of what we wanted, and worked towards the other 15.April 28, 2011 2:00 am at 2:00 am #762011
Perhaps I was not clear. The correlation I was attempting to make regarding the ambulance was YOUR REACTION: would it be “I REALLY DON’T CARE” or would it be “I can’t help.”
Sometimes people just need to be heard along with some empathy, and that’s all the help they want. They are not asking you to fix the situation.April 28, 2011 2:37 am at 2:37 am #762012Shuki_BaroiMember
the way i see it, is that if you set your standards really low, then you’ll be happy with whatever you get and live a long happy life.April 28, 2011 4:27 am at 4:27 am #762013
(I would still assume that hope is not lost. There is such a thing as a zivug sheini, as well as teshuvah. If is someone is shaken by this, they should pursue the book and get berochos, but not dare give up. Just my two cents.)April 28, 2011 3:06 pm at 3:06 pm #762014Yellow_EsrogParticipant
I think many people may be missing the point…
Getting married affects much of a person’s life on this world.
For these types of things we are better off leaving it all in the hand of He who knows who is best for us.
Many people do excessive inquires (read: investigations) come with lists, images in their minds and the feeling that THEY will find the one that they are looking for…
But that is the best way to find the wrong one.
If a person tells Hashem “I can handle this one alone, I know what I’m looking for and I’ll find it”
Hashem says “Have it your way” and allows one to be misled by his own senses possibly marrying the one that was not destined for him (Together with the consequences that accompany such a situation)
The right one is already lined up, we just have to allow Hashem to guide us to Him or Her.April 28, 2011 3:34 pm at 3:34 pm #762015
Yellow: Hishtadlus is still a chov. One must investigate properly, but as you mention, know and remember that He is the only One who can guide us. All others can be His meesangers.
I’m assuming we are in agreementApril 6, 2017 7:48 pm at 7:48 pm #1252391zaltzvasserParticipant
*bump*April 6, 2017 9:02 pm at 9:02 pm #1252469
I sure hope that my chosson doesn’t think he’s settling by marrying and that he considers me his “dream Kallah”, and I hope I don’t feel that I’m settling by marrying him and that I consider him my “dream chosson”.
My favorite line about shidduchim comes from a shiur I heard online from Rav Yitzchak Berkowitz. He said, “You are not allowed to settle; if anyone tells you to settle, tell them to go somewhere!”
Perhaps what people mean when they talk about settling is realizing that certain things aren’t essential and that your kallah/chosson is a wonderful dream chosson/kallah without those things. But I wouldn’t call that settling.April 6, 2017 11:04 pm at 11:04 pm #1252533zaltzvasserParticipant
I think that was a very intelligent and thought out answer. +1April 7, 2017 9:15 am at 9:15 am #1252630
Thanks so much!!April 9, 2017 8:09 am at 8:09 am #1252948lesschumrasParticipant
Old joke: for years bochur searched for perfect kallah and finally found her. There was unfortunately no shidduch as she was looking for the perfect chossonApril 9, 2017 12:22 pm at 12:22 pm #1253205
lesschumras – cute!
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