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Question for women or men. I am on the 4th date of a shidduch and think it would be nice to have flowers delivered to her house before Shabbos. Is that breaking boundaries or would it be taken positively?
FYI, the type of person is in between yeshivish and modern.
TIA.
vod2117 – 4th date is TOO early. try the 12th date.
I agree with Sparkly on this, more or less. Actually, I think you should wait for flowers until after you are engaged.
If the young lady lives in her parents home, don’t send flowers before Shabbos unless you are planning to visit the home at some point that Shabbos.
If you are not invited for a meal, but to stop by for tea and visit, or pick the young lady up for a Shabbos walk then sending the flowers to the house is appropriate, just make sure the card wishes the entire family a Gut Shabbos, not a card just addressed to the young lady.
If she lives on her own or with female roommates, don’t send flowers. It will be taken as a sign you are committed and an engagement is imminent.
lilmod ulelamaid – thats what i was also thinking i guess i was being a bit generous.
CTLAWYER – i agree. but also i dont like getting gifts from guys. its not tznius.
“i agree. but also i dont like getting gifts from guys. its not tznius.”
So in other words, you don’t agree
Meno – dont agree with?
Sparkly,
You just said you agree with CTLAWYER, but you also said it’s not tznius for the guy to give gifts. So you don’t agree with CTLAWYER.
dont give flowers is my point since its NOT tznius.
Right, so you don’t agree. Don’t say you agree with someone if you don’t
My wife and I began dating in August, 1989. After 4 or 5 weeks, it was Rosh Hashana time, so I had flowers sent to her home. (She lived with 3 other girls in Flatbush at the time.) She was very appreciative, and called me right after R”H ended to thank me.
We got engaged on Thanksgiving of that year, so I arranged to have flowers delivered to her on the following Monday at her office. She was quite surprised and excited, and she had to tell everyone why I had sent them.
Of course, we were not yeshivish then (nor are we now), so the rules may be different. Are the rules really that rigid about something as simple as flowers?
Don’t give flowers before you get engaged, because you’re gonna have to give flowers at the actual engagement, and if you’ve already given her flowers before, you will have to give her a bigger bouquet at the engagement. Don’t set the bar too high too early
Sparkly: “lilmod ulelamaid – thats what i was also thinking i guess i was being a bit generous.”
Then again, a lot of people are engaged way before the 12th date, so they can give flowers earlier. But even if someone has been going out for a few months, if they are not engaged yet, I’m not sure if it’s appropriate to give flowers. Others gifts are probably okay if it’s at a point that you are both very serious about each other.
The problem is that it might be a little weird if he gives her a gift and they end up breaking up. A friend of mine had a shelf full of stuffed animals given to her by guys she had gone out with.
I have gone out with guys who gave me sefarim they had written on the first date. Since it was a first date, and they were the authors, it didn’t “mean” anything. In one case, I was really curious to read the Sefer because he told me that it had been put in cherem. On the second date, I told him why I thought it had been put in cheirem. I don’t think he was too happy with my comment. But then I told him about the parts that I liked, so he was happy.
Takamamash: I don’t know anything about rules. I’m not so Yeshivish sociologically speaking (even though I am hashkafically) and a lot of my dating has been with guys who were more Yeshivish YU/Modern Orthodox Machmir types. I wasn’t talking about rules so much as comfort level. I think I would be uncomfortable if a guy gave me flowers before we were engaged. I feel like a guy giving a girl flowers is very meaningful and should only be done after engagement.
BUT, I really am not qualified to say much on the topic since I never went out with anyone at all seriously, so I never went out with anyone whom I would have wanted flowers from. So I can’t really say till it happens, BEH.
Meno – lol. That’s why they say that wives should make sure to let their husbands help with the housework when they first get married.
LU,
That’s funny, they tell the husbands not to do too much housework when they first get married.
(I’m just kidding)
Meno – my husband can do whatever he wants.
lilmod ulelamaid -if a guy gave me a book put in cherem written by him on a first date he probably wouldnt be expecting a second date.
Sparkly,
If I were him, I’d get that in writing.
(I hope my wife doesn’t read this stuff. I’m giving away all my secrets)
Sparkly -“Meno – my husband can do whatever he wants”
I like that!
LU -“even though I am hashkafically) and a lot of my dating has been with guys who were more Yeshivish YU/Modern Orthodox Machmir types.”
That’s because there are Not a lot of Yeshishe guys that are older!
I myself consider that I’m Yeshivish, but your post’s sound Frummer than mine!
The problem is that it might be a little weird if he gives her a gift and they end up breaking up.
Why is that weird? It happens the world over, every day.
A friend of mine had a shelf full of stuffed animals given to her by guys she had gone out with
Obviously she saw value in keeping them. However, she was certainly under no obligation to do so and if she wanted to get rid of them, she could have simply thrown them out, donated them, etc.
The Wolf
Meno – so if i didnt say that to him which i probably will then i would control him and he would want a divorce chasvichalilla. but of course there are some exceptions to this like i dont want a guy who smokes but thats reasonable. its reasonable for him to want to watch TV, go out to movies, and listen to not jewish music so i wont stop him. its reasonable for him to wear jeans even tho my husband probably wont but i wouldnt stop him if he did.
Personally, I find this type of question troubling.
We’ve already set up so many roadblocks to possible matches (by making it practically impossible for couples to meet on their own) and then compounded it by ritualizing the process so much (on this date you have to wear this, this is only appropriate from date X and onward, you can only discuss this on such and such date, etc.) that there is practically no room for individuality and personal expression.
The Wolf
WolfishMusings – theres LOTS of places even at shuls where you can meet the other gender. go to my rabbi shiur. there a BUNCH of people made their own shidduch. its a mixed shiur with people in their young 20.
WolfishMusings – theres LOTS of places even at shuls where you can meet the other gender. go to my rabbi shiur. there a BUNCH of people made their own shidduch. its a mixed shiur with people in their young 20.
Yes, I know. I was really referring to places and communities where such things are not done.
The Wolf
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