Emunah based on falsehood

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    Undermining people’s emunah is obviously a terrible thing. Which is why I feel funny about the following, say Emunah is based on something false. You meet a friend of yours who says he became frum because, I dont know the passuk/Gemara says that on May 27 15 the stock market will crash and amazing the stock market crashed!

    Is it wrong to point out that 1) there is no such passuk/Gemara and 2) The stock market didnt crash?

    On the one hand this fellow’s emunah would likely be undermined which would be terrible, but on the other hand is that real emunah- IF it is all built on misrepresentations? Furthermore one can argue that he is bound to find out anyway So perhaps finding out in a gentle way from a frum person is better. Then again someone so simple that would accept the above may never find out.

    What do you all think?

    In case it isn’t obvious I am thinking specifically of “Torah Codes” Over Yom Tov I had a conversation with a friend pointing out how absurd Torah codes are. Now this wasn’t a foundation of this guy’s emunah so my above conundrum didn’t apply.But what if it had been? There are some “Kiruv professionals” Who use “Torah Codes” as their main arguments and they are sometimes successful


    If your emunah is based on something as silly as the “Bible Codes,” then you need to do some serious study of Judaism.

    The Wolf


    My advice would be to not tell your friend that his basis for emunah is false, but instead to try to help him grasp onto a more solid basis for his emunah. Sooner or later he will figure out on his own that his basis for emunah is not reliable, but it will be much better for him if he already has something else to hold onto when that time comes. To tell your friend now before he has a more solid basis for emunah would be like to take the jack out from under the car before you replace the tire.


    Also, although the Torah codes might be phony, I would not assume they are phony based on a conversation you had with a friend unless he is an accomlished mathematician who spent a lot of time researching the subject. But I agree they should not be used as a basis for emunah, since their truth is at least uncertain.



    To be clear: this isnt lemaaseh my friend is a regular frum guy, who happned to like “Torah codes” I’m not talking about anyone i actually know.

    You dont need a lot of time debunking Torah codes nor do you need to be a mathematician.

    This is where my conundrum comes up. I’d love to go into detail. But wouldnt want to shake anybody’s emunah.


    In that case I think you would need to make a judgment based on your knowledge of your friend, whether he is already strong in emunah and would appreciate hearing the emes even if it bursts his bubble, in which case it might be good to tell him.

    Otherwise I would leave it alone because even though its a good midda to seek the emes, it’s not an aveira to believe in something that is not true but also not against Torah hashkafa, so I’m not sure it is worth causing him tzaar or risk shaking his emuna before he’s ready for it.


    In my experience, those whose Emunah is based on stupidities are generally steadfast and refuse to accept reality when it conflicts with what they think they believe.


    True Sam2

    Thats why it intrigues me, where other people might say whats the point of arguing I find it fascinating when people with silly beliefs not only refuse to accept reality, but become more entrenched in their silliness.

    Many of my arguments on this very site remind me of those


    If emunah is based on falsehood, it is false emunah.

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